Counterfeit Bearings? Fake vs Real

[Yuko]

I’m planning to install a new idler and tensioner pulley sometime this weekend. I got a NTN tensioner and a NSK idler for $22 each. Great deal….too great. So I brought a Koyo Idler and tensioner at Napa to compare. Now I’m confused and I believe the NTN and NSK bearing are fakes but the Koyo bearing have some problems of their own. There are many websites about fake bearings but nothing for the automotive industry.

Unknown NTN and NSK bearings:
Came in genetic Taiwan boxes
Thicker grease? (Will stop when released)
Some scratches on bearing face

Real Koyo bearing:
Spins too easily (makes almost one complete spin)
Some side to side play

NSK on the left, Koyo on the right.


Koyo on the left, NTN on the right



Both bearings spins smoothly with no noise or catch. I want to use the NTN and NSK bearings because they are heavier and have no side to side play. But part of me says they could be fakes. On the other hand, the Koyo bearings have some side to side play that bothers me. Which would you used?

Here's some links I found.
http://maintenanceforums.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/409103451/m/71310909
http://www.electronicsweekly.com/blogs/engineering-design-problems/2007/04/bogus-bearings-look-more-real.html
http://www.interflon.net/en/ExtendBearingOperatingLife.html
http://www.stopfakebearings.com/#/fake_bearings

[Stillrunning]

You mean this NTN?
http://www.ntnamerica.com/

[Yuko]

Originally Posted by Stillrunning

You mean this NTN?
http://www.ntnamerica.com/

Yea.The problem is it didn't come in a NTN box but there's a NTN print on the seal.

[Mister_Perkins]

I can see the bearings, how are they fake??

If anything, you can try the off-brand out and see how long it lasts and report here. It may end up being a good quality and last just as long...

[Yuko]

Originally Posted by Mister_Perkins

I can see the bearings, how are they fake??

If anything, you can try the off-brand out and see how long it lasts and report here. It may end up being a good quality and last just as long...

Maybe fake was not the right would to use. I read in many sites that they could be cheap-o bearings stamped with a brand name or they could be used bearing that were cleaned and repacked with grease. The last thing I need is a bearing blowing apart in my engine.

[LynchburgCSI]

Yeahhhhhh.... I go OEM for engine bearings.

[Yuko]

Originally Posted by LynchburgCSI

Yeahhhhhh.... I go OEM for engine bearings.

Isn't Koyo OEM for Toyota, just without the red and white box? If so, how much side to side play is normal?

[pmesfun]

For the tensioner and idler pulleys, Koyo is OEM. I used Koyo pulleys when I did my tb. It has been almost 700 miles and no problems.
edit:
NTN is oem for the actual tensioner, at least on the 1mz-fe.

[Stillrunning]

Originally Posted by Yuko

The problem is it didn't come in a NTN box

It may be just the distributer's box. NTN doesn't look like a back alley bearing manufacturer.

http://www.ntnamerica.com/about-ntn/...-documentation

[Yuko]

Originally Posted by pmesfun

NTN is oem for the actual tensioner, at least on the 1mz-fe.

I wouldn't mind using the NTN tensioner, but why would it come in a box with made in Taiwan? Fishy..

Originally Posted by Stillrunning

It may be just the distributer's box. NTN doesn't look like a back alley bearing manufacturer.

True, but NTN, NSK, NKF, and Koyo warned if buying bearings from a unauthorized dealer or without the original packaging, it could be a lower quailty bearing. But after reading the link, I see that NTN have three factories in China and Taiwan.

It's 20 degree outside so I decided to put both the NTN and Koyo in a box and leave it over night outside. If the NTN freeze up, than the grease is cheap and no good. The most unscientific test...

[pmesfun]

Originally Posted by Yuko

I wouldn't mind using the NTN tensioner, but why would it come in a box with made in Taiwan? Fishy..

I don't know, the Koyo bearings I got came in the same box you have, so that's legit for sure. Just use the Koyo pulleys, to be safe.

[carsrus]

Originally Posted by Yuko

Maybe fake was not the right would to use. I read in many sites that they could be cheap-o bearings stamped with a brand name or they could be used bearing that were cleaned and repacked with grease. The last thing I need is a bearing blowing apart in my engine.

Nah I doubt they sell remaned bearings like this. Maybe one big rigs and whatnot but these are just disposable parts for these types on applications.

This bearing really isnt rocket science though so theres a good chance there all good. Stuff like this and gaskets get repackage by autoparts places and whatnot. FelPro for example packages tons of stuff from tons of manufacturers into their own boxes.

If you bought in store from a large chain its probably not fake, however if you bought online then who knows.

[Yuko]

Originally Posted by carsrus

If you bought in store from a large chain its probably not fake, however if you bought online then who knows.

I brought the Koyo from Napa so it should be the real thing. It came with the Koyo box and bag. The NTN and NSK on the other hand came from a small independance store. The first bearing they gave me catched and clicks when I spun it. That's when I start to question the parts. I think I'll just use the Koyo bearing and it's shinier . I'll compare it to the ones at the Toyota dealership when I go get the T-belt. Maybe a little side to side play is normal.

[fenixus]

if it clicks or shows resistance on spinning then it's garbage. send it back for a refund and tell them it's bad out of the box (possible counterfeit).

I would go with Koyos from NAPA if I were you.
I bought my Koyo tensioner at like ~$30 from drivewire.com and it's perfect, no clicking, no resistance on spinning, nothing wrong, a real Koyo bearing.

[Mister_Perkins]

I only use OEM bearings, but if an aftermarket performs exactly the same and lasts just as long I'll opt. to save money. Thats why I wanted him to try it. haha