uneven tire wear

[usert_l]

hey guys i have a camry 93 and the front tires are wearing down quickly on the inside edge while on the other side they dont really have any wear at all. About 4 months ago i took it to a mechanic and he put in a different bolt in my suspension to change the camber but it has not really made any difference on tire wear. What's the best/cheapest way to correct this problem? adding more positive camber? I looked around on ebay and found some camber kits but they have a limited range (only +/- 1.75 degree). Maybe adjusting the rideheight on the front end might help? i notice that the front end is sitting a little lower than the rear...

[LynchburgCSI]

I'd just get an alignment.

[projektvertx]

Originally Posted by LynchburgCSI

I'd just get an alignment.

Normally, I'd say excesive inner tire wear is Camber issues. I'd just say alignment as well. But something is bothering me about the OP's post, he says the front looks lower than the rear, which is usually not the issue with the Gen 3 body style... Front always looks higher than rear on almost any setup I've seen, other than coilovers...

OP, go to Belle Tire and have them do a free alignment check and print you out the specs sheet. If it does in fact have camber issues, you have your problem, but I suspect you have a bigger problem. Have your struts ever been changed? How do your springs look?

[73sport]

^^ +1

With that info choices can be made. Also, can you measure the fender lip height from side to side on this car and record it here (tires properly inflated)? Perhaps with the normal load on board too > Kids, dog, People, lead weights? Maybe the front right spring is busted????

Simply; when the front is toed-inward excessively, (toe-in = -X.XX) it scrubs off the outer edges of the tires leaving them cupped on the outside. Kind of razor like if you rub your hand over it from back to front (counter clockwise).

If the front is toed-outward excessively (toe-in = +X.XX), then it wears the inner edges or the inside of the tire in the same manor.

However, excessive positive (+) camber (being tilted outward at the top) will wear the outside edge smooth (no razor) assuming the toe is near zero. Negative camber (-) also smooth on the inner edge assuming the toe is near zero.

Now couple all this with tire pressure. LOW front tire pressure wears both the inner and outer edges smooth leaving tread in the middle of the tire (primary highway use)! While low pressure in grocery getter parking lot machine will chew off the outer edges leaving the razor effect! Both of these can happen with a perfect alignment!

What this means is, tell the alignment tech if you just rotated the tires, replaced the tires and had bad tire wear, if the car has even wear but pulls to one side ect . . . They need to know!

Did we mention what caster does?

[P3VZ]

what does caster do??? SUBSCRIBED, im going to be lowered soon

[projektvertx]

This site does a good job explaining all of the parameters:

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tirete...e.jsp?techid=4

[73sport]

Caster can make a care pull. The side with less caster may cause the car to favor that direction. Its not known for high tire wear except like Benzs and BMRs which run high caster numbers anyway.

Its not adjustable on these cars, but someone that removed your sub-frame could put it back wrong an mess it up. As would a crash or hard curb job. Sorry, can't go into detail at this time but drop a note if you have a specific question.

[73sport]

Where's the upper BJ?

[projektvertx]

Originally Posted by 73sport

Where's the upper BJ?

Well, we don't have one It was more for demonstration purposes And it's non-adjustable anyways no?

[usert_l]

some measurements:
height to bumper lip (at center): 10.75in (is this the normal height?)
right side (driver side) fender height: 7.625in (note - tire wears more on this side)
left side fender height: 8in

measuring along the chassis frame the front sits about 1.5-2in lower than the rear.

Tires are inflated at 35 psi. The tread wear felt pretty smooth to me...

Regarding the struts and shocks i have no idea but they look old
I can upload a picture if that helps.

Im thinking of gettting the camber kit and someone to install it for me...its pretty cheap anyway.

[projektvertx]

Originally Posted by usert_l

some measurements:
height to bumper lip (at center): 10.75in (is this the normal height?)
right side (driver side) fender height: 7.625in (note - tire wears more on this side)
left side fender height: 8in

Is your car a V6 or an I4? Let me know if it's a V6, I can go take some measurment and pics

measuring along the chassis frame the front sits about 1.5-2in lower than the rear.

