Got rear-ended..now some questions

[chemie]

My son got rear-ended today in our 96 Camry Dx. Sucks because in MI it is no-fault which means we are SOL and have to pay to fix ourselves (no collision coverage and even though the other guys fault, too bad for us).

The car was pushed into another car and this did all the damage. There is surprising little damage to rear bumper (cracked cover is all) but the front is mashed. It was a Jeep in front with a big tire on the back. This folded the hood in half and stuffed the rad back to the engine. Front bumper not even hit.

Got back from the auto shop and it looks like both headlights, front grill, rad, hood, hood latch are for sure gone. Do not know about rad fans/shroud or A/C lines yet.

My questions:

1. The Haynes manual does not show the parts blow out. Looking at a popular online auto_parts_warehouse site and I see a "upper rad tie bar", "rad support cross member" and "rad support assembly" (which looks to include the tie bar). There is a main cross member (painted) across the length in the front of the compartment where the rad hold-down lugs bolt too. Is this one of the above parts or another part? It needs to be replaced. Anyone have a parts blow-out for this area?

2. Beyond the main cross bar mentioned above, am I right to see from haynes pics that the headlights bolt to the grill and this bolts to black steel which might be a "rad support" (if so, which one)?

3. Paint for the hood will be a killer for cost; any concerns with just leaving it primed? Or could I go for auto parts store paint mix in a spray can along with some clear coat spray? I do not care about looks, just functionality.

[uuuuu]

Make sure you understand your insurance coverage 100%. I live in a no-fault state and my insurance company worked with the other insurance company so that the other company paid me money for damages. I was found partly at fault, and I have no collision insurance.

[chemie]

MI no-fault is the worst in the nation. To quote the government
"You are 50% OR LESS at fault (you are rear-ended, side-swiped, etc.) and have no collision ins = Your insurance pays nothing. You are responsible for the cost of repairs to your car." Fault only works into who ins pays for bodily injury. If your car is parked, then you can have the other guys ins pay but if you are sitting there minding your own business and get rear ended...too bad so sad.

[reluctantmechanic]

Originally Posted by chemie

MI no-fault is the worst in the nation. To quote the government
"You are 50% OR LESS at fault (you are rear-ended, side-swiped, etc.) and have no collision ins = Your insurance pays nothing. You are responsible for the cost of repairs to your car." Fault only works into who ins pays for bodily injury. If your car is parked, then you can have the other guys ins pay but if you are sitting there minding your own business and get rear ended...too bad so sad.

wow, remind me not to move to MI! Is everyone okay? and can you take a picture?

[projektvertx]

Where exactly in MI are you? Are you in the Metro Detroit area? I'm familiar with insurance in MI as I got rear ended last year and my car got repaired... I doubt insurance will repair your son's car, but I can definitly help you with the recovery project, I know a couple of local bone yard and whatnot that have body parts for our cars. Don't hesistate to PM me!

EDIT: It's worth mentioning that I have full coverage, MI's no fault law is EXACTLY why I have one of AAA fanciest, most comprehensive policies...

[chemie]

With collision rider (which we have on our newer cars), we would be OK but it did not make sense to pay $1000 for coverage on a $2300 car.

I am waiting on estimate from auto repair. He suggested that Aftermarket hood is about the same price as bone yard which is probably true once you pay shipping. I am not aware of any around here (Midland).

Any answers to the questions above?

[projektvertx]

He's probably right about the aftermarket hood as opposed to bone yard one. Wow! Yeah, I don't know any bone yards in the Midland area. Another idea would be buying another whole car off craigslist, with a bad engine and either swapping over the engine or cutting/pulling off the body parts you need. You seem mechanically inclined, so that might be a viable idea.

As for the hood paint, NAPA can do custom color paint cans for 35$ for the 1st spray can, and 5$ for each subsequent one I believe.

[Mister_Perkins]

Originally Posted by chemie

My son got rear-ended today in our 96 Camry Dx. Sucks because in MI it is no-fault which means we are SOL and have to pay to fix ourselves (no collision coverage and even though the other guys fault, too bad for us).

The car was pushed into another car and this did all the damage. There is surprising little damage to rear bumper (cracked cover is all) but the front is mashed. It was a Jeep in front with a big tire on the back. This folded the hood in half and stuffed the rad back to the engine. Front bumper not even hit.

Got back from the auto shop and it looks like both headlights, front grill, rad, hood, hood latch are for sure gone. Do not know about rad fans/shroud or A/C lines yet.

My questions:

1. The Haynes manual does not show the parts blow out. Looking at a popular online auto_parts_warehouse site and I see a "upper rad tie bar", "rad support cross member" and "rad support assembly" (which looks to include the tie bar). There is a main cross member (painted) across the length in the front of the compartment where the rad hold-down lugs bolt too. Is this one of the above parts or another part? It needs to be replaced. Anyone have a parts blow-out for this area?

2. Beyond the main cross bar mentioned above, am I right to see from haynes pics that the headlights bolt to the grill and this bolts to black steel which might be a "rad support" (if so, which one)?

3. Paint for the hood will be a killer for cost; any concerns with just leaving it primed? Or could I go for auto parts store paint mix in a spray can along with some clear coat spray? I do not care about looks, just functionality.

To replace the core support you are going to have to cut / weld a new one in. I would go to the salvage yard and pull one that got side swiped or hit in the rear. Cut it off with an electric cut off wheel or electric sawzall.

