Cold Start Injector?

[Cgarman]

Okay, my wife's gen 3 3VZ-FE has been having problems starting. It turns fine, but does not start. If you pump the pedal a couple times and then hold it to the floor, it starts right up. Any other action and it takes forever to start. I checked everything I could think of. Plenty of fuel, plenty of spark. Rotor, cap, plugs and wires are all less than 4 months old. I cleaned the throttle body, IAC and EGR, nothing. I replaced the air tube. The problem got a bit better, but it was not solved. I replaced all vacuum lines. I checked the ignition coil. I checked the injectors, fuel supply as well. Everything seems in order. This evening, after replacing the plugs with NGKs, I took off the passenger's side of the intake. It was full of fuel. I disconnected the electrical connection going to what I believe is the cold start injector, at least that is what all the manuals tell me it is. The car started right up. I have let it sit for 45 mins now and will be going out side to try again as soon as I am done writting this. Did I unhook the cold start injector? Is this a cold start injector? Have I solved the problem? I am even close? Anybody else have any hints or tips to try? Just so we are clear, I took a picture. Here is the connection I disconnected.



Thanks Guys
Ken

[78transam]

You've disconnected the cold start injector. If it would help, I could look at the service manual this weekend for cold start injector operation. I've never had a problem with the one on my 3VZ-FE.

[78transam]

If pulling the connector stops the car from flooding, the injector is likely okay and there is an electrical problem. Possible temperature sensor or relay issue. I'll need to look at the service manual.

[Kep]

^+1

Since it changed when you disconnected it (and I expect it will go back to the previous problem if you re-connect it) then the injector appears to be actuating so it is doing its job. Evidently it is getting an incorrect signal. Like 78transam suggests, trace down whatever generates the signal. You can put a multi meter to the cord that plugs in and determine what signal you are getting during what condition to verify this. If it is similar to the Gen2 I-4s there is a cold start timer switch that I believe is controlled by both vacuum and temperature.

Kep

[Cgarman]

Actually, I don't think it is the cold start injector. With it disconnected today, the wife said it ran worse. It started fine this morning and she drove to work. The problem came back when she left to go to lunch. It also reappeared when she went to leave work. In both of these instances, outside temps were mid to upper 80s. Temps this morning were in the mid 70s. I will check the manual and then go from there. I wonder if the ECU could be having some problems?

[Mike Gerber]

Check the engine coolant temperature sensor. You will need a digital volt/ohmenter and the specs from any manual to do this. Check it both cold and warm. It could be out of range. Not postive on your engine, but on most engines it tells the ECU how warm the engine is and what the fuel mixture should be. It may be telling the ECU the engine is always cold.

Mike

[Cgarman]

Coolant temp sensor was the first thing changed when this problem started. It only has about 1000 miles on it. I think that the gasket for the passenger's side of the intake is shot. I don't know what is supposed to be there, but mine is just a piece of metal. I am thinking of adding some blue RTV to see if that helps. I still think that this is something simple that is escaping me right now.

[78transam]

I've never done this myself, so take this with a grain of salt and proceed with care. I've read in more than one car repair article that an unlit propane torch can be used to track down intake manifold vacuum leaks. Point the unlit torch at the suspected leak area and the idle speed will go up if there is a leak. I suppose if you used gear oil instead of propane, the leak would temporarily seal and the idle speed would go down.

[Cgarman]

Come on guys somebody has got to know what my problems is. I think that it might be a gasket issue. Does anybody have pics or knowledge of what the gasket on the passenger's side of the intake should look like. Like I said earlier, mine is just a metal shim. I think it should be a normal gasket. I may try and just make my own. Could it be the ECU???

[jpmarley]

Hello there, I have a 92 3g 2.2L Camry and I was having the same problem, it would crank and crank, and I would step on the gas and it would fire up. I had a few issues, the first being oil in the disributer cap, I cleaned it out and it got a bit better but still the same and then after a check underneath the car I noticed a fuel line was leaking. I repaired the fuel line leak and now it never takes more than 1-2 cranks and it fires right up, so I would think you have a fuel pressure problem just like me.

It is easy to miss during normal troubleshooting, like when check to see if you have fuel, air, and spark and then tune up the things that give you proper amounts of these things, however what seems to be happening is that when you start the car it is building up fuel pressure and when you step on the pedal it helps to bring it up to the correct pressure. You can turn off the car and crank it again and it will start right up, but wait 30 mins or longer and your are back to the same problem, just a thought.

If you already fixed this problem or it was something else let me know.

[Cgarman]

Fuel pressure regulator!!! Ran a fuel pressure test today thanks to my mechanic loaning me the tool. Pressure was 10 to 15 psi above normal. It is suppose to have 32-36 psi at idle. Mine was running 42 to 48 psi. Pinched the fuel return line and the pressure jumped to 90 psi. With the engine off, it held the psi at 32-35... it is suppose to be 21 psi. Went to the local pull-a-part and got two fuel regulators for 10 bucks. Also bought a rear sway bar and seats for my 77 Celica for 35 bucks total for both, but that is another story. Gonna put the new regulators in tomorrow morning. Hopefully, that will solve the problem!! Thanks everyone for their input!!

[1996camry]

Keep us posted if the regulator fix your car problem...


thks,

[Cgarman]

Resurrecting this from the dead. I still have the starting problem. Things changed so far:
New Coolant Temp Sensor
New Air tube
new vaccum lines
new fuel pressure regulator
New VVS valve
Used, cleaned injectors.

I have cleaned the throttle body, IAC and EGR numerous times.
I am still having the starting problem. The only thing I can think of is that the vaccum lines that I used to replace all the old ones is just a bit too big. This might cause enough of a leak that it is not noticeable at idle, but is messing up the start. I am getting really good at removing the intake manifold. The new injector O-rings are giving me fits!!! I can now remove and re-install the intake manifold in under 45 minutes I am wondering if it could be the intake manifold gasket after all. The gasket seems to be two pieces of metal sandwiched together. Well, when I removed the intake manifold this weekend for the first of many, many, many times I noticed that it seemed like the gasket was splitting. It wasn't like it had cracks in it, more like the two pieces of metal were separating. Think I need a new gasket? Maybe that has been the problem all along? Thoughts? Questions? Want me to go jump in a lake? Sorry, it is actually the intake Plenum gasket and not the actual manifold

[renmike]

I had a problem recently where I'd to go start it and it's run for about 3-5 seconds then just die. I knew I was getting spark and fuel, it ended up being my MAF sensor. I picked up another one at the pull a part for about 20 bucks (I had a spare supra one as well) and it started right up and worked fine since. I don't know if this would relate to your problem or not but I don't see where you took this into consideration, so it's just a suggestion to check out.

[Albuynp Ryeno]

I got like the exact same problem. I'm gonna go check my coolant temp sensor and the gas tank pressure. I've been feeling that the tank pressure has been too high.

Also I've been experimenting with premium gas. Yesterday i tried starting the car after letting it sit overnight. It started the first time, but it seemed to chug for like 3 sec, then went to normal.