I SWEAR to God, I wanna KICK this car!!!

[nevanerviss]

Before I get flamed, I did search, and have found some new things to check, but I needed some more opinions...

OK... Here's the deal... About 7 months ago, I had a coolant leak... I was pretty sure that it came from the water pump... As luck would have it, I read DZ63's water pump DIY, and did it myself... Great!!! Car worked fine, and no issues... Well, NOW, the leak is back again, only difference is, I can't drive 10 miles without overheating... I spoke with a member here, and he suggested that it was a water pump screw that may have gotten mad at me... So I tore the whole flipping thing down again, and it doesn't look like that's it... Anyways, I need some help figuring out this problem...

Things I've done:

Water pump (and gasket)
Timing Belt
Idler
Tensioner
Thermostat (and gasket)
Radiator
Hoses (radiator)

I didn't do the cam and crank seals, as that didn't appear to be a problem while I was in there the first time, but now I will... I also did a compression test on all four cylinders to rule out the head gasket... All tested between 178 and 182 psi... No coolant in oil or vice versa, no bluish-white smoke out the tailpipe, and no sweet-smelling exhaust... I disconnected the fans, so they run all the time, and STILL overheating... (I intend to change the temp sensor, as well)

While I know that a compression test is not a concrete way of ruling out a head gasket, nor does it test the block, but I'd like to think that it's not the head gasket because of the compression test results...(<--Wishful thinking)

What else could it be?? I can't see where the coolant is coming from directly, but the the ground is wet in the timing cover area...

Ya think it may be the o-ring BEHIND the water pump (which I did not change)? Would that result in ALL of my coolant coming out of the car?? If so, where would I get the aforementioned o-ring? (Vato-Zone just looked at me like I was the one that's retarded...)

Please help me, I'm just a girl trying to save some money and NOT get gang-raped at the dealershit (<---NOT a typo)...

Oh yeah, Thanks again, DZ63!!!

[96paseo]

I would think its the water pump housing gasket. Other places it could leak would be the hoses for the oil filter housing or the heater core hoses.

[JohnGD]

If you find the individual part number you can order them (for example, various FelPro gaskets/o-rings). But it's best to get a Beck Arnley kit that has them all, at ~$8 a time saver.

http://shop.oreillyauto.com/product_...ar/0394078.jpg

Did the pump come with a rubber or paper gasket? If it's a paper gasket you have to seal it with a thin layer of water pump RTV (about business card thickness on both sides will do). Otherwise it'll leak. Same with that small paper outlet gasket. But NO RTV on rubber o-rings.

http://www.permatex.com/images/Displ...otos/22071.jpg

If you get back in there check to see if it's the gasket or the weep hole leaking coolant. Of course, right above it is the head gasket. Inspect that area too with the timing cover off.

Originally Posted by nevanerviss

What else could it be?? I can't see where the coolant is coming from directly, but the the ground is wet in the timing cover area...

Ya think it may be the o-ring BEHIND the water pump (which I did not change)? Would that result in ALL of my coolant coming out of the car?? If so, where would I get the aforementioned o-ring? (Vato-Zone just looked at me like I was the one that's retarded...)

Please help me, I'm just a girl trying to save some money and NOT get gang-raped at the dealershit (<---NOT a typo)...

Oh yeah, Thanks again, DZ63!!!

[cruisn76]

what about the coolant sensor? or is that the same as the t-stat?

[96CamrySport]

You've got a no-flow problem. You're looking at either a faulty water pump, a thermostat thatdoesn't open all the way, or a blockage somewhere in the cooling system (likely the radiator, except I just reread your post and you replaced it already). The coolant temp sensor is a known weak link in the system, but every one I've run across (except one from a Jag s-type) has failed and shows cold. However, if the fans cycle on and turn off again when everything is together, it's likely your gauge sender is bad.

I'm glad there are some girls out there who can walk the walk. I'm a pro and have talked cars for years to my wife but she doesn't have the least bit of interest. Oh well. You sound like a savvy car owner/diy'er - props.

Oh, the most accurate way to diagnose this may involve buying a $25 non-contact laser thermometer. That way, you can find out exactly how hot it is, and how well the radiator is shedding heat.

[nevanerviss]

Originally Posted by 96CamrySport

You've got a no-flow problem. You're looking at either a faulty water pump, a thermostat thatdoesn't open all the way, or a blockage somewhere in the cooling system (likely the radiator, except I just reread your post and you replaced it already). The coolant temp sensor is a known weak link in the system, but every one I've run across (except one from a Jag s-type) has failed and shows cold. However, if the fans cycle on and turn off again when everything is together, it's likely your gauge sender is bad.