Wow, dude that's a huge difference The frame rail should be level. If you take a construction level, and put it on the frame, does the bubble indicate the car is level?

Regarding the struts and shocks i have no idea but they look old
I can upload a picture if that helps.

Well a picture would be nice if you can light them up, but it would be hard to gauge their integrity since the damage might be internal. If the springs are broken, it should be pretty visible to you. But you can do a couple of tests to verify their integrity of the struts. If you push down on the bumper real hard, does it bouce up and down more that twice? When you brake hard, and stop, does the car keep bobbing up and down for too long? If you look at where the strut rod goes into the strut housing, is there any oil leaking?

Im thinking of gettting the camber kit and someone to install it for me...its pretty cheap anyway.

I wouldn't get a camber kit just yet, even if you would install it and it solves the tire wear issue, there are some suspension issues with the car that need to be solved.

[73sport]

Originally Posted by usert_l

some measurements:
right side fender height: 7.625in (note - tire wears more on this side)
left side fender height: 8in

Are you saying this is right hand drive car? Remember, perspective for left to right is ALWAYS from the drivers seat looking through the windshield!

I guess that makes sense. . . . So you're saying theres a 3/8" to 7/16" ride height difference from left to right? If its RH drive, why do we have English units? I'm guessing you looking the front of the car from the outside, not the inside.

OK - normally we'd just measure from the center of the fenders lip right over the axle or the center of the tire to ground for all four corners. The bumper height is of little value as the rear ride height will change it drastically.

LF = ____ RF = ____

LR = ____ RR = ____


Can you sit in it and have someone measure it? A 1/2 settle with you in it, should have much camber change.

Can you see the wheels lean compared to the back?

[usert_l]

@projektvertx... my car is an I4. My measurements along the rail could be inaccurate cause the rail under the chassis is kinda messed up : ). The car doesnt really bounce when i push the bumper down. I'll try to have someone look over the spring and strut later and see if they're ok. This car is pretty old so they're probably aren't in the best shape.

@73sport... no the car is LH drive and yeah i was looking from the front of the car. From now on i'll refer to left and right side from the driver's seat.

Ride height measured from fender lip to ground with me in driver seat:

LF = 26.375 in RF = 26.5625 in
LR = 26.4375 in RR = 26.5 in

Looking from above I can see the front wheels leaning in a bit, with the LF tire leaning more in than the RF one which makes sense since its wearing out quicker also.

[73sport]

Originally Posted by usert_l

@projektvertx... my car is an I4. My measurements along the rail could be inaccurate cause the rail under the chassis is kinda messed up : ). The car doesnt really bounce when i push the bumper down. I'll try to have someone look over the spring and strut later and see if they're ok. This car is pretty old so they're probably aren't in the best shape.

@73sport... no the car is LH drive and yeah i was looking from the front of the car. From now on i'll refer to left and right side from the driver's seat.

Ride height measured from fender lip to ground with me in driver seat:

LF = 26.375 in RF = 26.5625 in
LR = 26.4375 in RR = 26.5 in

Looking from above I can see the front wheels leaning in a bit, with the LF tire leaning more in than the RF one which makes sense since its wearing out quicker also.

Those numbers look fine if thats how it runs around most of the time (Mainly side to side).

So do you have the alignment data to post up?

Do you recall if there were whole numbers involved? Like +1.25 camber? +/- 0.5 would likely not show much wear if you rotated the tires every 5000 miles, but something over 0.75 and up would show quicker. How many miles did it take to ruin the tires?

[usert_l]

I took the car to Goodyear for an alignment. Here's the numbers:
Before
LF: RF:
Camber: 0.2 -1.0
Caster: 0.6 1.0
Toe: -0.59 -0.56
LR: RR:
Camber: -0.5 -0.7
Toe: 0.10 -0.15

After
LF: RF:
Camber: 0.1 -0.8
Caster: 0.6 1.0
Toe:0.07 0.06
LR: RR:
Camber: -0.6 -0.5
Toe:0.17 0.25

It looks like the only adjustment they made was the toe. Camber remains almost the same (i dont think it was adjustable without the camber bolts).