driving skill testing!

[Den]

Does anyone here know how to shift without using clutch?

what is the correct way to do double clutch?

let's make a discussion

[NOTSOFAST]

A friend of mine used to do that. Now he's riding his sisters' bike cuz he missed it once. I wouldn't reccomend shifting like that, I think they put the clutch for a reason in there, unless u really hate ur car .

[wedge]

Originally posted by NOTSOFAST
A friend of mine used to do that. Now he's riding his sisters' bike cuz he missed it once. I wouldn't reccomend shifting like that, I think they put the clutch for a reason in there, unless u really hate ur car .

Naw, as long as you get it PERFECT everytime, it shouldn't hurt anything. In fact, it might even be good for the car
The way to shift without the clutch is to get the revs matched perfectly. And by doing so, not only do you save the clutch, but it's easier on the engine and the drivetrain.
Think about it, when you (or anyone) first learned to drive stick, you'd always be either bunny-hopping or stalling or squealing or griding, or whatever. That's all because of either too much, or too little gas being applied (ie. incorrect revs). All that kickback that happens then is obviously very bad for the car.
In order to shift without the clutch, you have to be very smooth with the revving and the shifting. So smooth in fact that the car won't even notice that the shift happened at all. Once you learn to get it right, it starts to become easy and it feels very cool in your hand when done right. Of course, I've never tried it in MY OWN car. I won't try that until I at least own a second car to drive (just in case).

[wunderboy]

The right way to double-clutch is to not double clutch. This method is used for older syncro-mesh tranny's, mainly in big trucks and rig's etc... This is a common "fast and the furious" myth... rev matching and shifting without a clutch is ok, I used to do it in my prelude... the rev match was around 4200rpm.

[Den]

My friend taught me to do it a while ago, but I have no time to try it. I was quite busy with school work. Suddenly yesterday, I am so interested to try it, and I made it~ Of cox, failed a few times before I got, I can't do it for every gear, but 2 to 3 and 3 to 4~

the rev for my car is around 2400rpm

is very cool if you do it right, so smooth

I am posing this here, because I want to share the experience and how could you get the perfect rpm?
: )

[rezzle]

If you have an older tranny where the synchro's are not working so good double clutching helps. .. you do this ...

Drive to shifting speed in gear engage clutch, shift to neutral, release clutch, engage clutch shift to higher gear release clutch.

The idea is that when you shift to neutral and release the clutch all the gears are spun up to a matching rpm.


I had an 76 Alfetta that was totally beat (mostly by me) and by the time I got rid of it I almost had to do that betwen first and second.

Don't shift without the clutch.

[boroEF]

clutchless shifting:

observe how much ur revs drop with every shift ie: 1-2, 2-3, 4-5.

now remembering how much they drop... drive normally...and have the revs drop when u want to upshift.

for downshifting just keep the gas steady and the shifter can move down a gear....

i can do clutchless downshifting without a single problem...as for upshifting...eh....someone try that

[Den]

boroEF
nice~

Can you explain it more detaily~

so rev should I look for?

[Naito]

the rev for my car is around 2400rpm

the rev match was around 4200rpm

what the HELL are you two talking about?? the rev match for each gear is different, and it depends at what speed u're going when you shift!

Rezzle and Wedge have the right idea.

As Wedge said, shifting without clutch when done PERFECTLY is not bad for your car, possibly GOOD. Extra emphasis on PERFECTLY must be made however. What u're doing is trying to match the speed that the engine is spinning at with the speed the wheels are spinning at in whatever particular gear u're shifting into.
That means if you ever shift normally and your car lurches, or if you ever have to feather the clutch, u'll screw up a clutch-less shift completely and prolly blow your gearbox.

Double-clutching is in my mind a baby brother to heel-tow shifting. By double clutching you match your engine speed to the wheel speed, allowing you to release the clutch smoothly into the next gear without lurching the car. It also helps you shift if your transmission's synchros are going. Read what Rezzle wrote carefully and practice the motion with the car off first.....then when you drive and shift gears, take notice of how much difference there is in RPMs between two gears, that's how much u'll have to blip the throttle when you shift between those gears.

[boroEF]

Originally posted by Den
boroEF
nice~

Can you explain it more detaily~

so rev should I look for?

say u are in 3rd gear at 4000rpm...keep the gas constant so u are at 4000rpm. then downshift into 2nd. it'll work smoothly. if not, then give it a little more gas when ur trying to move the shifter...it'll go without grinding

[TRDragoon]

hehe the only time i heard of double clutching when upshifting is when your synchro is gone!:p

[rezzle]

If you do it all the time double clutching does save the synchro, especially when banging from redline to redline and heel toeing on the downshift coming into corners when dropping a couple of gears. Double clutching also reduces the possibility of screwing up 'blowing' a shift.

Remember true race transmissions are a completely different beast than regular street trannies. On the pro. rally circuit for example nearly all the manufacturers, but Subaru, use a style of transmission on their cars similar to that of a motorbike engine yes shifting time is reduced but they are rebuilt between races. A pro rally Subaru transmission one of the only ones that has the standard H configuration costs in the neighbourhood of 25,000 US alone and is operated by hydraulics, its own computer and who knows how many other secret components. So trying to make your street car "shift like the pro's" could prove to be a very expensive experiment.

[boroEF]

Originally posted by TRDragoon
hehe the only time i heard of double clutching when upshifting is when your synchro is gone!:p

me too let's just double clutch everygear so we can increase our 1/4 mile times by 1.5 sec

[Den]

I get it now~
thx everyone~
: )

i guess double clutch is better and more reliable~

[rezzle]

I forgot to add that when I used to hang out at the track (10 or so years ago ) the Formula Atlantic cars had no synchros but the gear ratio and flywheel sizes were such that the rpm's matched perfectly when double clutching from gear to gear without having to worry about the throttle except when woming into corners. The clutch throw was also extremely short making them shift nearly as fast as a bike with the double clutch. Heh and the shifter was on the left hand side.