Crankshaft pulley bolt holes size? ('91 Camry DX)

[RolentoGrenades]

I'm planning on replacing my timing belt/idlers and I've fabricated a tool to hold the crankshaft pulley in place while busting loose the main bolt, but I don't know what size bolts I should have with my crankshaft pulley puller tool. I also need them for the holder tool.

I picked up the usual puller that comes with 8mm hex head bolts, but they are too large for the holes. I've read the holes may be 6mm, but I'd like to know the exact bolt diameter/length I should pick up. Thanks.

[71Corolla]

The bolts you need are 6M-1.0, about 5cm long (2 inches).

Don't count on those bolts to be strong enough to hold the crank however, they will probably sheer off depending on how frozen the crank bolt is. Use the "starter bump" trick first, if that doesn't work then you can try other methods. Make absolutely certain your socket is in good condition, and is a 6 point.

I just finished up a timing belt job today, the crank bolt was completely rounded off from many attempts to remove it, including an attempt by a local garage. I contemplated several ways to try and get it off, I decided on using a cutting wheel on an angle grinder. I had to carefully cut into the bolt from about 8 different angles, then use a chisel to fracture the pieces off one by one. I destroyed the harmonic balancer in the process, but I don't think there was any other way of doing it. So don't round off the bolt or you will be in a world of hurt!

[RolentoGrenades]

Hey man, thanks for the reply. I've decided if this one is that seized (may not be that bad, was changed a few years ago, it's mostly got to come out because my crankshaft seal is leaking a bit) I'll just get a local mechanic to do it for me. He told me about the starter trick. I guess some people also wedge the flexplate, but I'm not doing any of that, haha. It's only about four hundred bucks to get it done here and I've already got the parts, but hey, I'll give it a quick shot before going to someone just for the heck of it.

Funny how when people change the timing belt on 3sfe engines on youtube and such, they always conveniently skip the part where they break that bolt loose. This guy from NZ, westy, has the best video on youtube for the 3sfe. I believe he does it on a Rav4. Aside from that crankshaft bolt, it's not too bad of a job. As long as the timing is proper of course.

Originally Posted by 71Corolla

The bolts you need are 6M-1.0, about 5cm long (2 inches).

Don't count on those bolts to be strong enough to hold the crank however, they will probably sheer off depending on how frozen the crank bolt is. Use the "starter bump" trick first, if that doesn't work then you can try other methods. Make absolutely certain your socket is in good condition, and is a 6 point.

I just finished up a timing belt job today, the crank bolt was completely rounded off from many attempts to remove it, including an attempt by a local garage. I contemplated several ways to try and get it off, I decided on using a cutting wheel on an angle grinder. I had to carefully cut into the bolt from about 8 different angles, then use a chisel to fracture the pieces off one by one. I destroyed the harmonic balancer in the process, but I don't think there was any other way of doing it. So don't round off the bolt or you will be in a world of hurt!

[RolentoGrenades]

Okay, the bolt came off on the first try using the starter bump method that 71corolla recommended. I brainstormed a while and then finally decided to do it his way on the first attempt. If anyone wants to do it this way, I did it by removing the wires to the ignitor so the car wouldn't just start and run and then placed a breaker bar up against the bottom of the control arm supported by a jack stand. It's pretty much the only way it'll work. If you try it by letting the bar just forcefully fling up and hit something, it'll likely break it loose, but may screw something up big time in the process. The jack stand is a total necessity.

Also like he says, you have to have 2 inch 6M-1.0 bolts to go on your puller. I also used them on my make-shift harmonic balancer holder tool for re-torque which worked perfectly. Here's a pic of everything I used for future reference in case anyone wants to try it this way:



19mm impact socket, breaker bar, and the make-shift tool made from 3/16" x 1 - 1/4"3 foot weldable flat that I got at Lowes. Just drill your 6mm holes and something like an 8mm in the center, cut it and assemble. Way cheaper than a SST.

