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VIDEO! Need engine MASTER to figure this one out. grinding noise rev past 2700 rpm
I have a 1998 ES300 with 230k + miles on it. i am a very capable mechanic but i am unable to pinpoint where and what this noise is.
The revs are up a bit past 3000rpm and as it dies down a noise & vibration (slight, you can only feel it but its not so bad you can see the engine shake or any parts on it) comes in at first i thought it was a exhaust leak sort of problem, fixed that. then i thought maybe the timing belt is loose (tensioner) and it was hitting the cover in the lower parts, changed tensioner and didnt change the issue, ran the engine with the timing belt cover off, no visual vibration of the belt. then i noticed that the power steering belt was shaking when the noise came in. tightened it, removed it ran the motor both times, no change. The last thing i can think of is a loose fly wheel or my crank shaft bearings are shot.
while driving the car, you can hear it in between shifts if shifting above 2800 rpm but you cannot feel any vibration.
Please help if you can. i need an engine GURU to solve this one.
Hmm . . . That is very interesting. 1st off, that engine has some loose valves making all the ticking. Once you solve this other issue, go back and adjust the valves with all those cool little shims.
How about the A/C compressor clutch? Try that same engine rev with the A/C on and see if it changes it.
Maybe you did this already when the P/S belt was off? If after doing the A/C on and it changes nothing, PULL all the belts (PS, A/C, and Alt). Anything?
How does the trans work and what is the fluid condition? Any issues what so ever? Anything?
This is sad, but I've heard that before and don't recall the nature of the fix. Off hand, I'd venture to guess you've got a busted flexplate just past the hub bolts securing the flexplate to the crankshaft. Pull the inspection cover and look for a splatter of red looking rust particles. Get a light and mirror and have it up in the air so you can get a good look. You may even want to pull the starter and look from that direction.
I'm curious as to what you'll find.
What's the history on the timing belt, water pump and the idler pulleys? Any chance one of the bearings in that area let go?
Do you have a stethoscope? I use long handled screwdriver up to the ear and it works pretty well. Wood dowels like a Toilet plunger may be OK to. Careful what end you stick in yer ear!
Let us know about the engine maintenance history. Is it past due for t-belt, pump, and pulleys?
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95 Cam, V6 1MZ, Auto A541E, LE >245,000 miles!
Pull the timing belt cover off and look at the belt while car is running see if its shifting around
I actually did this already while changing the timing belt tensioner.
and i had the wheel off checking everything, harmonic pulley is solid.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 73sport
Hmm . . . That is very interesting. 1st off, that engine has some loose valves making all the ticking. Once you solve this other issue, go back and adjust the valves with all those cool little shims.
How about the A/C compressor clutch? Try that same engine rev with the A/C on and see if it changes it.
Maybe you did this already when the P/S belt was off? If after doing the A/C on and it changes nothing, PULL all the belts (PS, A/C, and Alt). Anything?
How does the trans work and what is the fluid condition? Any issues what so ever? Anything?
This is sad, but I've heard that before and don't recall the nature of the fix. Off hand, I'd venture to guess you've got a busted flexplate just past the hub bolts securing the flexplate to the crankshaft. Pull the inspection cover and look for a splatter of red looking rust particles. Get a light and mirror and have it up in the air so you can get a good look. You may even want to pull the starter and look from that direction.
I'm curious as to what you'll find.
What's the history on the timing belt, water pump and the idler pulleys? Any chance one of the bearings in that area let go?
Do you have a stethoscope? I use long handled screwdriver up to the ear and it works pretty well. Wood dowels like a Toilet plunger may be OK to. Care what end you stick in yer ear!
Let us know about the engine maintenance history. Is it past due for t-belt, pump, and pulleys?
i did adjust the front bank, and i will do the rear if it is even worth my time to keep the car after this is fixed.
The car has had 2 timing belt changes, one water pump change, all on time. the tensioner pulley was changed at the same time as the timing belt. (those kits online) I did actually pull the starter to check and look in, i saw the welds from the torque converter and the fly wheel. everything seemed fine, no wiggles no excessive wear on the teeth.
I pulled all aux belts and ran, no change.
I will have to take a look at this inspection cover you speak of though, thank you.