If you have a primed hood, theres really no need to paint it if you dont mind it looking a little ugly. The Primer will protect it. If it were just bare metal, the minimum you would want to do is prime it anyhow.

[hairball]

I was just talking to my brother on the phone while reading your post. How ironic... he's done auto body and frame repair for over 30 years (even schooled and certified). He said you can actually remove the spot welds on most parts like those. He said they are not welded like a long arc weld strip, they are spot welded in several places. He said you can remove most spot welds with a drill but if you go to a wrecking yard, you need to take a good, powerful one with a fully-charged battery and maybe a spare battery because it takes a lot of power and force to remove all the spot welds. But it can be removed without cutting. This only applies to the "new" one at the wrecking yard! He also said that BEFORE you remove the one from your car, you need to get it as straight as you can before you remove it, not just remove it. He was calling from work and didn't have a lot of time to explain it all in detail.

Just thought I would share this with the OP. It's all new to me. Just learned this in the last few minutes! (What are brothers for? I help him with his stereo and alarm stuff, he helps me with body adjustments like windows, doors, hinges, etc.)

[hairball]

Originally Posted by Mister_Perkins

Cut it off with an electric cut off wheel or electric sawzall.

This is exactly what I've been telling people you have to do! Until I just learned something new from an expert auto body guy. Amazing what you can learn from family! (But the cutting STILL works because I've done it several times myself!)

[Mister_Perkins]

Originally Posted by hairball

This is exactly what I've been telling people you have to do! Until I just learned something new from an expert auto body guy. Amazing what you can learn from family! (But the cutting STILL works because I've done it several times myself!)

I've had no troubles. I usually cut the core support and part of the front clip off and grind the spot welds for the core at my house. I just dont like to waste a lot of time at the salvage yard. on a nice day maybe, but in pennsylvania it rains most of the time so its not so nice

[hairball]

I know what ya mean! I live in Washington State, so we get our share of rain here too.

I was actually a parts puller at a local wrecking yard many years ago and every time we had to pull a core support, we would usually use a sawzall too, but the other guy would sometimes torch them off. I'm not the least bit familiar with ANY type of welding or torches and I don't like fire! LOL! But I also found the sawzall cuts are much cleaner and smaller, thereby resulting in a better fit on the car it's going on. But one time I went to a wrecking yard for a core support and actually took a hacksaw and a pack of new blades and got it off. It was for a buddy's car and he knew cars about as much as I know how to repair the space shuttle. But yep, cutting is faster!

[Mister_Perkins]

Originally Posted by hairball

I know what ya mean! I live in Washington State, so we get our share of rain here too.

I was actually a parts puller at a local wrecking yard many years ago and every time we had to pull a core support, we would usually use a sawzall too, but the other guy would sometimes torch them off. I'm not the least bit familiar with ANY type of welding or torches and I don't like fire! LOL! But I also found the sawzall cuts are much cleaner and smaller, thereby resulting in a better fit on the car it's going on. But one time I went to a wrecking yard for a core support and actually took a hacksaw and a pack of new blades and got it off. It was for a buddy's car and he knew cars about as much as I know how to repair the space shuttle. But yep, cutting is faster!

ehehe.. I don't like using torches because it gets too much slag build-up. I prefer plasma torches, much cleaner smoother cuts .

When all else fails, blue wrench prevails.

[ghettosled]

have you tried consulting sites like http://www.**********s.com/camry/ ? pretty good online reference manual for the camry.

and no, there is no harm to leaving the hood primer (i drove a primered car for over a year). as a cheap fix, pick up some rattle cans of paint and paint it for about $50. though i would suggest getting parts from a local auto recycler like others suggested. maybe you will get lucky and find a donor car with matching paint.

[chemie]

So here is the latest:
* Quote from Body Shop is $2000 which includes painting outside of hood. This was "bare" minimum as I am not repairing the front and rear bumper covers or the broken washer fluid bottle or painting the under side of hood.
* Turns out, although they are separate parts from Toyota, the aftermarket part includes the entire cross tie bar and rad housing all in one peice. It is only $100 so getting one from a bone yard is not worth it. However, the hit is the 8 hours labor to remove and replace.

And yes, I was also told by a friend at work that you need to pull the damaged one back to straighten the sides out and align before cutting it out.

* I have a friend at work who does car painting on nights/weekends and is very good. I felt guilty but he offered to paint at cost of paint but I will still pay him for his labor (cash rate). This should save me $300. If this falls through, I will go the "spray can" option (He grimanced when I suggested this so maybe it was a guilt job on my part).

* I think I will have auto shop install the hood, latch, and tie bar ($800). I will bring it home and do the rad, fan, and headlights myself (save several hundred).

Hopefully, I can bring it down to 1500 range with some help and sweat equity.

I do get $500 for "mini-tort" claim on his insurance which is basically covering deductible which is limit of any claim. So I am out $1000 for being rear-ended.

The good news is that I get to replace the rad again after just doing it in July. It was the original 14 years old and although not leaking, the core looked in rough shape so I replaced it...sure glad I was so proactive there.

Posted pics for the rubber-neckers ;-) Sorry middle one is rotated 90 degreees but you can see the result of a tire pushing on the hood and winning. Of course, if the bumper had hit instead and the air bags deployed, the thing would likely be off to the slavage yard as the cost of 2 air bag modules would likely not have been worth it.