3-month old Moog Ball Joints (PICS) - BEWARE!

[fenixus]

Decided to start a new thread and show everybody how my 3 month old (1,300 miles on them) Moog Problem Solver Ball Joints look like on 02 Toyota Solara V6 (yes, I have a busted tie rod end boot on driver side).
Parts were installed in February '11 in New Jersey.

driver side:


passenger side:



Part number was (same for both sides): K9499

This is how they looked like right after install 3 months ago (they were new):




And this is a stock manufacturer picture:



How many differences have you noticed?
Have you noticed something odd?
If yes then you are right! THERE IS TONS OF RUST ON THEM.

For comparison, look at original factory outer tie rod ends, they have close to 127k miles on them and are 9 years old and still look much better than almost new Moog parts

Personally I will stay away from Moog parts and pick other brands, genuine OEM preferably if possible.

[projektvertx]

To a certain extent, I'm not really surprised... The price difference between OEM and MOOG is so small it's not worth going with aftermarket stuff, just my 2 cents

[SilverSoarer]

What's your take on Beck-Arnley parts ?

[Eye8Pussies]

I'm actually pretty surprised....moog parts are generally known to be pretty good. but good to know anyway.

[JohnGD]

Deeza says they zinc phosphate plate their parts, so I'd expect Moog to do better than that (picture). The rubber boot is clearly new.

Let us know what Moog says and if they'd be willing to issue a refund, even if it's a pain to replace with OEM.

[96ToyoCam164K]

Originally Posted by fenixus

Parts were installed in February '11 in New Jersey.

If yes then you are right! THERE IS TONS OF RUST ON THEM.

For comparison, look at original factory outer tie rod ends, they have close to 127k miles on them and are 9 years old and still look much better than almost new Moog parts

Personally I will stay away from Moog parts and pick other brands, genuine OEM preferably if possible.

I notice you're in Jersey, what kind of ice-melt are they using? I used to have a Buick from Pennsylvania that had so much rust it was called 'Rusty'. It was rare to see cars in Florida with that amount of rust. Perhaps Moog is for non-winter applications LOL.

[JohnGD]

I do like to use aftermarket parts for most maintenance items (Fel-Pro gaskets, Gates belts and hoses, Akebono brake pads and Koyorad radiators for example), but I do insist on OEM for some items like the master cylinder, thermostat and engines mounts.

Beck Arnley products are decent, but for chassis parts Moog is usually considered heavier duty than Beck Arnley, until I see all this New Jersey rust , and with a clean OEM tie rod end next to it.

Fenixus had some tough luck with aftermarket parts, and I'd agree given the small price difference just go OEM when in doubt. Or just OEM.

Originally Posted by SilverSoarer

What's your take on Beck-Arnley parts ?

[Yuko]

The rust isn't too bad, I seen worse but that's too much rust for only three months. I don't think there would be any harm other than a pain to remove.

[carsrus]

Honestly if you email them about that they'll probably just laugh. It doesn't affect the actual ball joint at all.

In general aftermarket parts don't have to and shouldn't last as long as OEM. If your car is 10 years old now, the chance that it'll still be around in 10 years isn't high.

If they cost almost as oem id be pissed, but most aftermarket is much, much cheaper ten spending an absurd amount of money on oem.

[fenixus]

well, I am actually very surprised. Moog parts are often more expensive than OEM, and usually that is because of revised materials or solutions used (Moog Problem Solver).
Also Moog IMO is seen as a heavy duty parts supplier that can actually last longer than OEM ... so what's the point if they solve one thing and screw up other?

Moog is over-advertized, not worth it.

Originally Posted by projektvertx

To a certain extent, I'm not really surprised... The price difference between OEM and MOOG is so small it's not worth going with aftermarket stuff, just my 2 cents

Have never tried Beck Arnley parts yet, but I heard they are just a reboxer, not sure what vendors they tend to use though.

Originally Posted by SilverSoarer

What's your take on Beck-Arnley parts ?

Exactly my point. And yet, this happens, what a shame.

Originally Posted by Eye8Pussies

I'm actually pretty surprised....moog parts are generally known to be pretty good. but good to know anyway.

Honestly Deeza and Moog are like VW and BMW when comparing what they tell about themselves. I would never expect Moog part to use untreated metals (castle nut, cotter pin and perhaps bolts?) and if I knew it I would have NEVER bought it knowing Jersey conditions.

