Thank god for non-interference engines - Toyota Nation Forum : Toyota Car and Truck Forums

mjk67 · 08-02-2010, 11:04 PM

Hello all,

Just bought a 96 V6 Camry w/ 127k on it about a month ago. When I was looking the car over, I noticed a dealer sticker stating that the Timing Belt and all drive belts were changed at precisely 100k. However, nothing was noted about the water pump (???).

Last Friday, I noted some noise, and upon inspection noticed a small amount of antifreeze leaking from my water pump. The noise was obviously the bearing going out. I got ahold of my mechanic, and set up an appt. early this week to get it fixed.

About 6 hours after leaving my mechanic, I pulled out of work, and the car simply died right in the middle of the road. No noise, etc. It sat at work for the weekend, until I had my mechanic tow it to the shop.

Upon a quick inspection, we found my timing belt was in absolulte shreds. It actually shed the top portion of 1/2 of the belt - the other part of the belt was like looking at a ball of string. Apparently, the water pump was leaking fluid, and over time, it caused havoc with the belt. The wierd thing is that the fluid level in my reserve tank never moved more than about an inch lower than when I had bought it.

I was sweating bullets, while we looked at some software to see if it was an interference engine. Thank god it wasn't. We installed a new Gates belt, and Master Pro select pump ( I work p/t at Oreillys).

I'm hoping this car sees 250K, as I might be piling up some miles as a courier (for the time being).

***LynchburgCSI*** · 08-02-2010, 11:22 PM

Are you complaining? Because I would. Not changing the water pump with the timing belt is retarded. I'd take the bill to the dealership. But that's me.

Oh! and

to TN's Camry family!

Nervous · 08-02-2010, 11:33 PM

I'd use OEM timing belt and water pump, btw. You don't want to save on these parts, believe me.

mjk67 · 08-02-2010, 11:35 PM

Honestly, I couldn't believe a dealership wouldn't 'upsell' the waterpump change out. I honestly don't know which dealership in the Minneapolis metro area did the job, as their 'sticker' is pretty generic. I'm guessing the previous owner had done everything at the dealer, as the oil filter/air filter/Timing belt were Toyota parts. I bought this car from a lot, so obviously I never spoke to the original owner.

After 4 years of pure hell, trying to nurse a P.O.S. 1996 Altima along while back in college, I'm hoping the next 3-4 yrs will be relatively painless.

Are you saying Gates isn't a premium Timing belt? I was under the impression that these were..

RU2CHKN · 08-03-2010, 12:11 AM

Gates in my opinion are as close to OEM as you can get for aftermarket.

ghettosled · 08-03-2010, 07:12 AM

i just dont understand why all manufacturers dont use non-interference engines. that is what sold me on the camry over an accord.

bronzemaxell · 08-03-2010, 07:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LynchburgCSI

Are you complaining? Because I would. Not changing the water pump with the timing belt is retarded. I'd take the bill to the dealership. But that's me.

Oh! and

to TN's Camry family!

i am one of them, only change water pump every other timing belt interval, and so far no problem on my 3rd timing belt interval.
i only use oem toyota parts.

Stillrunning · 08-03-2010, 07:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ghettosled

i just dont understand why all manufacturers dont use non-interference engines.

Teenagers wanting more power and speed.

73sport · 08-03-2010, 10:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ghettosled

i just dont understand why all manufacturers dont use non-interference engines.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stillrunning

Teenagers wanting more power and speed.

Grown ups too!

WHY: interference engines can have a tighter quench area in the head creating a better burn and more HP! Performance engines with pop-up pistons and higher compression will likely fit in this category!

73sport · 08-03-2010, 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mjk67

. . . . . The wierd thing is that the fluid level in my reserve tank never moved more than about an inch lower than when I had bought it.. . . . .

Why:
In order for the volume in the reservoir to be pulled back into the cooling system, the system must be leak free (Hold pressure/hold a vacuum). If it can't hold a vacuum, it will never pull the reservoir down and the tank will be full even when the engines cooling system is completely empty.

Good radiator caps + a leak free system make this possible. Fix the leaks!

chirkware · 08-03-2010, 07:51 PM

About two years ago, my 94 Camry (4 cyl) was making an aweful noise. Drove it straight to my mechanic. They listened to it and told me it was the water pump, and that it would fail soon. We scheduled an appointment to do the water pump and timing belt, and I headed home. I got two miles, and the engine died...had it towed to the shop, and they squeezed me in and did the repair the next day.

While it made me a little nervous, I knew there shouldn't be any damage. I had asked a mechanic a couple years before "what's the worst that can happen if the timing belt brakes?", and he told me "your left embarrassed on the side of the rode".

It sure is nice knowing it won't tear anything up. Still, next time they diagnose a water pump going out, I'll just leave it with them and have someone come get me.

ycartf · 08-03-2010, 08:35 PM

Non-interference engines are one of the main reasons I favor Toyota products. Knowing that having a Toyota means the difference between your car quitting or your car quitting and frying several hundred dollars worth of valves gives me a little more piece of mind.

Tracy

Jason.MZW20 · 08-03-2010, 09:15 PM

Well Toyota no longer makes non-interference engines, unfortunately. But, it's not all bad, as they switched to timing chains once again. Because of variable valve timing and hydraulic pressure in the VVT cam(s), the piston will bend the valves even with depressions (albeit not as badly) - it will largely depend on the RPM and where the valves/pistons are (higher RPM = more possibility of damage). The newer motors with roller rockers have a TON of valve lift over the bucket-tappet engines (5SFE-1MZ), and that's another contributing reason - since the valves are further in the combustion chamber.

Timing chains are inherently more reliable since they're internally lubricated and self-adjusting as well. But, if it does break, it'll make a nasty mess. Timing chain breaks are not pretty.

Basically if you have VVT-i and a timing belt, don't let it break.

RU2CHKN · 08-03-2010, 10:31 PM

interference motors are usually cheaper, that's why a lot of hondas thake that route but yes Jason makes a good point with the new model toyotas that are interference motors.

***fenixus*** · 08-03-2010, 10:34 PM

Gates belts are as good as OEM. i think toyota used them as OEM on some corollas (per someone elses post). i'm just worried about OP's water pump (Master what?) ... I once cheaped out on Bosch water pump and had to replace it again (with t-belt again) that time using purely OEM parts (1.5 yrs / 10k miles later). I still have aftermarket tensioner though .... not 1000% sure but this might be making some slight noise on cold engine (never a problem before installing this tensioner in a local shop while doing 1st t-belt/wp job).

you don't want to cheap out on those engine parts as labor is hella expensive, so you don't want to come back to same job in short period of time.