Camry Front Brakes?

[littleman]

We got a 1999 Camry with almost 227,000 miles on it, we just had the brake redone after hearing metal to metal.
The guy said they were wore pretty bad and the rotors were blue. He asked if we ride the brakes, No we don't.

The car has done this before but we lived with it, now it's getting on my nerves and I'm sure there is something wrong even though the guy that has done my brakes the past 2 time says there is nothing wrong with them and so did the other place that did them 2 times also.

When driving everything sounds good until you mash the brakes and sounds like the drive side front, you can hear like the pads a barely scrubbing the rotor and it they hit on one side like the are warped. The car does not shake and it seems to stop good but there has to be something wrong.

I let a friend listen to it and he said sounds like the calipers need replaced, even though this last guy that done them says there is nothing wrong with them.

Now I shed some light on the matter, I guess I asking what should I do?
I haven't priced calipers yet, but I may just go on ahead and replace them.

Also, it sometimes acts up when it's wet, or turning right while braking. Like the pedal goes farther down as it makes a noise, but always thought that could be the antilock brakes kicking in.

[fj62]

Did the mechanic lube the bolts that permits the pads to move. If these bolts aren't removed and lubed when brakes are replaced it can cause the brakes to wear improperly. You can replace the brake pads without lubing these sliding pins, but I wouldn't reccomend it. Having frozen pins from not greasing can mimic bad calipers.

[Stillrunning]

Originally Posted by littleman

We got a 1999 Camry with almost 227,000 miles on it, we just had the brake redone after hearing metal to metal.The guy said they were wore pretty bad and the rotors were blue.

I'm sure there is something wrong even though the guy that has done my brakes the past 2 time says there is nothing wrong with them and so did the other place that did them 2 times also.

Ok. you're going to have to clarify. Have you had this problem now each time you've had the brakes done the last four times, or have you had two other mechanics, who did your brakes before, confirm this time there is no problem? In how many miles have you had to redo the brakes - last four times?

[littleman]

Basically, when we first bought it used, something was wrong with it and had the Toyota dealer to look at it, I believe they just put new pads on it.
The second time we had pads put on we to it to Fire Stone and it was doing about what it is now, took it back and they checked it out and said they couldn't find anything thing wrong. So a couple weeks later we took it back for them to look again and they swapped pads and shoes and it still made some noise and the pedal felt funny sometimes.

Last summer I took it to an independent owned shop and it made the same noise as it is now, he said the calipers looked fine to him. The pads were wore slap out in 13 months and I took it back to him and I told him the noise it was making and he said the calipers still looked good.

The pads were about 2 weeks past 1 year and the part store wouldn't honor the year warranty.

The brakes work, but I don't think it's suppose to make that kind of sound.
I hope I explained good enough and not make it more confusing.

I may just take it to my friend and let him look at it and show me how to do them,I've never done brakes on a car before. I'll look into greasing the bolts/pins and see if that helps.

[Stillrunning]

You don't diagnose calipers by, "still looked good". With the problems you've described and the wear you're getting, at minimum, the calipers should have been removed and had the slides cleaned and re-greased or had the calipers replaced by rebuilt units. Blue rotors have been overheated and show pads as always on, if you don't hold your foot on the brake all the time.

It sounds like you may have sticking calipers; piston not relaxing enough after brake release to prevent premature brake wear. It can be caused by sticking slides and /or sticking piston. Does this just happen with the fronts or all the brakes? Evenly on all brakes? Are these the original calipers?

[AlmightyCamry777]

Originally Posted by Stillrunning

You don't diagnose calipers by, "still looked good". With the problems you've described and the wear you're getting, at minimum, the calipers should have been removed and had the slides cleaned and re-greased or had the calipers replaced by rebuilt units. Blue rotors have been overheated and show pads as always on, if you don't hold your foot on the brake all the time.

It sounds like you may have sticking calipers; piston not relaxing enough after brake release to prevent premature brake wear. It can be caused by sticking slides and /or sticking piston. Does this just happen with the fronts or all the brakes? Evenly on all brakes? Are these the original calipers?

