How do I convert a 3Sge 9K tach to work in a 5S Camry?

[N/A Camry Sleeper]

OK new idea here...

Since the 5S I am building will be revving to 9000 RPM or higher - I need a stock-looking tach that will be accurate to that RPM. The tachometer on the Gen2 MR2s with the 3SGTE comes stock in that car, and the lettering and numbers on that unit match the rest of the cluster in the Gen3 Camrys.

I have tried the simple swap, but that didn't work. Both tachs will mount inside the cluster assembly and will plug in, but no dice. You also have to switch one of the plastic mounts inside the assembly for proper mounting.

Anyone tried this? It's a little unusual I know - that's why I'm doing it - to be in true keeping with a the "sleeper" aspect. If it works it would have a factory look which is my goal...

This is the stocker of course:


This is what I want - just the tach



If I can change a certain resistor inside the 8K tach that would calibrate to the 9K background that would be another option I would try...

[Mister_Perkins]

I dont see why you would have any problems? The tach just Receives a signal so I dont even see why you would need to run a resistor or anything?

In my 93 civic I had one of those ridiculous 5" tachs and it worked just fine, and it was a 10,000 RPM tach

[N/A Camry Sleeper]

My guess is the signal from the 3SGE motor is different than one from a 5SFE. It is also possible that the donor tach I had was faulty - had no way of knowing that...

[Mister_Perkins]

Could be .. Only way of telling would be to compare the Tach signal wiring from both vehicles. I bet the signal pin location is different on the 3sge tach. You may have to switch pins. Let me do a little research for ya n get back


Edit:

I've been looking, and all I could find is a Pin-out Diagram for the 3s-ge:



As far as I can see though 3rd plug to the right, (TACO plug) is pin 27. I suppose you could compare that to the 5sfe and see if its the same


After doing some research, I think that the Tach should just directly swap. The only time you would need to add a resistor would be if you were using a 97+ Tachometer, as the tach signal is a lot lower in voltage. The older Style (Mr2) Tachometer shouldnt have any problems.. From what i'm reading anyways

http://www.mr2.com/forums/v6-owners-...v6-signal.html


also found this wiring diagram for the mr2:

http://www.mr-s.org/copilot/trons/overalle.pdf



The Tach signal is B11 on the 5sfe ..




The following Quote is for changing the Tach in a MR2 to a 97+ Tachometer:

http://mr2.com/kb/pdf.php?category=15

Tacho signal/speedo signal.
Two ways to go about this. If you have a gen 2+ car, use the electric speedo signal from your
existing gearbox.
If you have a gen 1, you can either use the cable, or convert it to electric. No problems either way!
I'm using a cable, and the ECU still gets the speedo signal.. As I've still got the 180ish KPH speed cut
in place.
For the tacho signal, you can either get a rev counter mechanism from a 1997+ toyota that has the
same rev counter scale, or alternatively, get a tacho signal adaptor, to make your existing tacho
work.
Basically, the problem is that the beams engine runs coil pack ignition, and the gen 2 or 3 3SGE or
5SFE doesnt.
So the 'old' signal runs at 20 volts or so, as it comes straight from the distributor.
The 'new' signal runs at either 5 volts or 12 volts, as it comes straight from the ECU or coils.

[N/A Camry Sleeper]

Thanks Mr Perkins - you are a great help as always...

Will see if I can just route the B11 signal to the 9K tach - should be as easy as that! Maybe the first unit I got did not work - we'll have to do a parts run and see how it goes

[Mister_Perkins]

From what I've gathered is if the Cluster came out of a toyota with a Distributor driven tachometer, it should work without any modification. The only stipulation there is if the 3sge Tach wire is the same as the 5sfe Tach wire (Pin location).

If you can, go back to where you got the Tach from and pull the cluster out and check out Pin 11 on the Tachometer and note what color it is. The Harness connector pin on the 5sfe (b11) is Black. Would be nice to find the complete wiring diagrams for the Mr2

[chronoti]

wait so what ecu are you using? because your going to hit rev limiter on the 5s ecu which means to drive that high you will need a full after market or full standalone fuel management. or you somehow are driving it off an old ecu that you have modded to hit 10k before limiter (can be done but i have no idea how it something you have to mod on the board is all i know) where in either case there is going to be something where you can recalibrate the tach signal output to match a background for the rpm gauge.

now for a rpm gauge that hits 10k, make it your self.

photoshop, a scanner, and a printer with photo paper.

now i know your saying all whhhhhhat make it?

seriously just photoshop the numbers and scale to what you want and print it out on to photo paper and it works (replace the face there)

[Mister_Perkins]

Hey sleeper, check this out :

http://www.midshiprunabout.org/mk1/2...p-swap-wiring/

The Tach signal wire should be black for the 3sge as well

[N/A Camry Sleeper]