Emailed Moog Support, will see what they say, if they give me some smart aleck reply, I swear I will never buy a single part with a Moog logo on the box.

Originally Posted by JohnGD

Deeza says they zinc phosphate plate their parts, so I'd expect Moog to do better than that (picture). The rubber boot is clearly new.

Let us know what Moog says and if they'd be willing to issue a refund, even if it's a pain to replace with OEM.

They use salt to melt ice on main roads and highways.
Buick is a different story, I had 18yrs old Buick (all life in NJ) which was literally rusted through and some parts were falling apart by touch. I'd rather say it's Buick rust protection that sucks.
Toyotas do not pick up that much rust, especially with OEM parts.

LOL on Moog parts marketed for warm climates only!

Originally Posted by 96ToyoCam164K

I notice you're in Jersey, what kind of ice-melt are they using? I used to have a Buick from Pennsylvania that had so much rust it was called 'Rusty'. It was rare to see cars in Florida with that amount of rust. Perhaps Moog is for non-winter applications LOL.

well, I have honestly never seen so much rust on supposedly rust protected parts ever ... on bare metal yes, but not on anything coated with any kind of rust inhibitor (zinc, phosphate, grease etc.)

I am afraid that so much rust being washed down can actually hurt other parts or if the rubber boot on ball joint ever gets cracked for whatever reason, that rust will destroy the ball bearing immediately if it gets inside.

Originally Posted by Yuko

The rust isn't too bad, I seen worse but that's too much rust for only three months. I don't think there would be any harm other than a pain to remove.

I don't care how they react to that e-mail.
However I'd rather expect any kind of compensation for a part with lifetime warranty and supposedly built to be better than OEM (Moog Problem Solver advertising, exceeding OE specs, etc.). after this experience, I will stay away from their parts.

I will keep this thread going to warn people searching through here about my Moog experience. Their parts are often more expensive than OEM and are supposed to be better and actually lasting longer than OEM. Seems they failed miserably on this one.

Originally Posted by carsrus

Honestly if you email them about that they'll probably just laugh. It doesn't affect the actual ball joint at all.

In general aftermarket parts don't have to and shouldn't last as long as OEM. If your car is 10 years old now, the chance that it'll still be around in 10 years isn't high.

If they cost almost as oem id be pissed, but most aftermarket is much, much cheaper ten spending an absurd amount of money on oem.

[projektvertx]

In a case like this where the price difference is within 5-10$ of each other, I always tell myself that if OEM lasted over 200K miles with me, why not pay the extra and never have to worry about it again? But I do see your point, seems like they solved one thing for another problem... And more often than not, MOOG is slightly overadvertised and you pay the premium for it.

[fenixus]

exactly.

on top of that I had really no choice as to go aftermarket. I wasn't aware the ball joints were all busted until I removed steering knuckles off the car.

Needed to buy replacement parts locally and quickly and since my local damn dealer has EVERYTHING on special order and it takes them sometimes up to 2 weeks to get the parts (longer than most online dealers complete orders including shipping time), then I picked Moog ball joints as next preference (not anymore) in local Advance Auto parts... If I only knew ...

Moog sucks.

Originally Posted by projektvertx

In a case like this where the price difference is within 5-10$ of each other, I always tell myself that if OEM lasted over 200K miles with me, why not pay the extra and never have to worry about it again? But I do see your point, seems like they solved one thing for another problem... And more often than not, MOOG is slightly overadvertised and you pay the premium for it.

[71Corolla]

I've never seen any suspension parts that were zinc plated, maybe I was just unlucky? I used Sankei parts just recently and they seemed like high quality pieces, but no paint or coating on them. I painted them gloss black myself. The castle nuts are not rusting either. The sway bar links I got from Toyota awhile back were just brass coated, so I painted those too.

But there is no way that nut should rust so quickly and to that extent, super cheap, low grade metal.

[fenixus]

I think all OEM suspension parts are rust protected with something (zinc phosphate?)

even OEM calipers are, while most remanuf units are not anymore (sand blasted).

If cheap Deeza protects their metal parts, I would also think Moog should do even better per their "standards"... totally disappointed

[fenixus]

I think Moog Ball Joints should include a small bottle of rust converter/inhibitor paint for DIY since they can't do it