Lots Of Swirls! Help! - Toyota Nation Forum : Toyota Car and Truck Forums

TitaniumSE · 08-21-2007, 11:05 PM

Well I parked my 2007 Camry on the top of this hill and I let the sunlight hit it. And tada! There are a bunch of swirls all around. They are not that heavy, I would describe them as medium swirls. Well I have two options, to either save up money, buy a PC and a bunch of backing plates/pads and go at it, or just do it by hand with ScratchX. I'm leaning towards going the ScratchX method by hand. Well first off, I know how to remove swrils with ScratchX, it's just that my hand gets really tired after going at it. That is why I never really went all the way with the ScratchX. Okay here is my plan, and I also thought of a new technique:

I plan on doing one panel a day. The hood might take me two days. And after doing each panel, I'm going to wax after. My technique, is with the simple soft buff foam bad and a bottle of Scratch X. I will tape down each panel so I can work on individual small portions. So I will start working in the ScratchX, for about 15 minutes. And during those 15 minutes that I am working it in, I will play 3 Eurobeat songs on my iPod, and after thesongs have stopped playing, I will stop and check the results. Think this is a good method of doing it?
My friend who is also a fellow detailer, suggested that I use 3M Polishing Compound, and do it by hand. However, I have no personaly experience with 3M so I don't know what to expect.
So my questions to this forum are, which method should I go by, and is there anything else I can do to speed up time when working by hand. Because I know my hand will be really tired afterwards.

ToyotaJimD. · 08-22-2007, 02:17 AM

Try Mothers Scratch Remover. Consumer Reports recently rated it above Scratch X.

Follow each section with Pre-Wax Cleaner, Sealer & Glaze and Pure Carnauba Wax from Mothers.

And before you wash again, evaluate your washing and drying process.

TitaniumSE · 08-22-2007, 03:18 AM

Weird...because I wash using the two bucket method and a skeepskin mitt. Maybe it was the dealer...

OCDetails · 08-22-2007, 07:43 AM

ScratchX isn't going to work by hand. Swirl removal is a job that machines were made to handle. Unless you have shoulders like an ox then you aren't going to be able to build up the speed and friction needed to break down a polish into something that will remove swirls. Trust me on that one. I've been in this business for ten years and it just isn't going to work. Spend the money on the PC and pads. It will pay for itself in time saved and money saved going to a detailer. I charge as much on any given detail more than it would cost to buy the tools and products to do it themselves.

PolishAndWax · 08-22-2007, 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PhantomGrey

My friend who is also a fellow detailer, suggested that I use 3M Polishing Compound, and do it by hand. However, I have no personaly experience with 3M so I don't know what to expect.

NEVER EVER EVER use compound on your car! It will ruin your paint.

That stuff should be illegal to sell.

PolishAndWax · 08-22-2007, 02:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PhantomGrey

Weird...because I wash using the two bucket method and a skeepskin mitt. Maybe it was the dealer...

It very well could have been the dealer. You would not be the first person to experience swirls left by a dealer.

Also, if they are a tight, consistent pattern, it is highly unlikely that you did it by washing it. You would see more straight-line scratches if that were the case, unless you wash in an orbital/circular fashion.

Glaze, by the way, is a filler to cover up what you can't polish out. So, it is possible that your dealer filled in a crappy polish job and the glaze is starting to come off.

Last weekend, we polished a 1937 Lincoln Zephyr at the Russo & Steele show in Monterey. The owner was complaining about swirl marks. He said 'it didn't look like this when I picked it up from the body shop'.

Correct. It didn't look like that, but those swirl marks were there, covered by glaze. The glaze came off and revealed the swirls.

SYSTEM ONE does not sell a glaze, because we don't need to. We don't use diminishing abrasives, which means we don't make deep cuts on the initial application that need to be filled in later. If anyone doubts us, we take alcohol or another solvent to the panel to show we didn't leave anything behind.

See some of my posts in the supporting vendors area and my website to learn more and see some examples of paint polished to perfection with no glaze.