I'm glad there are some girls out there who can walk the walk. I'm a pro and have talked cars for years to my wife but she doesn't have the least bit of interest. Oh well. You sound like a savvy car owner/diy'er - props.

Oh, the most accurate way to diagnose this may involve buying a $25 non-contact laser thermometer. That way, you can find out exactly how hot it is, and how well the radiator is shedding heat.

Thanks for the props!! I'm not sure how savvy I am, I just have tools and am not afraid to jump in there and do it, although setting the timing after I got done was a little daunting...

So far, what I've done is tear down the WHOLE flipping thing again, and got parts today for the car...

Timing Belt kit, which includes a new water pump and ALL applicable gaskets, crank and cam seals, oil pump o-ring and seal, a new t-stat, and a new radiator cap... Tomorrow, I'm picking up some new spark plugs as well...

I'm not sure how to back-flush a radiator to clear any blockages, so if someone could walk me through it, that'd be great...

The first time I did this job, it took me almost two weeks... THIS time, I had it all torn down in less than 3 hours, and that's WITH cigarette breaks!!

I guess practice really does make perfect!!!

[96paseo]

I'm not sure how to back-flush a radiator to clear any blockages, so if someone could walk me through it, that'd be great...

Its pretty easy. Park the car in teh driveway. Drain all coolant from the engine and radiator. Remove both radiator hoses from the t-stat housing and water outlet housing. Keep them attached to the radiator. Take your garden hose and flow water through the radiator until the water runs clean. You can also flush the block by running water into the water outlet housing.

[dz63]

Originally Posted by JohnGD

If you find the individual part number you can order them (for example, various FelPro gaskets/o-rings). But it's best to get a Beck Arnley kit that has them all, at ~$8 a time saver.

http://shop.oreillyauto.com/product_...ar/0394078.jpg

Did the pump come with a rubber or paper gasket? If it's a paper gasket you have to seal it with a thin layer of water pump RTV (about business card thickness on both sides will do). Otherwise it'll leak. Same with that small paper outlet gasket. But NO RTV on rubber o-rings.

http://www.permatex.com/images/Displ...otos/22071.jpg

If you get back in there check to see if it's the gasket or the weep hole leaking coolant. Of course, right above it is the head gasket. Inspect that area too with the timing cover off.

JohnGD - thanks for your input.

I didn't use RTV on my paper water pump gasket when I wrote my '96 Camry timing belt procedure. My previous water pump did not have RTV on it and it survived 100,000km. Also, the Haynes manual does not mention it and my current water pump (about 15,000km) is not leaking. However, that is not to say that I have done it correctly. I may just be lucky.

My concern is that I may be misleading people like nevanerviss who are trusting the advice on this forum. If it is a concensus opinion, I will edit the procedure and add the RTV to this step. If possible, would anybody else (preferably those with automotive experience) please add their opinion/experience to this thread?

[Gibson99]

in my experience, if the gasket really is just a sheet of paper, i usually don't use it, and i just put a thin bead of black RTV all the way around the water pump.

if the gasket is waxy or thicker than construction paper, i WILL use it, and i'll only have a couple little dabs of rtv just to hold the gasket in place while i'm assembling it. the rtv used there has no real bearing on sealing things, it's just for convenience. same deal w/ the oil pump "o-ring" that's shaped more like the outline of a lake... i put a few dabs of RTV or even just axle grease in the channel to hold it in there while i'm putting the oil pump on.

either way you have to be certain you have removed 100% of the old gasket material from the mating surface before reassembly.

i also put a bead of rtv on the water neck (thermostat housing) before reassembly, even if the thermostat has an o-ring.

IMHO, you can't over-seal a cooling system, since the radiator cap is the pressure relief valve. as long as you don't use too much rtv to where it leaves globs inside passages and possibly becomes a partial blockage, you're fine.

to 96camrysport - i hear you on the wife angle. my wife is interested, and has always been skeptical of mechanics, but now that she's married to one, she isn't quite as pessimistic. she seems interested at times, but never has been mechanically inclined. Maybe next time I do a brake job (on disk brakes) i'll have her try doing it to see what she thinks. i wouldn't be so mean as to make her do drum brakes... hell - when it comes time to replace the shoes on the rear of her accord, i'm planning to buy all the parts to convert the damn thing to disk brakes! to me, it seems like almost the same amount of work when it comes down to all those stupid springs in there... sure it'll be more expensive, but it will mean better braking and a lot less work next time!

[2wickedtoyz]

damn sorry that didn't fix it. but hey these guy hooked you up.