This. Either the calipers are sticking, or the master cylinder moving parts are sticking. It is not common for two calipers to begin sticking at the same time although anything's possible here.

A cursory check of the front calipers is to block the rear wheels so they can't roll, engage the parking brake and raise the front end of the car. Place the transmission in neutral and spin each wheel by hand. If you have an auto trans you are going to feel some resistance naturally, but if the brakes are binding you will feel the additional resistance and probably hear some light noise too. (The disc brakes on toyotas have no return spring, while driving disc runout is what spreads the pads apart after braking
. )
For the cheapest solution, if you can find a rebuild kit and are good at car mechanics, you can take them apart yourself (although with this high miles on the parts they may not be worth rebuilding). Go ahead and change out the calipers because there is obviously something wrong with them. Flush out the brake system while you are at it (it takes a lot of foot pumping to flush out the system but old fluid is probably part of the problem).

If change the calipers does not fix the problem, then it is the master cylinder (although i think you'd have all 4 brakes sticking if this were the case).

[oopssorryy]

Either rebuild the caliper or get new ones. That would really get rid of any obvious issues there might be right now. If that doesn't work go to a trust mechanic and have them do a detailed inspection.

[ThurzNite]

I don't know anybody who's ever admitted to riding the brakes.
Agreed on sticking caliper. Buy some re manufactured ones, return the stock ones for core.

Dr J

[Pauloil]

if you rebuild the caliper, get some brake grease to put a little on the slide pins and where the pads sit.

here's a good how-to

http://www.e30tech.com/forum/showthread.php?t=39965

[JohnGD]

I'd first check the caliper anchor pins. These have a tendency to stick. The other is the caliper piston. The seal can harden slightly or swell and cause the piston to seize. Which side of the brake rotor turned blue? Outside (most likely anchor pins)? Inside (most likely piston) or both?

Some mechanics spray rubber parts with brake cleaner. The petroleum solvent will cause rubber to swell. If a mechanic pulled the anchor pins out, spray the bore with brake cleaner, slap some brake grease on the pins and put them back in, then it's a seizing waiting to happen.

[carsrus]

If there using cheapola pads this type of thing isnt uncommon. Most mechanics use the low grade organic pads. If you have alloy wheels do they get rediculously dusty? If yes then there using cheap pads.

I put cheap pads and rotors on one of my vehicles and got maybe 25k miles out of them. I have high quality on my camry and im pushing 35k miles and the pads look great more then 50% left. Akebono pads are the way to go.

[ThurzNite]

Originally Posted by carsrus

If you have alloy wheels do they get rediculously dusty? If yes then there using cheap pads.

LOL, I use Hawk HP Plus and they get unbelievably dusty, but I doubt they're 'cheap pads'.

There was a TSB about pad materials, toyota changed them out. The old pads had a vertical slot in them. The new ones have a diagonal slot.

http://www.toyota.com/pub-share/pdf/...011-LowRes.pdf

Dr J

[littleman]

I'll let my friend look at it, he use to own an auto auction some where up north and he said he use to work on all kinds of cars all the time.

I know I don't ride the brakes because I use only my right foot for gas and brake, my left only if I drive a stick shift.

If nothing else, I'll get new calipers and bleed the lines. I knew a guy that said every oil change he would take a turkey baster or something and take out some of the brake fluid and then fill it up with fresh.

[Stillrunning]

Originally Posted by littleman

I knew a guy that said every oil change he would take a turkey baster or something and take out some of the brake fluid and then fill it up with fresh.

Brake fluid doesn't flow through the system, it moves back and forth as the brakes are applied. Only doing the master reservoir does not change any fluid in the lines or calipers.

[oopssorryy]

If you do re-grease your pins and such, Red n' Tacky #2 is what I use. It's a very good all purpose grease. Don't forget to grease the back sides of your pads, it cuts down on brake vibration and squealing.