3rd & 4th Generation (1992–1996 & 1997–2001)Toyota Camry Discussion for years: 1992-1996 & 1997-2001
Topics of discussion range from fuel economy, safety, modifications, performance all involving America's favorite family car, the Toyota Camry.
my brothers '96 camry 2.2L, as the title indicates, will stall out ONLY when he slows down to make a turn or comes to a stop after the vehicle has come to full operating temperature. the car vibrates, but I don't think it misfires (according to my bro). it has no problem starting right back up. this doesn't happen all the time, but it is becoming more frequent. the camry has 90,000 miles on it.
the idle air valve/bypass is clean. the dealership cleaned it out 7k ago when we last took it to them. i don't think i have a vacuum leak (if I did, i think it would probably happen more often than it already does)
the PCM (or Toyota equivalent) throws out code po441, which i'm told generally indicates a problem with the EVAP system. of particular interest are the vsv and charcoal canister. i recently replaced the fuel cap, as my search on TN showed that some who have replaced it have had the code go away. this may not be related, but i include it anyway.
1. can a code 441 problem cause the car to actually stall out in the situation described.
2. if not (which is what I'm starting to think), what can I check to remedy this problem. time is important, because there are safety concerns, obviously.
i'd prefer not to take the car to the dealership. we don't have a lot of money, so i'd like to at least give it a shot before surrendering. i just need a little guidance.
same thing actually just happened to me. It turned out that when I had my last service done, they changed the spark plugs and there was some kind of oil leak that spread to the spark plug socket or something like that...I can't really remember. but anyways, aparently my engine was only firing on 2 or 3 cylinders, and they just had to replace the damaged sparkplug and clean up some oil.
My apologies for not getting back sooner. School, you know.
1. Stillrunning - It does ONLY stall out after it has hit full operating temperature. It it doesn't do it every day, but it is approaching that. It is summer in the south, so I imagine that he is probably running his A/C all the time, but I'll check.
2. bronzemaxell - It is interesting you mention the ECT. I didn't notice how Toyota set it up when I was under there. Does the camry use 2 coolant temp sensors, one for the gauge, one for the PCM? I mention this because my brother did indicate the the coolant temperature seems a little high on the stock gauge, somewhere above halfway up the sweep. In the past, the needle has always been about 1/3rd the way up the gauge. When you switched the ECT, did the problem go away completely?
3. Stillrunning, prnc_chrmng. I will check the EGR hoses this weekend. This will sound stupid, but where are they? The car I generally work on is a Taurus SHO, which only featured EGR in the Cali cars, so I haven't worked with it before.
4. Corsulian - I just text messaged my brother at work about the tach. I'll let everyone know what he says.
On cdtrans suggestion, I checked the spark plugs (swapped actually, cheap insurance). There was a little oil or goop on the insulator side of the #4 spark plug. We'll see if swapping made any difference when he gets home late tonight.
I'm starting to think this problem is the result of a lot of little things. The car hasn't been taken care of all that well, and I think it's just going to take some TLC and some routine maintenance to bring it back up to spec.
Is it fairly safe to say that the code 441 is not causing this problem?
Let me know if you think of anything else. I'll be back when I hear something.
Kudzo96, My thought on the A/C was that the idle-up switch may not be working. To check simply turn off A/C and see if it still stalls. The EGR and ECT are easy to check. Disconnect the vacuum hose to the EGR and plug it, that will disable the EGR. If it still stalls it's not the EGR unless it's leaking, but your description does not lead me there. To check the ECT disconnect it and short the two terminals on the plug, then see if the car still stalls. You should have a separate gauge switch, an ECT switch and a VSV on the water outlet block where the upper rad hose connects to the head. The gauge switch should be on the left with one wire to it. The ECT is next with two wires to it and the VSV has a couple of vacuum hoses to it.
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1995 Camry Wagon LE. 2.2 4cyl, 5S-FE, Auto, 187K
Your help is very much appreciated! The picture is especially helpful. I'll start with the EGR system if I can ever find a free minute.
I'll have him drive home with the A/C off. We'll probably get to that before the EGR hoses in all honesty. If the problem goes away with the A/C off and continues not to plague him, how do I fix the idle-up switch? I guess I should probably start with a search first, eh?
I'm printing off this thread so I can reference it. Lots of good info. My bro is saying he might just take it in anyway because of my schedule, but these seem like pretty easy tests, so i'll see if he can give me a little while longer.
Corsulian - you had asked what the tach was doing as the car stalled out. My brother reports is wasn't doing anything unusual. It matched the engine speed fine. Hovered somewhere around 500 rpm then just died (or something similar). There were no wild fluctuations or anything.
sounds like it could be the egr sticking, simple test..... in the pic prnc_charmin sent the 2 little hoses going into the round disc at the top of the pic, disconnect those jewels, plug them with some bolts and drive and see what happens..... if it doesnt do it anymore it means that the egr valve is sticking open.
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