Smoking on start up - Toyota Nation Forum : Toyota Car and Truck Forums

Rowdyrod · 10-23-2011, 05:30 PM

My 94 V6 Camry occassionally emits a cloud of blue/grey smoke on start up. It may be when cold, or after shutting off for 30 minutes. At 125,000 miles I took it to a dealer and they did a full top end rebuild. In just one day, it began smoking again. I took it back and made them go through it again. That worked somewhat for a while, although on rare occassions, it would smoke again. Now at 183,000, it does it frequently, but not everyday. Some say it may be the valve guides, but that should have been done at top end rebuild. I am thinking there is one or more injectors leaking down into the chamber or intake runner and causing the smoke at start up.
If it were guides, I would think it would smoke everytime after sitting a bit.
Anyone else seen, or had this happen with their Camry?

***fenixus*** · 10-23-2011, 07:35 PM

check your invoice. what does the "full top end rebuild" include?

beantickler · 10-23-2011, 09:49 PM

Sounds like valve seals. They are just little rubber seals with a spring wrapped around them that the valves slide through. Maybe the rebuilder didnt seat them right? They definitely should have been replaced because they are very cheap.

An injector leak would not cause blue smoke. And anyhow an injector leak would cause the car to run poorly...

sam333 · 10-23-2011, 10:16 PM

Like what was said above, what was actually done? It does sound like valve seals. Toyota valve seals are not cheap and they may never have replaced them(at least not the second time, seems unthinkable, but some places, even dealerships, do really bad work).

***fenixus*** · 10-23-2011, 10:37 PM

go to www.toyota.com/owners, register your car over there and check the Service History, it will show all detailed parts used in the "top end rebuild", if there is no valve stem seals listed then the dealer tricked you and the issue has never been fixed properly.

deejayphilo · 10-23-2011, 11:04 PM

I have a friend that have the same problem. He went to dealer and yah they did that description top end rebuild but never know how far they rebuilt it. For the third time I help him and slapped another head on it from the yard. Get it preassure tested and resurface it. And now it works. The machine shop said its not what they do on the head because its the head itself that have issue. Factory defect on the cylinder head. Smell the smoke if it smells like burnng oil or burning coolant?

deejayphilo · 10-23-2011, 11:06 PM

When you do that...dont get the cams and shims anymore because they charge you more that way...

Rowdyrod · 10-24-2011, 01:30 PM

I dug out my reciept for the top end job that was done. Apparently, the ONLY thing done was valve seals replaced, NO valve job, along with head gaskets and many other non related parts that did NOT need replacing. I looked up the Toyota on line service records and the only thing the dealer showed was valve seals and NOTHING else.
There were also some FALSE records that the dealer placed that show they replaced the timing chain and cam sprockets on another date and that NEVER took place. Looks like somehow they charged it to warranty.
Not only did I get the worst screwing of my life, the dealer also ripped off Toyota too. Toyota dealers are all crooks. Did you all know that Toyota mechanics get commission on all parts installed? The Dealer service manager told me that. No wonder the mechanic put so many uneeded parts on my car.

***fenixus*** · 10-24-2011, 01:39 PM

ouch, but at least they actually replaced the valve stem seals, right?

sam333 · 10-24-2011, 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rowdyrod

I dug out my reciept for the top end job that was done. Apparently, the ONLY thing done was valve seals replaced, NO valve job, along with head gaskets and many other non related parts that did NOT need replacing. I looked up the Toyota on line service records and the only thing the dealer showed was valve seals and NOTHING else.
There were also some FALSE records that the dealer placed that show they replaced the timing chain and cam sprockets on another date and that NEVER took place. Looks like somehow they charged it to warranty.
Not only did I get the worst screwing of my life, the dealer also ripped off Toyota too. Toyota dealers are all crooks. Did you all know that Toyota mechanics get commission on all parts installed? The Dealer service manager told me that. No wonder the mechanic put so many uneeded parts on my car.

They probably reused the head bolts too ... a no no.

I would contact toyota and let them know about timing chain and sprocket, just for fun.

***BMR*** · 10-24-2011, 02:41 PM

If the valve guides are worn, they can cause newly installed seals to go bad quickly. So I've read. Can't say I've experienced that.

deejayphilo · 10-24-2011, 10:17 PM

It doesn't matter how many times you replace the seal if yah if they use same old bolt. Other thing is to get that head check by the machine shop. Get all measured with caliper and digital bore gauge. The problem there is something mechanical not what they do or have done. Like the saying no such head that give a headache if it is clear head. Maybe one of the margin of the valve is bent or chipped. What they do in toyota is what listed on the job order they dont pay attention the detail. That's why I do all my cars. I have a 93 camry 5sfe .....370,000 miles swap head with 95 camry 5sfe. The bottom end the same just the top end replaced with 150k miles wrecked camry.

***JohnGD*** · 10-24-2011, 11:54 PM

Stem seals alone don't require removing the cylinder head. Mechanics are independent contractors, and the service writer takes a cut too by sending jobs to the cheapest mechanic on the lot.

Rowdyrod · 10-25-2011, 10:16 AM

"Mechanics are independent contractors, and the service writer takes a cut too by sending jobs to the cheapest mechanic on the lot."

So true. I took it back another time(stupid on my part) to have the rear struts replaced and the service writer INSISTED that I bring it in on the day HE was going to be there! I went to the service manager and raised hell with him.

I have two friends who used to work for dealerships. Both told me how crooked they ALL are. Both guys had enough of cheating people and opened their own repair business. I have back problems and cannot do any heavy work anymore so I am screwed when I need work done unless I use the two friends.