'00 5s-fe loose throttle valve cable, how is yours ? - Toyota Nation Forum : Toyota Car and Truck Forums


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Old 01-26-2010, 09:37 AM   #1 (permalink)
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'00 5s-fe loose throttle valve cable, how is yours ?

hi there,

i have another very long thread about some annoying stuff in my car. i understand that most people will not even look through that topic (8 pages long now), but i have to know something from you guys (and gals).

when you touch by hand or pull with your fingers a throttle valve cable (or throttle assembly cable) do you feel like it wants to go back to rubber casing or it rather stays put where you leave it (after pulling out a bit) ?

just to make it clear, i'm talking about bottom cable which goes from "wheel thing" down to your transmission box.

This cable controls the pressure in your automatic transmission.

I'm trying to determine how bad (loose) mine is and trying to understand why the shop didn't want to get it fixed (because car runs mostly fine).
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Old 01-26-2010, 10:02 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by fenixus View Post
hi there,

i have another very long thread about some annoying stuff in my car. i understand that most people will not even look through that topic (8 pages long now), but i have to know something from you guys (and gals).

when you touch by hand or pull with your fingers a throttle valve cable (or throttle assembly cable) do you feel like it wants to go back to rubber casing or it rather stays put where you leave it (after pulling out a bit) ?

just to make it clear, i'm talking about bottom cable which goes from "wheel thing" down to your transmission box.

This cable controls the pressure in your automatic transmission.

I'm trying to determine how bad (loose) mine is and trying to understand why the shop didn't want to get it fixed (because car runs mostly fine).
If your kick-down works dont worry about it.
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Old 01-26-2010, 10:36 AM   #3 (permalink)
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I can assume kick-down works as gears are shifting let's say properly up & down.
still no tension on that cable worries me. doesn't it mean that tranny is running at low pressure then and it can affect gears shifting in any way or worse can lead to premature tranny failure ?
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Old 01-26-2010, 10:48 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by fenixus View Post
I can assume kick-down works as gears are shifting let's say properly up & down.
still no tension on that cable worries me. doesn't it mean that tranny is running at low pressure then and it can affect gears shifting in any way or worse can lead to premature tranny failure ?
For starters....thats the kickdown cable. When you floor the gas pedal tension is on the cable, pulls a tiny arm inside the trans which causes the trans to downshift. It doesnt take much pressure to pull the kickdown arm. Trans pressure is controlled by solenoids on the valve body inside the trans. If your car is shifting normally you have no worries. If you start adjusting that cable you will lose kickdown until it is readjusted.
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Old 01-26-2010, 10:54 AM   #5 (permalink)
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To expand slightly on frenum49's info, the only reason to tighten up that cable is if you want kick-down to be more sensitive (not have to whack the accelerator quite so far down). Not recommending it, but some folks seem to like it that way.

There's a thread over in the DIY section: Quicker Transmission Shifting if you're interested in that sort of thing

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Old 01-26-2010, 10:57 AM   #6 (permalink)
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hmm

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Originally Posted by hill8570 View Post
To expand slightly on frenum49's info, the only reason to tighten up that cable is if you want kick-down to be more sensitive (not have to whack the accelerator quite so far down). Not recommending it, but some folks seem to like it that way.
True but it is pretty annoying when cruise control keeps downshifting the trans over the slightest hill.
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Old 01-26-2010, 11:04 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by hill8570 View Post
To expand slightly on frenum49's info, the only reason to tighten up that cable is if you want kick-down to be more sensitive (not have to whack the accelerator quite so far down). Not recommending it, but some folks seem to like it that way.

There's a thread over in the DIY section: Quicker Transmission Shifting if you're interested in that sort of thing
that is exactly what i followed 4 months ago. then after 2 weeks i returned the nuts on kick-down cable to normal position (tension on cable did not come back though).

hmm, the thing is that i had adjusted it once in past using nuts that i moved almost all the way to left (tight setting if i'm not wrong). problem is that cable actually lost tension then and after returning those nuts to normal/middle position cable is still loose.

I started playing with that cable like 4 months ago because my tranny was very annoying with harsh up & down shifting in overdrive. shouldn't this cable have some specific tension per manufacturer specs ? all i can say it's loose ...
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Last edited by fenixus; 01-26-2010 at 11:07 AM.
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Old 01-26-2010, 11:08 AM   #8 (permalink)
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hmm

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Originally Posted by fenixus View Post
that is exactly what i followed 4 months ago. then after 2 weeks i returned the nuts on kick-down cable to normal position (tension on cable did not come back though).

hmm, the thing is that i had adjusted it once in past using nuts that i moved almost all the way to left (tight setting if i'm not wrong). problem is that cable actually lost tension then and after returning those nuts to normal/middle position cable is still loose.

