Replacing a radiator

[patoline]

Hi,

I have a '88 Camry, automatic transmission, with 200K miles. It runs well enough and I only use it to get back and forth to work (15 miles round) trip. It has developed a small leak at the top of the radiator (the plastic part of the radiator near the cap) which I am going to try and patch with JB Weld. My question, assuming the JB weld doesn't work, is how much work/expertise is involved with replacing the radiator? I'm betting that after 20 years/200K miles that some of the connections will be pretty hard to work with (like the transmission cooling lines) and may get damaged when I try to disconnect them.

Also, I see replacement radiators on ebay for about $70 with shipping, are these crap?

I'm getting quotes for about $500 parts and labor from local shops and I just can see spending that kind of money on a car this old.

Any help/suggestions would be appreciated.

[fourdrinie]

As long as you take the time and spray the fittings with wd40 or some other deep action loosening power spray (let it sit for a few days, spraying each day) and use flare nut wrenches when possible, you should be able to loosen and remove the bolts/screws/nuts...its a good time to replace all hoses and thermostat if needed!!!

[atobe]

it's a better bet just to buy a radiator locally at least it's easier to deal with if sometime goes wrong.... replacing a radiator by yourself is easy...2 bolts 4 hoses... and you can always get new rubber hoses.... and it's easier to pull them off the radiator side instead of the steel metal lines from the tranny.

[TBayToyotaBoy]

You may also want to spray the four bolts that hold the fan shroud (or fan shrouds, if you have AC) onto the rad. If they're original, they'll be easy to snap-off accidentally--especially the bottom ones. And as fourdrinie said, replace the thermostat and the rad hoses while you're in there. The whole job shouldn't cost more than $150, rads usually run close to $100. Don't reuse the coolant, either. Flush the block out with a garden hose, and mix the new coolant with distilled or deionized water to prevent corrosion.

[Kep]

I've never understood why manufacturers elected to use metal & plastic for radiators. I hope that there is a reason beyond cost savings. However, I am rather fond of 100% metal radiators and they are available for sale. I paid about $70 locally about 5 years ago. I expect that you can find one near you for about $100. Before you buy it verify that the hydraulic connections are correct. I've seen some that need to be modified to fit various applications.

Like Atobe said, local is easier to work with if you have any problems.

Kep

[greg r]

deionized water

Never that stuff! Clean is good enough, distilled is ok but really unnecessary unless all you've got is mine runoff. There's enough protection built in a good antifreeze already. DI water will suck the metal right outta your components. Remember high school? water? the universal solvent? We use it at work, and there is no metal except for stainless fittings on the pumps and tanks, and now the tanks are stainless too. JB weld will pop right off because of the different thermal expansion between the plastics and it. Local scourcing one is good advice.

[patoline]

Thanks for all the info. I'll have to dig up a flare-nut wrench, would anyone happen to know the size off hand?

I'm having trouble finding an inexpensive radiator I can pick up locally (no-name models start at around $125). There is a guy on ebay selling a Modine unit for $90 and free shipping. Assuming it arrives in one piece, is Modine a decent unit?

Thanks again, appreciated.

[TBayToyotaBoy]

Originally Posted by greg r

Never that stuff! Clean is good enough, distilled is ok but really unnecessary unless all you've got is mine runoff. There's enough protection built in a good antifreeze already. DI water will suck the metal right outta your components. Remember high school? water? the universal solvent? We use it at work, and there is no metal except for stainless fittings on the pumps and tanks, and now the tanks are stainless too. JB weld will pop right off because of the different thermal expansion between the plastics and it. Local scourcing one is good advice.

Hmmm...interesting. I wonder how I've been managing to use deionized water for almost 20 years with no side-effects? I know what you're saying, the theory is there, but in practice (over a span of 18 years, five vehicles, and well over 800,000km) it just doesn't happen. If any metal has been "sucked-out" of the chambers in my block or the cores on my rads, it's been infinitessimal. Almost all of my Yotas have topped 400,000km with--you guessed it--deonized water in their cooling systems.

P.S.: Oh, I almost forgot: maybe the tap water in Oregon is pure, but almost everywhere else it's chock-full of minerals and chemicals (chlorine and fluorine, unfortunately). I've seen many a car run on tap water and the build-up is very, very ugly.

[toyomoho]

Modine is OK.

Concur with atobe on buying local. Being bounced around during shipping can result in leaks, then your stuck dealing with shipping it back.

The fittings should not be tight enough to require a flare wrench to remove. Make sure they are on the new radiator, in the box or your old ones will transfer over.

When done, double check all hose clamp fittings for tightness on trans and engine.

[JMSports]

Originally Posted by fourdrinie

As long as you take the time and spray the fittings with wd40 or some other deep action loosening power spray (let it sit for a few days, spraying each day) and use flare nut wrenches when possible, you should be able to loosen and remove the bolts/screws/nuts...its a good time to replace all hoses and thermostat if needed!!!

WD-40 is made by gods.

Seriously spray the fittings down with it, and they should loosen up. If you have any metal tubes etc be careful not to break them. Any tubes that leak, just hold up or tape up so they dont leak, and loosen the bolts for the radiator. There are 2 fans (on mine there are 2) that are connected to the radiator so you might have to get those off first.

Just my opinion, although im no expert.

[greg r]

wonder how I've been managing to use deionized water for almost 20 years with no side-effects?

Yeah I blew that one. The antifreeze "solution" would've rendered it immediately, and being in a closed loop any solvency would've also been minimal seeing these systems only hold a couple of gallons. Thanks for the field experience. Our DI systems in contrast see a continual flow from generation to point of use; so we're careful on the components that go in them.

Modine makes LOTS of radiators, heater cores etc. for a lot of OEM and chances are your last recore was from Modine no matter whose label is on it, though these plastic tank variety are throwaways.

all of my Yotas have topped 400,000km with--you guessed it--deonized water in their cooling systems.

So how often do you get them flushed?

[TBayToyotaBoy]

Actually, since the age of 18 I've flushed my cars myself. That way I know it's done thoroughly. I'm not perfect with my timing, but I try to flush my cars every 18 months or so (though I've been known to do it at 24 months for lack of time).

I have the same attitude towards engine oil, tranny fluid, and brake/clutch fluid. I flush/change them all myself, and I try to use intervals less than the Toyota-recommended time frames. So far it's paid-off.

Thanks for backing me up on the ionization theory. You actually had me worrying for awhile there, even though I was pretty sure I hadn't done anything too silly. I'd have thought any serious ion-robbing by the coolant/water mixture would show up as pitting on the inlets/outlets, and that hasn't happened to me yet....

[Mike Gerber]

"WD-40 is made by gods."

WD-40 is great. I use it myself for many applications including spraying it on CV joint boots to keep them from drying out and cracking, but it really does not do well as a penetrating oil. I would use it as a penetrating oil in a pinch, if nothing else is available. However, use PB Blaster or some other good penetrating oil, where a penetrating oil is really required. IMHO.


Mike