Brake line headache - recomendations, advice?

[CarLuvrSD]

Ok, admitedly, I have limited experience working with brake lines. When the flexible brake line on my ES 300 began leaking I thought, Oh, no problem, they just screw right off and right on. Oh, if it were that easy.
Where the hard brake line meets the flexible line there is a nut that goes down around the flared end of the hard brake line. This screws into the threaded female fitting on the end of my new flexible hose. The problem is, that little threaded sleave nut (I Don't know the technical name for them) appears to be too flared out at the bottom to slide down inside the threaded fitting on my new hose. I also had a hard time getting it to unscrew from the old one. After an hour or two of trying to get the thing to go together, I decided to take a look at the old part, where I had such a hard time getting it to unsrew out of. The threads were basically mangled. Not the threads on the sleave nut thingy but the female fitting on the old hose. The lowest part of that nut is flared out to the point it sticks out further than the threads do. They just wont go together.

I've tried everthing I can think of short of cutting the rigid brake line to put on a new sleave nut thingy. I Googled a bit this afternoon (after I took a few Ibuprofen for my headache) and came across a website that talked about using compression fittings to splice the pieces back together. I can't find any of them, though. Autozone doesn't even know what I'm talking about.

I think the above is a good solution because I can cut the old line with a fine hacksaw blade and splice it back together with a new nut on it. There isn't enough room to maneuver a cutting tool or end flarer. I Looked at what it would take to put in a whole new rigid brake line and it looks like it would be a monumental task, so I don't want to do that.

So where do I find these compression fittings? Can you give me any advice? Point me in the right direction? Steal my car for me? All help will be appreciated.

[Jzs147-RR]

I think any good car parts should have them they are around 2-4$ depending where you pick them up. http://www.pitstopusa.com/ has some check them out not sure what they charge.



here is a pic

[wunderboy]

Compression fittings, although usefull, are not recomended, in fact I think Illegal for break lines. Break line systems are under great pressure, and therefore a compression fitting can in fact pop loose.. and cause break failure. DANGEROUS.

I recomend cutting off the old fitting, and reflaring the line with a new nut. Make sure you use the correct flare, as there are different types. If your even the least bit unclear, or not confident in your skills, have a shop do it.

also... use a small pipe cutter to cut the line. a hack saw, or cutters could crimp the line, making flaring very difficult.

[Jzs147-RR]

Very true on gas lines its ok but brake lines its not recomended.I would use these to get the car to a garage that will just replace the whole line.

[CarLuvrSD]

Ok, well I certainly don't want to do anything unsafe. Tom's VW tech page is where I saw the thing about the compression fittings. He says they are rated to 3000 PSI. I do realise that if they are not done properly that they can come apart or leak.
I am going to try the file idea first. We aren't talking about taking off all that much material to make it fit. I just have to do it ever so gingerly so as not to file the threads. Then I will be working with my factory flared end, so no safety issue. If that doesn't work, I will look into borrowing an end falring tool. There is enough play to take off a small amount and still use the old line.

Working on this car is a real bear. The huge intake manifold/runners make doing anything behind the engine very difficult. Even when accessing from underneath there is limited room to work because of the sub-frame. I'm going to sell this car soon. It has been nothing but trouble for the last 4 years as one thing after another has failed. When everything works I enjoy driving it. I've done a lot of my own work on my German cars over the years and would have no qualms about tackling most external repairs on one of them. (As oposed to internal engine or transmision work.) I used to think German cars were hard to work on, and back in the early 80's, compared to US made cars, they were. But nothing is easy on this car. Toyota does many things differently so I have to learn from scratch each time I try to repair something. Incidentally, the easiest car to work on out of al the cars I have owned was my 1983 Mercedes 300 SD. It's as if Mercedes are designed to be maintained but Japanese cars are designed to be thrown away.

[CarLuvrSD]

Quote, originally posted by Vdubs »
"Put tape on areas you don't want to file like the thread and pipe."

Oh thanks now you tell me

Ok, I went with the file idea. Didn't think of the tape. (More of an artist than an engineer you know.) It took me about 20 minutes of careful filing/nut twirling... (no, the one on the brake line, silly!) - before it would fit. Then it was just a piece of cake. SO, my total hours for this 7/10's of an hour job are now at about 10 hours. if you include surfing through the Vortex while waiting for ideas, between parts searches etc.

Works as good as new! And with all original factory parts. I'm pleased with that aspect of it. After all the warnings, (thanks, by the way) I wouldn't have felt right about driving it with the patch job on it. And worried even more about letting someone else drive it. If I'd gone the temporary route I probably would have had the steel line replaced when I go to have the power steering pump and rack replaced soon. I already had an appointment for that, next week, but wasn't looking forward to having no car till next Monday. I had to borrow grandpas HUGE 1973 Caddillac today. (It's so beat. Luckilly he never drives over 30 mph. We keep thinking he will lose his liscence, but NO, at 95 he's in the market for a newer car!)

Well thanks again. We have about 15 minutes more light left, I want to go put the wheels back on and test it out.


PS: These posts are cut and pastes from VW vortex. I posted my problem over there as well. So many more members. The responses were largely simmilar though. No one here thought of the file idea though.

[Wintermute]

another recommended fix (since you are going to have to drain the entire brake system anyway) is to go buy a new hard-line from a lexus dealer. They should be about $50. I believe the lines in your model lexus run straight from the proportioning valve (it will probably take some work to get to that fitting) to the rear brakes where the flexible line links up to it. If you are willing to spend the extra money, you can get a set of stainless steel braided brake lines from brake zone. Let me know how it works out.