power steering leak - best guess needed

[Judge]

woke up this morning and there was a puddle of steering fluid by the drivers door

i stuck my head under the car and saw slow dripping from the frame itself, i checked CV boot and it was in a good shape, and i checked steering boot it was not leaking but was wet from whatever is leaking, and i couldn't see much more

i looked on the other side (passenger) and there too i found some power steering fluid, lot less, but still dripping from the frame itself to the ground

i followed the hoses from the reservoir as far as i could from the top side and couldn't find any leaks... so this evil is somewhere under the engine on top of the main frame bar (that goes along the imaginary front axl), i checked the linkage from the steering wheel to the actuator and that whole assembly is dry

pump is angry since it doesn't have fluid, and i don't want to add any more at the moment since it will drain on the floor of the (shared) garage...

my guess is/was something loose or broken but not sure where to look and am hoping to explore a few directions on my own before admitting defeat and hauling it to the mechanic - leak is fast 2 days the whole power steering reservoir (car was off the entire time)

she is a beauty - 98 V6 CE 1MZ engine that in its pre-teen year still effortlessly goes up to 110-118 mph on i-280 (outside SF)

thanks for any and all help/suggestions etc.

[chronoti]

look at the high pressure line i had to change mine out last year (96), it runs along the back side of the engine, also your gonna toast the pump not having fluid

[flyeri]

Mine leaked from the rack on the right side. It leaked out of the boot on the end of the rack and down onto and into the frame. Then when it sat on a little incline it poured out and looked like a major leak. If you are out of fluid then you may have a different problem but I would examine the rack closely. It never appeared to be that, in fact by the time the fluid leaked out of the frame it was kinda brown and looked like motor oil. We kept thinking it was from the oil pump.

[Nervous]

I bet this is rack & pinion leaking. Possibly along with high pressure and/or suction hose and steering pump - at this age all them may leak. On my 96 Camry (141K miles) I already rebuilt P/S pump and replace suction hose (on 90K), and recently have replaced the rack and high pressure p/s hose. The topic with pictures about replacing rack & pressure hose is in FAQ.

[Judge]

the fact that it leaks while engine is off makes me think that i may have a leak before the pump - am i completely off here? can the system drain itself while pump is off through the high pressure components?

i don't have a way of lifting the car high enough (both sides) so i can stick my head deeper inside through the wheel well, my shop can't see me till Monday, so i have 3 days of poking around in the dark...

thanks for your help!

Judge

[Nervous]

If rack & pinion is leaking, then most likely it leaks into boots and only then leaks from boots to frame and floor. So, the boot may accumulate the fluid while engine is on and just slowly release it even when engine is off.
You really need to lift up your car, remove wheel(s) and examine. I cleaned suspicious area by brake cleaner and wiped out all traces of ATF and just started the engine. By turning wheels all the way left and right I found the leak from the rack's left boot. You may have a look on photo of it at the beginning of this topic:
DIY: GEN3 1MZ Replacing Steering Rack and P/S Pressure Hose (w/pics)
When my P/S pump was leaking it was even easier: again, I cleaned up it by brake cleaner and just started the engine. You'll see fluid oozing (or leaking) from the pump (either from one of the hose's connection, from the shaft seal or somewhere else).
If hose is leaking it should be also pretty easy to find out by cleaning them and starting engine. I wouldn't recommend to use brake cleaner on rubber parts, though. Paper towel with soap should work as well.

[Judge]

i think my next step, until i figure out how to raise the car, is to clean up the garage floor, wipe off as much of the frame as possible, and refill the power steering reservoir, if it still leaks (without ever turning the car on) i will examine the intake and return hoses as well as the pump itself for loose parts...

thanks again for your help

[Judge]

that was the right side - i couldn't find a hole in the boot, but everything around it is covered in oil, including P/S pump, however couldn't find leaks on the pump itself... was still hoping that something was leaking from above...



left side, and my hope for easy solution was dimming



located the hole...

now back to reading the threads about where to order cheap rack, and to find a shop that is up for the job...

[Nervous]

So, rack it is. Check this topics:
DIY: GEN3 1MZ Replacing Steering Rack and P/S Pressure Hose (w/pics)
http://www.toyotanation.com/forum/t108185.html

[73sport]

Bingo -
As you see, each one of those ribs in boot (bellows) holds a good deal of fluid until its turned or the level is high enough to leak.

One thing I should add to the post is to clarify why I tied the steering wheel in place with the seat belt. Rack & pinion and 2 Axels Replaced! <http://www.toyotanation.com/forum/t108185.html >

Now I'm not sure HOW Toyota couples the AIR BAG hot wires through the steering column, but I figure an once of prevention. . . . Please read on for your safety!

DETAILS: Some cars can be damaged by removing the rack and spinning the steering wheel freely. Not that anyone has a need to do such a thing, but if you do it could damage or disable the AIRBAG deployment mechanism. That is part of the reason I tied it in place with the seat belt.

If they used slip rings to energize the bag, no big deal. Spin it. It should be fine. If they used a wound wire, you can damage it. Even turning it one full revolution from center could cause a latent failure.

Good luck, post up if you need help.

[Nervous]

I wouldn't recommend a "cheap rack". You don't want to replace it in a year again. Here is the topic about racks, prices and warranties:
Remanufactured steering rack & pinion - which brand?

[Judge]

i am sure you guys have had to answer this one time and time again:

I am debating between doing this on my own and just having it done by a shop, I need my car for work as I don't have alternate transport means... either way i think i am better off getting the parts on my own as opposed to having my shop, here are the options i've found so far...

Maval Re-manufactured Steering Rack and Pinon
Toyota Camry Steering Rack Seal Kit
Toyota Part from the dealership

open to any other suggestions as well, have to get the ball moving on Monday
cheers

[Nervous]

You don't need "Toyota Camry Steering Rack Seal Kit" unless you want to rebuild your current rack with new gaskets (much more difficult than just replacing the rack)
Maval and dealership part is the same. As far as I know dealerships sells Maval remanufactured racks. They do not sell new units for old toyotas. As I wrote in my investigation of racks, these units are significantly more expensive (1.5 times) and with pretty poor warranty (12 mo).
I'd recommend Beck Arnley at rockauto.com. 3 years / 50,000 miles warranty for just 220 (after you send your core back). I know that AdvanceAutoParts sells Beck Arnley racks too, but again - more expensive even if you add shipping both directions (at least for my Zip code).

[Judge]

SF toyota parts prices - also, have to add 9.5% state tax to prices bellow....

toyota dealership (new) rack - $869
toyota dealership (re-manufactured) rack - $497
garage ordered OEM (remanufactured) rack - $408
Kragen - Cardone (remanufactured) rack - $193
Beck/Arnley (remanufactured) rack - $290
Rare Parts (remanufactured) rack - $252
Atsco (remanufactured) rack - $170

my shop wants $225 for the 'hands' to get the job done

i am leaning towards Cardone - mainly because its the only one that i can go pick up today...