[71Corolla]

Good to see the bolt came off for you. This is what the result is when the removal goes horribly wrong. This took me about an hour of careful grinding, I first tried using a Dremel, but the tiny cut-off wheel was pretty much useless there was too much steel for it to go through. I doubt an easy-out would have worked, the bolt must have been really seized on there.

I guess another way would be to drill the center out, but there is the risk of drilling into the crankshaft. I barely touched the flat surface of the pulley, the crank itself sits a few millimeters below it.

[RolentoGrenades]

Yikes. Glad you got it sorted out in the end. Looks like a serious pain from the pics. From what I understand by reading up on these bolts, the three main ways they seize like that is because of over-torque, flash welding/oxidizing/rusting from the washer part of the bolt, or too much loctite in the threads. Supposedly, using a torch to heat up the bolt first is a good idea on these kind of jobs.Hammering it sometimes breaks up the rust too.

I'm definitely thankful that mine came off on the first attempt, as I know how much of a hassle these can be!

[71Corolla]

Yea I made a big mess removing that. But the bottom line is I was able to remove the pulley without damaging anything else. I'm curious how a "pro" would have gone about getting it off. If I did heat the bolt enough to break the oxidation bond, the bolt head was rounded off so I had no way to remove it anyway.

I like the holding tool you made, I'm going to make one like that. I've been using a modified cam holder tool (I found it in a salvage yard, one of the nubs was broken off) but the arms are not long enough so it makes it hard to hold the pulley.

[RolentoGrenades]

Originally Posted by 71Corolla

Yea I made a big mess removing that. But the bottom line is I was able to remove the pulley without damaging anything else. I'm curious how a "pro" would have gone about getting it off. If I did heat the bolt enough to break the oxidation bond, the bolt head was rounded off so I had no way to remove it anyway.

I like the holding tool you made, I'm going to make one like that. I've been using a modified cam holder tool (I found it in a salvage yard, one of the nubs was broken off) but the arms are not long enough so it makes it hard to hold the pulley.

The only thing I could think of are bolt extractor sockets. I have a cheap-ish pair from Irwin that I got from Autozone. Irwin makes GREAT quality vice grips and carpentry stuff, but I wasn't so sure about those extractors for automotive work, so I tried them out on a rounded catalytic converter bolt when I was doing my exhaust manifold gasket and cat gaskets. It actually worked. But like you say, on something like a crankshaft bolt, it's going to be a hell of a lot tougher.

A local mechanic showed me some Snap-On bolt extractor sockets he had. I have to say, they looked tough as hell. I'm thinking they might break tractor bolts, haha. But who has that kinda' money, ya' know? For a pro mechanic I can understand, but for every-day use, it's kinda' pointless. I despise Snap-On's pricing and if I absolutely must go the more expensive route, usually go for Blue Point for comparable quality at a much more affordable price.

On that holding tool, the swinging part of it is about 10" long. Seemed to work perfect with that long bolt in the middle catching the frame of the car holding it in place at the bottom to fasten everything. I had a mishap of my own while making that thing. I was planning on cutting it with a diamond blade on my circular saw, but the blade was dull and only notched it. So I had to use a crappy hacksaw blade that was missing about three teeth, haha. Took a while. Sounds like you have the right tools for metal fabrication if you own grinders and stuff, so I'm sure it'll be a breeze to make. Not much to it, but it works.

[71Corolla]

Yea I have a few metal cutting discs, they are really thin and don't vibrate or fracture easily. I have a 10" version I sometimes use on the table saw, works well for metal cutting. BTW, a great thing to have on the bench grinder is a white grinding wheel. It's often called a norton white aluminum oxide wheel. They works great for general grinding because the metal does not get near as hot, so you can shape various things without turning it red hot.