I started playing with that cable like 4 months ago because my tranny was very annoying with harsh up & down shifting in overdrive. shouldn't this cable have some specific tension per manufacturer specs ? all i can say it's loose ...
Sigh....
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Old 01-26-2010, 11:17 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by fenixus View Post
...shouldn't this cable have some specific tension per manufacturer specs ? all i can say it's loose ...
Take a look at www.camrystuff.com , Generation 4, Diagnostics, page DI-395 if you want to adjust back to factory specs.
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Old 01-26-2010, 11:33 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by frenum49 View Post
Sigh....
frenum49, did i break it back then?

so which one is a "kick-down" the bottom one ? from that DYI it's confusing as in picture they are described as PINK kick-down and RED throttle, then in instructions it says to adjust the RED kick-down ... so back then i adjusted both of them. problem for me that throttle was staying open at idle and car was pulling forward at stop unless I was really pressing on brakes. i fixed it then by adjusting the throttle cable (top on on my 5sfe) back to middle/normal and leaving kick-down (bottom) modified. car was running great, just reversed the mod later because i was going to flush tranny anyways at the dealer.

funny thing that yesterday i visited a transmission shop (ATRA certified) and they didn't find anything wrong with this cable ... (hey it's loose!!) because as they say "car runs fine".

thanks for factory manual hill8570, reading it now.

EDIT:
i think i followed those instructions to adjust properly the throttle cable (top one, right?) which opens valve in TB, i did it like a month ago. the distance was between 0-1mm anyways so i had it all right.

y problem is with kick-down cable. no matter how i move nuts the cable stays loose. it's loose on the transmission end, but it seems to be catching, it's just loose.
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Old 01-26-2010, 12:27 PM   #11 (permalink)
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OK, since my lack of technical dictionary probably confuses you ... I will try catching that loose throttle kick-down cable (bottom on wheel) on video and post it sooner or later if weather allows.

then you could tell me if yours is same like mine or different. otherwise I don't even know if there is actually anything wrong with it (ATRA mechanic didn't want to fix it).

EDIT:
my flashlight died, so no pics as of yet. one thing though, i pulled that cable harder than last time and in deed it goes back into the hole on its own, so it's not tragic I guess. still the cable looks like loose at idle and there is no tension on it (kick down).

as the matter of fact I adjusted it once per Haynes leaving 0-1mm slack and it seems very loose to me. good news is it has to be working somehow, just pulling on the end further than it's supposed to I guess.

once i get new batteries I will try taking some pics to show you how loose it is at idle.
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Old 01-26-2010, 07:56 PM   #12 (permalink)
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pictures of my throttle valve cable (kick down) - tension and adjustment

was too dark for a video (needed strong flashlight and a flash), so here are pics instead:

a) this is how far i can pull the kickdown cable with fingers at no real force used


b) this is how far i can push the cable with a finger (no force) from bottom


c) this is how it looks when i removed the finger (note it stayed like that on its own)


d) this is a close up on nuts adjustment on the kickdown cable (bottom of wheel), doesn't it look good as per manual ?


e) and similar nuts on top of throttle cable (top of wheel), the one connected to accel pedal


i hope now you can have a better understanding of what i' am looking at. so is it normal and just forget it or there is something abnormal about it ?

thanks for your opinions in advance ... and for you patience
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Old 01-26-2010, 08:19 PM   #13 (permalink)
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At the idle position it does look weird staying loose like that.

What do you mean by "it seems to be catching"?

However, the more important thing is that if you were to pull out the cable gently. Do you feel spring pressure? Does the cable return into the tube by spring pressure?

If the spring pressure does exist, which I thought it wasn't, then look on the tube and see if there is evidence of bending.



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y problem is with kick-down cable. no matter how i move nuts the cable stays loose. it's loose on the transmission end, but it seems to be catching, it's just loose.
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Old 01-26-2010, 08:43 PM   #14 (permalink)
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this is how far i can pull the kickdown cable with fingers at no real force used
Best guess would be that the stopper (the little dohicky that is staked to the cable) has slipped a mite. I know if you replace that cable, part of the calibration is to get things pretty tight before staking the stopper on the cable, so it's not like it can't slip if under enough force.
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Old 01-26-2010, 09:13 PM   #15 (permalink)
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At the idle position it does look weird staying loose like that.

What do you mean by "it seems to be catching"?

However, the more important thing is that if you were to pull out the cable gently. Do you feel spring pressure? Does the cable return into the tube by spring pressure?

If the spring pressure does exist, which I thought it wasn't, then look on the tube and see if there is evidence of bending.
by catching i meant that there was strong resistance on the end when pulling out a little further than as pictured in no. a)

yes, i felt a spring tension and when i released the cable from that far it was gently springing into the rubber shielding. so no way about fishing the whole cable out.
on the other hand when i was pulling gently at first time i pulled a little like 1/4'' and noticed cable is so loose that it stays in that position (check pictures with a finger test).

John, i don't get what you mean in your sentence in bold. which tube you mean ? the thing i named "rubber shielding" sitting around the cable itself ?
then by bending you mean like what exactly ? how do i know how that tube is supposed to look like in a new car ?

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Originally Posted by hill8570 View Post
Best guess would be that the stopper (the little dohicky that is staked to the cable) has slipped a mite. I know if you replace that cable, part of the calibration is to get things pretty tight before staking the stopper on the cable, so it's not like it can't slip if under enough force.
before it got it that loose which was when reversing the mod explained in above DIY, i heard a single metallic clunk coming from transmission end of kick down cable. i thought i got it broken, but fortunately it's still hooked as it is "catching" at some point.
what you say makes a lot of sense now.

so do i have to replace that cable or simply moving something on the other end will fix the one i got ? either case involves opening the valve body, correct ?

now can someone explain to me please, why trained ATRA technicians have not mentioned such possibility ?
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Last edited by fenixus; 01-26-2010 at 09:29 PM.
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