As far as doing it by hand, you can do in with SYSTEM ONE, but you don't need to 'break down' the particles like you would with a diminishing abrasive. The particles (aluminum oxide) are already microscopic and are ready to remove swirls.

That being said, it is still a ton of work to do by hand. I would recommend a rotary or a forced random orbit tool. A P/C is not a forced random orbit tool and will not do much good with SYSTEM ONE because it is basically just shaking around (grab the pad and you will see that it does not force a rotation).

YES, a rotary is a dangerous tool with dimishing abrasives. It is much safer with SYSTEM ONE. We lean on edges (see the Red Nissan video on my website) and polish in the sun with no adverse effects.

It is not a coincidence that a P/C (doesn't do much) and dimishing abrasives (hack up your paint) are paired; they somewhat offset each other.

Pb · 08-22-2007, 02:04 PM

Mow some grass. Make some money. Buy a buffer.

PolishAndWax · 08-22-2007, 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pb

Mow some grass. Make some money. Buy a buffer.

OCDetails · 08-22-2007, 02:58 PM

I wouldn't say that the PC isn't capable of removing swirls. I've been using the PC for years without a problem. I've never come across damage that I couldn't remove with it. I don't believe in filling in swirls either. They aren't that tough to remove and I never use products that would fill them in. I spend too much of my time fixing the damage caused by dealership hacks and poor detailing shops to be out causing the same kinds of problems. This is an example of a hood that took about ten minutes of polishing to remove all the swirls, but they are gone and not just filled.

I've got many more examples of the PC removing swirls. The System One stuff may very well be able to remove swirls without diminishing abrasives, but that is by no means the only way of doing things. The product is only part of the equation when working on your paint. There is also a process that has to be followed as well as the patience to learn the correct combinations. Product, Process, and Patience. That is the way to get results. You can get them with any number of different products as long as the process is good and you have the patience to see it through. Don't get caught up thinking that there is only one way and one product that works.

TitaniumSE · 08-22-2007, 09:17 PM

This is a hood before and after ScratchX. BY HAND.

Perfect? No.

dramatically improved? Yes!

TitaniumSE · 08-22-2007, 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pb

Mow some grass. Make some money. Buy a buffer.

I have my own detailing business and I charge $90-110/car and up to $150/SUV. Seeing that I just wash, clay and wax. I don't polish since it's too hard. I came up with $350 awhile ago, which was enough for a PC along with a few pads and backing plates, but I ended up giving into the hype and buying a Wii.

And no detailing is going by so slow. I can't find a client at all. I'm gonna make some flyers soon and put them in people's mailboxes. But...too lazy.

PolishAndWax · 08-22-2007, 10:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PhantomGrey

I have my own detailing business and I charge $90-110/car and up to $150/SUV. Seeing that I just wash, clay and wax. I don't polish since it's too hard. I came up with $350 awhile ago, which was enough for a PC along with a few pads and backing plates, but I ended up giving into the hype and buying a Wii.

And no detailing is going by so slow. I can't find a client at all. I'm gonna make some flyers soon and put them in people's mailboxes. But...too lazy.

Better get those swirls out!

My truck is one of my biggest selling tools for my products. Zero swirls (although I do have scratches here and there...almost unavoidable on a daily driver).

TitaniumSE · 08-22-2007, 10:45 PM

PM'd you.

OCDetails · 08-22-2007, 11:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PhantomGrey

I have my own detailing business and I charge $90-110/car and up to $150/SUV. Seeing that I just wash, clay and wax. I don't polish since it's too hard. I came up with $350 awhile ago, which was enough for a PC along with a few pads and backing plates, but I ended up giving into the hype and buying a Wii.

And no detailing is going by so slow. I can't find a client at all. I'm gonna make some flyers soon and put them in people's mailboxes. But...too lazy.

Don't underestimate the power of Craigslist. I did most of my business by word of mouth until I found that place. The best part is that you can create your ads using html and make them really professional looking. My business tripled when I started advertising, so just be careful what you wish for... Don't ever advertise unless you are prepared to handle the volume it can create.

CamrySExxx · 08-23-2007, 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pb

Mow some grass. Make some money. Buy a buffer.

bwahah SELL some grass!