2nd go round (me listening). Sounds like it still has at least two exhaust leaks. Doesn't the original post say they were fixed?
Either way, it sounds metallic in nature. . .
And what's up with the Dog Bone? What is that?
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95 Cam, V6 1MZ, Auto A541E, LE >245,000 miles!
oil was changed about 1000 miles ago, motor mounts are good. trans shifts are firm, timing belt bearings are smooth.
no exhaust leaks (honestly!)
the dog bone is a long story...lol i used poly urethane to fix it, i was planning on letting the car sit for a while so it can dry, but i had an emergency wheere i had to use it. so it popped and got messed up. it holds solidly though.
The car has had 2 timing belt changes, one water pump change, all on time. the tensioner pulley was changed at the same time as the timing belt. (those kits online) I did actually pull the starter to check and look in, i saw the welds from the torque converter and the fly wheel. everything seemed fine, no wiggles no excessive wear on the teeth.
OK - if all that was done on time - 90,000 miles than its due again at 230,000!
Also, while looking for this RED RUST, well its a tell tale sign that metal parts are chaffing and wearing on one another. Do your best to look upwards towards the crankshaft and rub your finger on the surrounding grime for a close inspection.
Does it do this sound in gear? If your doing 60mph and manually stick it into 2nd, does it make this sound?
__________________
95 Cam, V6 1MZ, Auto A541E, LE >245,000 miles!
OK - if all that was done on time - 90,000 miles than its due again at 230,000!
Also, while looking for this RED RUST, well its a tell tale sign that metal parts are chaffing and wearing on one another. Do your best to look upwards towards the crankshaft and rub your finger on the surrounding grime for a close inspection.
Does it do this sound in gear? If your doing 60mph and manually stick it into 2nd, does it make this sound?
Yes it does, 2nd gear down shift will continuously make the noise until the revs come under 2800rpm
Yes it does, 2nd gear down shift will continuously make the noise until the revs come under 2800rpm
I'll say its your torque converters going south. The RPM is roughly the stall speed. Upon accelleration the stator inside the t/c is pushed away from the tubine shell (I think), upon deceleration it is drawn towards the turbine. I'd guess it lost a thrust washer/bearing and it eating itself. You will find metal in the trans in very small particles.
Drain the fluid in something clean and look at the fluid in the sun light. I bet you find it full of tiny metallic particals. Skim it with a magnet too. That sound IS metalic in nature and it will show itself soon enough.
Yours may not have this, but while you have the inspection cover off, rotate the engine by hand and look for a drain plug in the converter (hole in flex plate will align with this plug). If it has one, drain that fluid and examine it right from the t/c (most don't). Also, is the t/c painted or bare metal?
NOTE: if it is the t/c, you'll kill the trans by driving it.
Sorry,
73
__________________
95 Cam, V6 1MZ, Auto A541E, LE >245,000 miles!
I'll say its your torque converters going south. The RPM is roughly the stall speed. Upon accelleration the stator inside the t/c is pushed away from the tubine shell (I think), upon deceleration it is drawn towards the turbine. I'd guess it lost a thrust washer/bearing and it eating itself. You will find metal in the trans in very small particles.
Drain the fluid in something clean and look at the fluid in the sun light. I bet you find it full of tiny metallic particals. Skim it with a magnet too. That sound IS metalic in nature and it will show itself soon enough.
Yours may not have this, but while you have the inspection cover off, rotate the engine by hand and look for a drain plug in the converter (hole in flex plate will align with this plug). If it has one, drain that fluid and examine it right from the t/c (most don't). Also, is the t/c painted or bare metal?
NOTE: if it is the t/c, you'll kill the trans by driving it.
Sorry,
73
Thank you very much, i will check this out tomorrow and get back to you.
It almost sounds like a sleeve bearing going bad...kinda like a computer fan when it's worn down...but I know there isn't anything like that in car engine.
Definitely use a stethoscope to locate this. It will be more accurate than trying guess where the sound is coming from with just yer ears.
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1998 T-100 SR5 2WD auto, Roadmaster Active Suspension, 6½" dropped front air dam, 4½" drop full belly pan, 4° rear diffuser, 11" side skirts, oil catch jar, AC mod, aero cap, 67% grill block = 26mpg highway!
Quote:
Originally Posted by n c t t o r a
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