Timing Belt /W. Pump renewal. 99 V6 Camry CSI (Aus)

[ednik]

Hi,

My timing belt is due at 220,000km and I'm going to change the water pump at the same time. Someone has mentioned that I ensure that the garage does the hydraulic mechanism in the water pump too otherwise if the hydraulics go later then they have to rip out the pump and start all over again ?

Is this correct and could someone kind of just break this down for me please ? How much is all of this likely to cost.

Thank's.

[JohnGD]

Most of the cost is getting to the timing belt. After that the water pump is right there in the mechanic's face. It will take 5-10 minutes to drain the coolant from the petcock (faster if remove the lower rad hose) and several bolts to remove the pump. But the shop shouldn't charge more than 0.5-1 hour in addition to a timing belt only job. So always haggle for a complete package deal first.

For instance, a complete timing belt job should include at least ($USD, rockauto.com):

GATES K030295 Micro-V AT Power Steering Belt $5.14
GATES K050435 Micro-V AT Alt/AC Belt $14.10
FEL-PRO TCS45920 Crankshaft Front Seal Set $5.10
FEL-PRO TCS45641 Camshaft Front Seal $3.66
NATIONAL 221820 Polyacrylate Oil Pump Shaft Seal $2.86
GATES TCK199 (1 Belt, 1 Tensioner, 1 Idler) Timing Belt Component Kit
$52.89
STANT 48278 180° w/Jiggle Pin OE Type Thermostat $10.94
AISIN (OEM) WPT010A Water pump w/o housing $30.79
FEL-PRO VS50304R1 Valve Cover Gasket Set w/Spark plug tube seals
$18.26
Subtotal $143.74
US shipping about $20

You might want to add NGK Iridium-IX spark plugs and new radiator hoses (I prefer Gates) for example.

[ajkalian]

Originally Posted by JohnGD

Most of the cost is getting to the timing belt. After that the water pump is right there in the mechanic's face. It will take 5-10 minutes to drain the coolant from the petcock (faster if remove the lower rad hose) and several bolts to remove the pump. But the shop shouldn't charge more than 0.5-1 hour in addition to a timing belt only job. So always haggle for a complete package deal first.

For instance, a complete timing belt job should include at least ($USD, rockauto.com):

GATES K030295 Micro-V AT Power Steering Belt $5.14
GATES K050435 Micro-V AT Alt/AC Belt $14.10
FEL-PRO TCS45920 Crankshaft Front Seal Set $5.10
FEL-PRO TCS45641 Camshaft Front Seal $3.66
NATIONAL 221820 Polyacrylate Oil Pump Shaft Seal $2.86
GATES TCK199 (1 Belt, 1 Tensioner, 1 Idler) Timing Belt Component Kit
$52.89
STANT 48278 180° w/Jiggle Pin OE Type Thermostat $10.94
AISIN (OEM) WPT010A Water pump w/o housing $30.79
FEL-PRO VS50304R1 Valve Cover Gasket Set w/Spark plug tube seals
$18.26
Subtotal $143.74
US shipping about $20

You might want to add NGK Iridium-IX spark plugs and new radiator hoses (I prefer Gates) for example.

OP's engine is a 1MZ-FE, and would require two idlers, two cam seals. Part numbers might be different too.

As far as the "hydraulic water pump" thing, the belt tensioner is the only thing that is hydraulic in the timing belt/water pump change. The water pump has just a spinning rotor, nothing hydraulic.

[JohnGD]

^ right, the list was for a 4-cyl, let me dig up a 1MZ list...here it is. In the US a complete V6 job is probably $700-900 USD at the dealer that also includes all oil seals and the water pump.

GATES K060410 Micro-V AT Alt/AC Belt $15.28
GATES K040347 Micro-V AT Power Steering Belt $7.43
STANT 48128 180° w/Jiggle Pin OE Type Thermostat $15.34
FEL-PRO TCS45889 Camshaft Front Seal $7.50
FEL-PRO TCS45890 Crankshaft Front Seal Set $5.46
GATES TCK257 (1 Belt, 1 Tensioner, 1 Idler) Timing Belt Component Kit $67.79
Optional DAYCO 85014 Hydraulic Timing Belt Actuator $26.79
FEL-PRO VS50471R Valve Cover Gasket Set w/Spark plug tube seals $19.45
AISIN WPT057 Water Pump $57.79
Subtotal $222.83
Shipping about $20

[pmesfun]

^I recall it was more when I called a dealer, like $1k+.

[71Corolla]

Originally Posted by pmesfun

^I recall it was more when I called a dealer, like $1k+.

If it includes all the parts listed, way way over. You will be paying dealer parts prices, which are quite honestly robbery (it's twice as bad in Canada).