For tools, I've pretty much given up finding good ones these days, all the newer tools I've bought were crap. I have some early 70's Craftsman stuff that is excellent, I'll cry the day they break because I doubt they are replaceable, Sears will just give me their new cheap stuff. My newish 1/2" drive Craftsman socket set keeps cracking, sure I get a new socket but they don't stand up. I have some Canadian made Gray sockets and wrenches, they are extremely good, but I priced out their new stuff and it was insanely expensive. I guess you get what you pay for.

[RolentoGrenades]

Originally Posted by 71Corolla

For tools, I've pretty much given up finding good ones these days, all the newer tools I've bought were crap. I have some early 70's Craftsman stuff that is excellent, I'll cry the day they break because I doubt they are replaceable, Sears will just give me their new cheap stuff. My newish 1/2" drive Craftsman socket set keeps cracking, sure I get a new socket but they don't stand up. I have some Canadian made Gray sockets and wrenches, they are extremely good, but I priced out their new stuff and it was insanely expensive. I guess you get what you pay for.

I have some Canadian-made stuff from the mid 80s that is just as good if not better than Japanese and USA tools from the same era. Canada has always been a high quality place for tools, as long as they don't outsource to China like what happened with Torin. Torin jacks still get the job done, but they won't be as good of a grade as the stuff actually made in Canada.

It's a shame man, the quality decrease in stuff that's out there these days. I've found that Stanley still has decent stuff, but they don't have the simple return policy of a Craftsman. Kobalt is semi-decent too, but Taiwanese. I find that for Asian tools, if it isn't the highest quality (Japan), then you have to go for the second which would be Korea. I find the same thing in just about any products from the far east. And yes, you do get what you pay for. Snap-On, Matco, Mac, and the like are incredibly expensive, but they are definitely no joke when it comes to quality.

['88 All-Trac]

I have to recommend Husky brand tools... They're made-in-Canada quality and they sell 48-tooth ratchets! Good stuff there.

Glad to hear yours came apart without issue. I'm not looking forward to when mine needs to be done.

[71Corolla]

Originally Posted by RolentoGrenades

I have some Canadian-made stuff from the mid 80s that is just as good if not better than Japanese and USA tools from the same era. Canada has always been a high quality place for tools, as long as they don't outsource to China like what happened with Torin. Torin jacks still get the job done, but they won't be as good of a grade as the stuff actually made in Canada.

I might take a look at some Gray Tools again. Their stuff still appears to be made in Canada, I need a flex handle ratchet. Outsourcing is a direct result of what people are willing to pay I guess, a $20 ratchet will sell 1000 times better than a $100 ratchet.

Originally Posted by '88 All-Trac

I have to recommend Husky brand tools... They're made-in-Canada quality and they sell 48-tooth ratchets! Good stuff.

Gonna look at them as well. They are actually made under contract by Stanley IIRC.

[atobe]

That's a good way to save yourself $ and creative way to make that tool good job. I recently did this too but i just used an impact and the bolt just came right off.

[71Corolla]

I think an impact wrench is what did the bolt head in. I don't know the owner is kinda hazy on how it all happened. On a related note, is an impact safe on a crank bolt? I just wonder about the main bearing, probably won't hurt it but it does give me pause. I definitely try to avoid hammering on the crank bolt if I can help it.

[RolentoGrenades]

'88, I hear ya'. That part of the job can be no fun sometimes. Good luck with it when the time comes!

I have a few random Husky tools. Never had any problems out of them at all. The Husky tool boxes are also pretty good quality for the money. Waterloo makes them. The six point socket I broke the bolt with was just an AutoCraft impact deep socket from Advance Auto. I figured anything impact quality would be good enough, despite the brand. Didn't want a deep well one, but it's all they had. Most AutoCraft stuff isn't horrible amazingly enough.

Atobe, sounds like you got lucky with the impact, heh. Although, I know not all impacts are created equally like anything else. I'm sure you had a good one with a lot of torque.