Problems with Automatic Brake Adjuster (rear shoes)

[Keep]

Hey Guys,

I've recently done a full brake job on the Camry. (it's a 95 DX with rear shoes)

I replaced the rear shoes, and was extremely careful when re-assembling. I followed the Toyota Service manual.

My problem is:

One of my drums overtightens the automatic brake adjuster. I set up the automatic brake adjuster as per toyota. And for the first 20-40 miles it works perfect.

However as the miles tick on, the pedal travel starts getting smaller and smaller, the e-brake lever starts getting harder to pull (and I originally set it up with room for tightening)

What's happening is during driving, the automatic brake adjuster (star-wheel type) doesn't stop tightening while I drive. The first few days after I did the brake job it got to the point where that one wheel would stop the car in a few hundred feet without any other brake pressure added. (and the brakes got HOT, might have to re-turn the rotors and replace the shoes again).

Has anyone experienced this, or has any experience with troubleshooting these auto brake adjusters?

Let me know! I'm tired of removing that one wheel and backing off the adjuster every few days.

Kyle

[gonesurfing]

Are you sure they're over adjusting? Could the return spring be installed wrong allowing the brakes to rub?

If I were you, I'd pull both rear wheels and compare the correctly operating brake to the one that is over adjusting. See if you can see something different between the two.

[Kep]

^+1

Pay particular attention to the star wheel on the adjuster. It almost sounds like whatever it ratchets against is missing or not connecting correctly. Each time you apply the parking brake it causes the adjuster to turn. When there is enough wear of the shoe the star wheel clicks another notch and lengthens the adjuster to compensate for the wear of the shoe. It kind of sounds like the star wheel may be free spinning and not being held in check waiting for the shoe to get thinner.

Kep

[Hajoca]

after you take both drums off, ask someone to pull and release parking brake, look at how much the cable gets to move on each side to eliminate a sticking cable on one side, check under arm rest connection too!

[anti-seize]

You didn't by any chance swap hardware right to left, did you?

Typically these things are only suppose to adjust when you brake while going in reverse, or something. Having both sets of parts off at the same time and putting them in on the wrong drum might cause something crazy like this. I don't know. I only touch one side at a time, myself.

[Hajoca]

The star adjusters are to lengthen when pushed up on the outside face by the lever. If one side is working, then I do not think that they are swapped, but is the lever making contact? and is the star adjuster free end working smooth on both sides?

[Keep]

Hey Everyone, thank you for your replies thus far.

When working on these shoes/drums for the 3rd time, I had a helper inside the car operate the emergency brake so that I could verify that all parts were moving/operating correctly.

Both sides appear to operate correctly, the e-brake is pulled, the shoes spread and when they spead to that certain point, the lever clicks to the next spot down on the star wheel.

Also, when setting it up last, I had the drums torqued down and I repeatedly pulled the e-brake to set the star wheels in their seated position (as per the shop manual)

The passenger side works perfectly! I've closely compared both sides, and everything looks and appears to be done correctly. (i work slowly and carefully on my cars)

It seems to work perfect during install and re-set up. Everything gets spaced perfectly, and I drive off to work in a happy car.

The problem still remains however, that after a dozen miles, that one wheel is getting warm. The next day, same trip to work, the wheel is VERY hot. By this point, the car will not roll on a hill because the adjuster on that wheel has adjusted it way too tight.

Also, these last few days I have had the e-brake cable adjusted loosely in the center console to make sure that I wasn't torquing the wheel by ways of the e-brake cable.

it's 2:30am here, and I'm doing yet another 'back-off' of the adjuster so that I can safely drive to work another day or two. This is getting rediculous.

[Keep]

Ok 3:02 am and I have figured out what's happening through attempting to re-create the fault.

I have the car up in the air, both rear drums/wheels fully installed and torqued down (starting again from scratch to set up these automatic adjusters)

As per the toyota manual, I repeatedly crank the e-brake handle to gradually set up the adjuster to perfect clearance.

After about 15-20 pumps (and therefore clicks on the starwheel) I've got it to the point that I can't pull hard enough to get it to click anymore.
Once released, both wheels still spin freely! Success! Right?

Well, I find that if I press the actual hydraulic brakes and THEN pump the e-brake, I can now get it to click 10-15 more times. The hydraulics are helping spread the shoes and I am able to 'accidentally' set the adjuster to a point where it holds a firm clamp on the drum.

Thing is, since I've owned this camry, I occasionally pull the e-brake while I have hydraulic brakes applied (certain manuevors or while parking on a hill) yet I've never experienced problems like this.

Also, I'm only having this problem on ONE of the rear wheels (wouldn't logic state that this would happen to both sides?)

Anyway, for this week I'm going to refrain from pulling the e-brake while I have the hydraulic brakes applied. I would love to have this remedied to the point where I don't need to contiously avoid that situation though.

Any ideas? Have I missed something?
Anyone care to test this theory out? Go heavy on the brakes then pull the e-brake a couple times, will one or both of your wheels eventually start to clamp?

Let me know.

Kyle

[Kep]

OK Kyle, this is a stretch. Would it be possible that the hydraulic hose on the side that is getting too tight might be breaking down on the inside and not allowing the brakes to release completely?

You seem to have checked everything else that I can think of.

Kep

[Keep]

Hey Everyone,

I did check all the hydraulics, they release fully.
After several days of driving/re-adjusting/driving/re-adjusting (the problem actually occured on the other wheel a few times too)

I simply decided to remove the automatic adjusters alltogether. The setup I've gone with now is adjusting the star wheel manually until I'm happy with the pedal travel and "released" pressure, and I've purchased two special nuts (10mm x 1.5 thread pitch thin bolts, one regular thread direction and one reversed) so that I can "double nut" and prevent the bolt and star wheel from rotating.

This purpose serves me well, I figure that I will need to re-adjust them perhaps twice a year, and since I do my own rotations (and have 3 sets of wheels/tires) the car will be in the air that often anyway.

In conclusion: I'm frustrated with the toyota automatic adjusters. They DO work, and in my case they're doing their job too well (too much).

If anyone should decide to remove the adjuster, you can purchase the two nuts mentioned and turn it into a manual adjustment.

10mm x 1.5 Thread Pitch
Thin Nut
One regular thread direction for the driver side
One reverse thread direction for the passenger side

[kazzXtrismus]

sounds like your adjusters are worn (thread I mean) as they wear it becomes too easy to turn them.

it may also be a arm setup... I once did breaks where i couldn;t get them to stop adjusting too

i found that the bar that pulls up from the ebrake being pulled was on the wrong side of the adjuster (so I thaught)
and the adjuster was installed backwards within the drum...swapped and the slightest bit of clearance moved the adjuster just out of the way and it would only adjust as intended...the clearances are tight close enough to touch one way but not the other...maybe find a pic fo the way it should look...

your fix will do fine for now but you'll find you re adjust fairly often as the rears are very important/valuable on highway driving...best of luck