[fenixus]

I wouldn't be surprised if dealer quoted over $1.5k for a complete V6 timing job with water pump and all seals down to oil pump... their labor rates are ... "heavy" not to mention MSRP on all parts.

however to save some money, I think the local dealer should agree to work with original Toyota parts acquired from another dealer (e.g. 30% cheaper from online dealer). they *should* agree to work with such customer parts (all new original Toyota OEM), thus charging labor only plus coolant, oil change, some shop fees and little extras here and there.

on a side note, my V6 had a "timing" job done at Yokem Toyota in Shreveport, Louisiana at 98k miles. from dealer records displayed on "www.toyota.com/owners" it seems they replaced only 3 belts (timing belt and 2 drive belts) and NOTHING else. not even one seal, nor the water pump, they changed the coolant and other stuff though (ATF flush, motor oil, new spark plugs, cleaning & adjusting brakes, cleaning Throttle Body and such)

[Luc]

This was the kit I bought which included everything that is needed. My friend (Lexus mechanic) flew in to attend his cousin's wedding (friend of mine too), but helped me change everything, even brought some of his tools which were needed (stud extractor for the water pump). He indicated Lexus charges $135 USD/hr while Toyota charges $115 USD/hr. All I had to do was to feed him pizza from Lou Malnati's.

[fenixus]

^ nice

[73sport]

Originally Posted by fenixus

. . . .

on a side note, my V6 had a "timing" job done at Yokem Toyota in Shreveport, Louisiana at 98k miles. from dealer records displayed on "www.toyota.com/owners" it seems they replaced only 3 belts (timing belt and 2 drive belts) and NOTHING else. not even one seal, nor the water pump, they changed the coolant and other stuff though (ATF flush, motor oil, new spark plugs, cleaning & adjusting brakes, cleaning Throttle Body and such)

Do I dare admit this???
My 1MZ has 245,xxx miles on the Original water pump, seals, idlers, gears, etc. . .

I have the original service records at 90,000 and it got the same belt treatment yours did at the stealership. At 190,xxx It got more belts and anti-freeze.

IMO - the OEM parts are superior to any after market parts including the seals. Granted I personally I have never seen a water pump assembly last this long! (Cross fingers) It'll likely bite me this winter but 245,xxx miles. . .

A couple of factors account for it living this long; never overheated, never low on coolant, and coolant changed every three years.
OC done regularly, its not sludge engine, it doesn't leak or burn oil. The PVC system is clean. For these reasons I opted to leave it alone as its not broke.

If you're concerned about bearings going bad, better replace the alternator as PM as it turns about twice the cranks speed! lol

[fenixus]

LOL wow, good to know yours got same treatment from a dealer hehe

at 245k miles I would be a little thrilled about it hehe

well, I'm not planning to touch mine until it hits 180k miles LOL!

1mz has far superior cooling system (to 4cyl), so overheating is unlikely, I also change OEM coolant every 3 years (did a year ago after 3 years from dealer service).
The last time I pulled the front valve cover up it was clean as whistle, running it on synthetics only.

considered I (think) I took care of minor & major tune up items pretty well in last year, it should last long as it looks, feels and runs healthy

however on gen4 5s-fe I wouldn't dare to leave the old water pump in when replacing the timing belt ... WP is the weakest point of that setup, cooling system generally sucks on it (mind the super quick warm up time, it's also super quick likely to overheat when things go wrong).

Originally Posted by 73sport

Do I dare admit this???
My 1MZ has 245,xxx miles on the Original water pump, seals, idlers, gears, etc. . .

I have the original service records at 90,000 and it got the same belt treatment yours did at the stealership. At 190,xxx It got more belts and anti-freeze.

IMO - the OEM parts are superior to any after market parts including the seals. Granted I personally I have never seen a water pump assembly last this long! (Cross fingers) It'll likely bite me this winter but 245,xxx miles. . .

A couple of factors account for it living this long; never overheated, never low on coolant, and coolant changed every three years.
OC done regularly, its not sludge engine, it doesn't leak or burn oil. The PVC system is clean. For these reasons I opted to leave it alone as its not broke.

If you're concerned about bearings going bad, better replace the alternator as PM as it turns about twice the cranks speed! lol

[92alltrac]

Originally Posted by fenixus

on a side note, my V6 had a "timing" job done at Yokem Toyota in Shreveport, Louisiana at 98k miles. from dealer records displayed on "www.toyota.com/owners" it seems they replaced only 3 belts (timing belt and 2 drive belts) and NOTHING else. not even one seal, nor the water pump, they changed the coolant and other stuff though (ATF flush, motor oil, new spark plugs, cleaning & adjusting brakes, cleaning Throttle Body and such)

I registered and checked my Camry I would hate to see the bill the original owner paid. At 91k they did a brake flush, fuel injector service, transmission service, changed T-belt, drive belts, water pump, and a valve adjustment with VC gaskets replaced.

[BMR]

Originally Posted by 73sport

Do I dare admit this???
My 1MZ has 245,xxx miles on the Original water pump, seals, idlers, gears, etc. . .

You're not alone. My Camry went to 260k on the original parts. The water pump started weeping a little puddle of coolant on the floor, so I had the pump, belt, idlers, tensioner, & cam/crank seals replaced at that time. The original belt still looked fine, not even little age-cracks. Amazing.

[fenixus]

OMG, on a V6 motor? that could have cost him like $2k for all parts and labor at dealer!!!

Originally Posted by 92alltrac

I registered and checked my Camry I would hate to see the bill the original owner paid. At 91k they did a brake flush, fuel injector service, transmission service, changed T-belt, drive belts, water pump, and a valve adjustment with VC gaskets replaced.

[pmesfun]

Now I'll be changing the timing belt only next time.