R12 and Freeze 12

[mykyna]

my 93 Camry SE (170k) replaced compressor last year and the mechanice used freeze 12 (he didn't tell me). Now I send to anther mechanic and he filled with R12 (half LB). Is there any issue to mix R12 and Freeze 12? Can it damage compressor or expansion valve? Thanks so much!!

[JohnGD]

From what I can Google it's a blend of two refrigerants. It's just 70-90% R-134a and 10-30% R-142b (1,1,1,2-Tetrafluoroethane and 1-Chloro 1,1-Difluoroethane). http://www.freeze12.com/pdf/6030.pdf

That's the problem with these mechanics, they put crazy things into your car without telling you. It might have been better if he just properly retrofitted it to R-134a. I mean, you now have 70-90% of it anyway.

The problem with this is that AC places will ask you if you have any "snake oil" in there and use a sniffer (read: lie detector) to make sure you're telling the truth before working on it.

[JohnGD]

The 1993 had a massive recall on defective (Denso?) expansion valves. I wonder if yours was replaced?

[mykyna]

It is true I have replaced expansion valve three years ago. Now the AC looks like working ok - but my question is: is it ok to keep the mixed R12&R134 (or Freeze 12) situation? Do I need to drain it out and replace with pure R12? (or pure Freeze 12)

[Stillrunning]

Originally Posted by mykyna

but my question is: is it ok to keep the mixed R12&R134 (or Freeze 12) situation? Do I need to drain it out and replace with pure R12? (or pure Freeze 12)

I'd phone these guys: http://www.freeze12.com/techsup.htm

I would not expect mixing is advised as the two compounds have different cooling characteristics. I would have the R12 recaptured and disposed of in a legal and safe way, then recharge with Freeze12 or another R12 alternative like Enviro-Safe.

[CharmCityES]

id have the whole system evacuated and then convert over to modern and readily avalible R134a refrigerant, or just recharge the whole system with R-12...
youre not supposed to mix refrigerants

[djb2]

Ermmm, you are pretty much completely screwed.

No shop will touch a witches brew of R12, R134a and other stuff. Only a licensed show is allowed to work on A/C systems*, and a licensed shop is obligated to recover the refrigerant. But they don't want to contaminate their equipment with a mix.

(Advice to anyone considering Freeze-12 or another mix: call a few shops and ask if they will work on a Freeze-12 system.)

The first shop is likely the one that was evil. If they convert away from the original refrigerant they must change the fittings to ones unique to that refrigerant and install a label.

This may be difficult to recover from. The refrigerant might just leak out on its own. (My guess is that a shop that will take it out of you system will probably have a "leak" rather than pay for disposal.) But you still should clean the unknown oil mix from the system.

Or you can just hope for the best, and do a sleazy R134a conversion on your near-empty system with new caps and plain R134a (no oil charge).

* You can work on your own system, or help a friend at no charge, without a license. If you don't have a license most of the rules don't apply.

[hill8570]

Originally Posted by mykyna

It is true I have replaced expansion valve three years ago. Now the AC looks like working ok - but my question is: is it ok to keep the mixed R12&R134 (or Freeze 12) situation? Do I need to drain it out and replace with pure R12? (or pure Freeze 12)

It should co-exist OK, but it's really a kludge. A Freeze12 conversion is supposed to replace the hi / low ports with different valves, so it's impossible to use R-12 equipment to recharge the system. The idiots who did the Freeze12 charge are incompetent hacks. If it were my rig, I'd get it flushed and changed out for pure R-12 I (which actually is fairly reasonably priced these days).

[rholzboog]

i am a hvac engineer and thay screwed you make them pay for it