Mystery Starting Issue, 92 3VZ-FE - Toyota Nation Forum : Toyota Car and Truck Forums

RodMillenFan · 09-29-2007, 02:20 PM

Hey everyone. I have a 1992 Camry SE V6 that I don't drive often, and I've come across a mystery starting problem. Step back in time two weeks ago...

I hopped into the car to move her out of the garage to make room for other work. It wouldn't start. I heard the starter relay going RAT-AT-AT-AT-AT-AT. I pulled out the trusty black 'n' green Toyota manual and started digging in. I pulled out the starter relay and checked continuity both with and without 12V, and it looked fine. I pulled out the starter motor checked it, including response to 12V (for solenoid actuation and holding, and starter motor rotation). No problem, all worked well. I decided it had to be something bigger and I figured I'd put it all back together again and come back when I had more time.

Once I re-assembled, I decided to try her again. WAH-LAH she started without hesitation. !?!?

I figured that maybe the relay or starter was sticking, and when I put 12V to it straight across the battery that it popped something free.

Step forward in time to today. Once again I went to move the car to free the garage for other work. No start, and RAT-AT-AT-AT at the relay again.

This time I grabbed the starter relay from my 93 Camry V6, which has no starting issues. I installed it and no change. So it probably isn't the relay.

I went to Advance Auto and bought a new starter motor figuring SURELY this was the problem. I installed the motor and tried again. NO CHANGE!! No change, you say? NO, fine friends... NO CHANGE.

Once again, I figured... something is deeper that I'll have to dig into later, so I decided to take out the new starter motor (to return it), and I put it all back where I started from... same starter, same relay, same everything.

But then... the curiosity struck me...

I hopped in, turned the key.

She started right up.

The only missing piece I can figure is a wire or cable going bad, maybe, and as I move the cables something is losing continuity. My wife also suggested the ignition switch, and who knows, maybe that's it.

Anyone have any other suggestions?

bigbird · 09-29-2007, 02:42 PM

that sounds like bad wires to me. have any other electrical problems of any sort? have u tested the circuit? how old is the battery(only ask cuz even ef u dont use it will ware over time)?

marc780 · 09-29-2007, 03:36 PM

Some possible other suspects in this starting problem: worn ignition switch; missing or worn teeth on flywheel; worn transmission no-start switch (or whatever you call the switch that doesnt let yu start with the trans in gear)

RodMillenFan · 09-29-2007, 04:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigbird

that sounds like bad wires to me. have any other electrical problems of any sort? have u tested the circuit? how old is the battery(only ask cuz even ef u dont use it will ware over time)?

The only electrical thing that comes to mind is there seems to be a current draw coming from somewhere because even as it sits idle in the garage, the battery slowly dies. I don't know if it's one of those hidden "trunk light stays on and you don't realize it is, so the battery dies" kind of problems, or what.

The battery isn't terribly old, but that isn't the problem either. I actually took it out of the circuit entirely, hooked up the battery charger straight to the cables and put the charger on "START". This way, if the battery couldn't draw current away trying to recharge as I was trying to start, and it was out of the equation altogether. Same problem.

I will be digging into the wiring a little more soon.

RodMillenFan · 09-29-2007, 04:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by marc780

Some possible other suspects in this starting problem: worn ignition switch; missing or worn teeth on flywheel; worn transmission no-start switch (or whatever you call the switch that doesnt let yu start with the trans in gear)

Worn ignition switch: Yeah, that was my wife's suggestion, and that'll be on my list if this happens again.

Flywheel teeth: If I could hear the solenoid going, I might consider this... but then again, maybe it is trying and I just can't tell.

Transmision: This is a 5-speed, so the equivalent would be the switch on the clutch... worth looking at because that can get knocked out of position. When I've forgotten to push the clutch pedal in (that happens when you have both a 5-speed an auto Gen3 Camry!) it doesn't even make a noise, though, so I'm not sure this is it.

Thanks for the reply... I appreciate the feedback. It gives me ideas to try!

Mike Gerber · 10-01-2007, 03:05 PM

"(or whatever you call the switch that doesnt let yu start with the trans in gear)"

Neutral safety switch.

I wouldn't think that was it. Usually, when you try to start a car in drive or low or reverse (or in gear without the clutch depressed as in the case with his manual transmission), you get no sound at all, if the neutral safety switch is doing it's job.

I'm thinking cables from the battery to the starter, or the cable connections at either end are corroded. If it was the ignition switch, I would think you would get no sound as no current is passing through to the relay, and he said he is getting a sound at the relay, indicating current is reaching the relay.

Mike

renmike · 10-01-2007, 03:38 PM

Without looking at a schematic, right off the top of my head, I'd verify a couple of things.

1) Make sure you're getting the constant 12V at the starter (hook a voltmeter up to the wire coming from the battery and then body ground).

2) Then, backprobe the wire from the connector that is the ignition source to make sure you're getting that everytime. Just because the relay is clicking doesn't mean you're getting the connection over to the solenoid, you're just getting juice to the relay.

If you are getting both of those, I'm led to believe it has something to do with the solenoid. Then again, I would really need to be there to verify it but that's where my mind leads me at this time.