super hardcore OBDII question - Toyota Nation Forum : Toyota Car and Truck Forums


» Auto Insurance
» Featured Product
» Wheel & Tire Center

Go Back   Toyota Nation Forum : Toyota Car and Truck Forums > Toyota Nation Forums > Hardcore Tech and Competition

Hardcore Tech and Competition Strictly HARDCORE tech info and questions and also autocross / racing discussion!

ToyotaNation.com is the premier Toyota Forum on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads.
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 08-17-2005, 08:53 AM   #1 (permalink)
ECHO....Echo....echo....
 
BenG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: GTA, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1,016
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
View BenG's Photo Gallery
super hardcore OBDII question

The ODBII system sends an engine RPM signal to Pin 9 of the Toyota OBDII plug. This signal changes in frequency according to RPM. Does anyone know if there is a chart that matches the frequency of the RPM signal to actual RPM? Or, does anyone know what the forumula would be to calculate the RPM value from the frequency changes?

Mapping out each signal frequency to actual RPM would take too long and would be too inaccurate.

(no, the answer is not to buy an aftermarket tach. This is a pet project that my friend is working on for school)

Last edited by BenG; 08-17-2005 at 10:41 AM.
BenG is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 08-17-2005, 11:11 PM   #2 (permalink)
3s-gte in a Camry?!?
 
white90dx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Pasadena, CA
Posts: 4,091
Gameroom cash: $304575
Thanks: 1
Thanked 138 Times in 138 Posts
iTrader Score: 5 reviews
View white90dx's Photo Gallery
The tach signal fires once for each cylinder in the motor... you should be able to figure it out from there with a little math.

-Charlie
__________________
2003 Impreza WRX Wagon 5spd - 2.2L stroker + other goodies
1989 Camry Alltrac LE 3S-GTE 5spd - SV25/ST205 hybrid
1990 Camry 3S-GTE 5spd - parted out / junked
1990 Camry DX 3S-FE 5spd - The original white90dx; gone but not forgotten
white90dx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-18-2005, 08:44 AM   #3 (permalink)
ECHO....Echo....echo....
 
BenG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: GTA, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1,016
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
View BenG's Photo Gallery
Is it that simple? When we looked at the signal frequency compared to what the OEM tach said, we couldn't see a linear function relating the two.
BenG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-18-2005, 08:35 PM   #4 (permalink)
3s-gte in a Camry?!?
 
white90dx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Pasadena, CA
Posts: 4,091
Gameroom cash: $304575
Thanks: 1
Thanked 138 Times in 138 Posts
iTrader Score: 5 reviews
View white90dx's Photo Gallery
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenG
Is it that simple? When we looked at the signal frequency compared to what the OEM tach said, we couldn't see a linear function relating the two.
Do you have a frequency meter on a multi-meter or something? What are you using to test?

And yes, it should be that simple. Hold the RPMs steady for a while if you are going to let something like a multimeter figure out the frequency.

-Charlie
__________________
2003 Impreza WRX Wagon 5spd - 2.2L stroker + other goodies
1989 Camry Alltrac LE 3S-GTE 5spd - SV25/ST205 hybrid
1990 Camry 3S-GTE 5spd - parted out / junked
1990 Camry DX 3S-FE 5spd - The original white90dx; gone but not forgotten
white90dx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-18-2005, 09:20 PM   #5 (permalink)
camrys blow off too!
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: chatan town okinawa, japan
Posts: 554
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
View silverstreakin's Photo Gallery
remember that the rpm varies alot. its filtered to make it smooth on a tach
__________________
93 toyota mark II tourer V
1jz-gte twin turbo goodness!

93 toyota scepter turbo stored back in the states!
*in loving memory rapeacivic*
silverstreakin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-18-2005, 10:20 PM   #6 (permalink)
ECHO....Echo....echo....
 
BenG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: GTA, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1,016
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
View BenG's Photo Gallery
Quote:
Originally Posted by white90dx
Do you have a frequency meter on a multi-meter or something? What are you using to test?

And yes, it should be that simple. Hold the RPMs steady for a while if you are going to let something like a multimeter figure out the frequency.