Originally Posted by chronoti

wait so what ecu are you using? because your going to hit rev limiter on the 5s ecu which means to drive that high you will need a full after market or full standalone fuel management. or you somehow are driving it off an old ecu that you have modded to hit 10k before limiter (can be done but i have no idea how it something you have to mod on the board is all i know) where in either case there is going to be something where you can recalibrate the tach signal output to match a background for the rpm gauge.

now for a rpm gauge that hits 10k, make it your self.

photoshop, a scanner, and a printer with photo paper.

now i know your saying all whhhhhhat make it?

seriously just photoshop the numbers and scale to what you want and print it out on to photo paper and it works (replace the face there)

Still gonna use a 5SFE ECU but to get around the rev limiter I *think* I need to use a different resistor to fool the computer into allowing me to go to the desired RPM. I read about it a while back and it's something like you switch the 20K Ohm resistor with a 16K Ohm one and presto - rev limit is changed. It may be reverse of what I just stated but when I get to that point it will dawn on me I'm sure!

ANd if what Perkins says is right then I think I just had a bad tach from the parts yard or missed something in the install. Tax money will be here in a couple weeks which means:

1. Convert to MR2 manual steering
2. Adapt the 1MZ-FE intake to the 5SFE intake
3. Make the correct brake hats for carbon rotors all 4 wheels
4. Start making the titanium shimless buckets & titanium wrist pins
5. Look into the feasibility of titanium rear suspension components

Much work to do when the weather improves which looks like very soon! Will keep everyone posted!

[LynchburgCSI]

Originally Posted by chronoti

wait so what ecu are you using? because your going to hit rev limiter on the 5s ecu which means to drive that high you will need a full after market or full standalone fuel management. or you somehow are driving it off an old ecu that you have modded to hit 10k before limiter (can be done but i have no idea how it something you have to mod on the board is all i know) where in either case there is going to be something where you can recalibrate the tach signal output to match a background for the rpm gauge.

now for a rpm gauge that hits 10k, make it your self.

photoshop, a scanner, and a printer with photo paper.

now i know your saying all whhhhhhat make it?

seriously just photoshop the numbers and scale to what you want and print it out on to photo paper and it works (replace the face there)

This works. And stop giving away my mod ideas!

Originally Posted by N/A Camry Sleeper

My guess is the signal from the 3SGE motor is different than one from a 5SFE.

O-scope!

Originally Posted by N/A Camry Sleeper

Still gonna use a 5SFE ECU but to get around the rev limiter I *think* I need to use a different resistor to fool the computer into allowing me to go to the desired RPM. I read about it a while back and it's something like you switch the 20K Ohm resistor with a 16K Ohm one and presto - rev limit is changed. It may be reverse of what I just stated but when I get to that point it will dawn on me I'm sure!

I REALLY feel like that's not going to work. Toyota ECUs are EXTREMELY picky when it comes to tinkering with them. Most guys I know won't even mess with them. Good luck!

[chronoti]

Originally Posted by LynchburgCSI

This works. And stop giving away my mod ideas!

O-scope!

I REALLY feel like that's not going to work. Toyota ECUs are EXTREMELY picky when it comes to tinkering with them. Most guys I know won't even mess with them. Good luck!

i remember someone who did it with a 4a ecu, i would say worry about that 1st because all that money going to be needed to get some stand alone, maybe

[N/A Camry Sleeper]

If I can get the 9K tach to work that would be great and I could at least have that part of the total build finished. Won't have to worry about changing the rev limit until the new 5S drops in anyway.

Figured I would save the engine until last, and see how all the mods work without the extra power. Have the suspension, soundproofing (cause Flomasters are LOUD as I have come to find out!), weight reduction, larger carbon brakes, etc on the car first with the current motor and see how it all works. I"m really pleased with the results thus far - probably making only 155 HP at the crank now, but it's very fun to drive.

When this new motor goes in it will be at least 30 lbs lighter than the stock 5SFE, and weight removed from reciprocating and rotating parts is much more valuable than sprung or unsprung weight...

[Mister_Perkins]

Sleeper, I honestly have no idea if it will plug and play. From what I've read it should, but I cannot 100% confirm it.

[N/A Camry Sleeper]

Originally Posted by Mister_Perkins

Sleeper, I honestly have no idea if it will plug and play. From what I've read it should, but I cannot 100% confirm it.

As always, I am a willing guinea pig!

[Jason.MZW20]

Toyota ECUs only initiate fuel cut, so to rev past the limit, you just need a piggyback that can control the injectors. Spark will continue past 6250rpm, even on direct ignition systems.

This also overrides the speed limit cut (also injector based), if enabled in your ECU.