-Charlie
The multi-meter we're using measures frequency. At first, we thought that the tach signal would be voltage based (more RPM, more voltage), but then we found out that it's frequency based.

RPM at idle was like 21 hertz (Mhz? I don't remember which) .... and at 5000 RPM it was about 105 i think.... and we also took readings at other points, but none of it really makes much sense because as RPMs climb, the frequency doesn't climb at the same rate.

The other thing is that we don't have a reference point other than 0 RPM, but that's not very useful.

Like I mentioned earlier, we could just go and record the frequency at different RPM levels and generalize a chart, but we were hoping to get a much more precise reading. (My friend is hoping to build his own tach out of some stepper motors he has left over from his other work term projects and we were hoping to get to an accuracy of +/-20 RPM.
BenG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-19-2005, 02:05 AM   #7 (permalink)
3s-gte in a Camry?!?
 
white90dx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Pasadena, CA
Posts: 4,091
Gameroom cash: $304575
Thanks: 1
Thanked 138 Times in 138 Posts
iTrader Score: 5 reviews
View white90dx's Photo Gallery
I finally had a few seconds to do the math...

For a 4-cylinder car, the tach signal should be the RPM/30 in Hz... That's if the ECU sends out one pulse to the tach for every firing of a cylinder.

4 cylinders = 2 spark plugs firing per motor revolution
1 rpm = (1/60) rps
so
30 RPM = 1 Hz

Go back and re-take those measurements with the motor being constant at whatever RPM for a while. Notice that the idle measurement comes right out to 630RPM, right where you'd expect it. The 5k measurement you took is like 3100RPM - you just rev'd the motor, right? It takes a long time for a frequency meter to read on a multimeter. Hold the motor at 4k or something for 5 or 10 seconds to get a true measurement. Come back w/ the results.

-Charlie
__________________
2003 Impreza WRX Wagon 5spd - 2.2L stroker + other goodies
1989 Camry Alltrac LE 3S-GTE 5spd - SV25/ST205 hybrid
1990 Camry 3S-GTE 5spd - parted out / junked
1990 Camry DX 3S-FE 5spd - The original white90dx; gone but not forgotten
white90dx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-19-2005, 09:39 PM   #8 (permalink)
JUST RE ENGINEER IT
 
fredk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Eureka UT.
Posts: 2,956
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
View fredk's Photo Gallery
ya think thats wild, take a guess how the ecu knows when a misfire happens?
__________________
fredk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-19-2005, 11:29 PM   #9 (permalink)
ECHO....Echo....echo....
 
BenG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: GTA, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1,016
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
iTrader Score: 0 reviews
View BenG's Photo Gallery
Quote:
Originally Posted by white90dx
I finally had a few seconds to do the math...

For a 4-cylinder car, the tach signal should be the RPM/30 in Hz... That's if the ECU sends out one pulse to the tach for every firing of a cylinder.

4 cylinders = 2 spark plugs firing per motor revolution
1 rpm = (1/60) rps
so
30 RPM = 1 Hz

Go back and re-take those measurements with the motor being constant at whatever RPM for a while. Notice that the idle measurement comes right out to 630RPM, right where you'd expect it. The 5k measurement you took is like 3100RPM - you just rev'd the motor, right? It takes a long time for a frequency meter to read on a multimeter. Hold the motor at 4k or something for 5 or 10 seconds to get a true measurement. Come back w/ the results.

-Charlie
Actually, I'm an idiot...i forgot to tell my friend that there are two sparks per cycle...apparently, it made a different, but I'm not sure how.... and we didn't hold at the RPMs long enough to get a totaly stable reading.

Either way, we're well under way to making our own DIY shift light and tach set. woot!

Last edited by BenG; 08-19-2005 at 11:42 PM.
BenG is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

  Toyota Nation Forum : Toyota Car and Truck Forums > Toyota Nation Forums > Hardcore Tech and Competition

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.2

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:59 AM.



Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2012, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Garage Plus vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.
ToyotaNation.com is an independent Toyota/Lexus enthusiast website. ToyotaNation.com is not sponsored by or in any way affiliated with Toyota Motor Sales, USA, Inc. The Toyota, Lexus and Scion names and logos are trademarks owned by Toyota Motor Sales, USA, Inc.