Transmission flare or something else?

[Goobee]

I've had my 2008 Camry XLE V6, 6-speed auto since October, 2007. It currently has ~9400 miles and other than multiple interior rattles, it's been trouble free. Last month I started noticing an odd transmission issue. The issue is felt at speeds 40 miles or less during street driving or slow freeway traffic. It happens intermittently and is difficult to duplicate on demand.

The issue occurs like this - I'm driving and the transmission seems to become "loose" (sorta like an exaggerated pause in stepping on and releasing the clutch on a manual transmission) and the engine increases RPMs about 1000 to 2000 and then "reconnects" and drives normally.

Initially, I thought they were sloppy up shifts but it doesn't always involves gear shifts.

When I described the issue to the dealer, the service writer told me it was because the transmission is "electric" and shifts differently than other trannies.

I didn't mention the word "flare" because I wasn't sure if this is the symptoms associated with flares.

What do you guys think?

[desentrix]

When I think of flare, I compare it to this:

You push hard down on the accelerator on slick pavement. The tires spin and don't catch, but when they do, you get a sudden surge-- sub this with RPMs.

You could bring the car to the dealer and have them check to make sure the software is up-to-date and not off. Mine was when I first got it, now I don't notice any real problems, with the exception of some rattling like you mentioned from the dash.

[Goobee]

Yeah, that sounds like the "loose" I am experiencing.

Thanks Toyota.

[niceguy]

Originally Posted by desentrix

When I think of flare, I compare it to this:

You push hard down on the accelerator on slick pavement. The tires spin and don't catch, but when they do, you get a sudden surge-- sub this with RPMs.

You could bring the car to the dealer and have them check to make sure the software is up-to-date and not off. Mine was when I first got it, now I don't notice any real problems, with the exception of some rattling like you mentioned from the dash.

If his car come with traction control, it is hard to make the tire spin.

[thoots]

Originally Posted by Goobee

I've had my 2008 Camry XLE V6, 6-speed auto since October, 2007. It currently has ~9400 miles and other than multiple interior rattles, it's been trouble free. Last month I started noticing an odd transmission issue. The issue is felt at speeds 40 miles or less during street driving or slow freeway traffic. It happens intermittently and is difficult to duplicate on demand.

The issue occurs like this - I'm driving and the transmission seems to become "loose" (sorta like an exaggerated pause in stepping on and releasing the clutch on a manual transmission) and the engine increases RPMs about 1000 to 2000 and then "reconnects" and drives normally.

Initially, I thought they were sloppy up shifts but it doesn't always involves gear shifts.

When I described the issue to the dealer, the service writer told me it was because the transmission is "electric" and shifts differently than other trannies.

I didn't mention the word "flare" because I wasn't sure if this is the symptoms associated with flares.

What do you guys think?

Well, we really need more information to be able to say much of anything at all. What we really need to know is a whole lot more about whether it really involves gear shifts or not. The typical "flare" happens on an upshift, where the transmission allows the engine to rev up in between one gear and the next one it's trying to shift to. If that's what you're getting, that's the "flare."

On the other hand, your dealer can be technically right -- this is a six-speed, electronically-controlled transmission, and it may simply be shifting more often than you've been used to with previous cars that didn't have as many gears. I just wonder if this "not during gear shift" business might actually BE gear shifts that you weren't expecting while you were cruising at a relatively constant speed, or something like that.

So, the better you can define things, the better that we can advise you based upon our experiences, and hopefully the better the dealer can understand what might need to be done about it.

The main thing to understand is that the transmission and the throttle, and even the brakes if you have VSC, are all controlled by computers, and overall by the car's main ECU -- these computers might choose to do things that you wouldn't otherwise expect your car to do. These systems are rather aggressively programmed to minimize emissions and maximize fuel economy, so they generally DO some things that are a bit contrary to what you might have been wanting to do in some situations.

So, if you can weed out anything truly resembling a "flare" from what might just be something you've never seen a car do before, that would certainly help everyone help you a bit more. So, turn off the radio and the HVAC fan, and see if you can't clarify what's going on in some more detail!

[Goobee]

I would say yes, I tend to see it more during upshifts but I can't say for certain that it doesn't happen between shifts.

What I do know for certain is that the issues have only started occurring as of late; during the past 6 months, it did not exhibit these symptoms. It seems to serve no useful purpose for the tranny to lose "bite" and for the engine to rev 1000 to 2000 more RPMs before settling down again.

I guess I'll have to take it back in and hopefully get a better service writer to talk to.

[njerald]

Originally Posted by Goobee

and other than multiple interior rattles, it's been trouble free.

The issue occurs like this - I'm driving and the transmission seems to become "loose" (sorta like an exaggerated pause in stepping on and releasing the clutch on a manual transmission) and the engine increases RPMs about 1000 to 2000 and then "reconnects" and drives normally.

Initially, I thought they were sloppy up shifts but it doesn't always involves gear shifts.

When I described the issue to the dealer, the service writer told me it was because the transmission is "electric" and shifts differently than other trannies.

I didn't mention the word "flare" because I wasn't sure if this is the symptoms associated with flares.

What do you guys think?

I think I made a great decision on a quiet Japan made I4.

[squeakyg]

I have just about the same car and so far so good at 4k miles. I have noticed that the transmission is particular. I believe that is fourth gear we are talking about, but may stand corrected. The transmission likes to be driven through this particular gear. Hesitation in accelerating, before going in to this fourth gear or driving in the upper limits of third will cause the transmission to rev up to 2000rpm. Not all the time, but every so often. The transmission definitely likes to be driven through this gear while accelerating. The transmission seems to LIKE to FEEL the gas pedal.

I also own a 2005 Nissan Maxima. Thats another car whose transmission likes to be driven while accelerating. It too has some of the same peculiar habits. I have came to the conclusion that packing 250+ HP onto a transmission built for consumer driving has its disadvantages. You see, both companies could have easily put in transmission more up to the task of handling that kind of torque at low speeds, but thats about a $3k to $5k price hike. These transmissions are built to howl like the wind, but the torque at low speeds tend to jerk the transmission around. I am of the opinion that we will have to accept the fact that these cars are still a generation ahead of their time, for the $24k - $28k price ranges.

Nevertheless, I too am watching the cars performance very carefully.

[BDawg]

I have a 2008 Camry V6 as well, and it appears that you have an issue similar to mine. Over last few months what I've been noticing is a problem on decelerating. While may car is slowing down say when coming to a stop or a light the engine and the speed come down smoothly Until I hit 40mph. Between 40-25 mph the engine breaks hard, producing somewhat of a jerk and what feels like an abnormally rapid deceleration. Outside of that range below 25...or decelerating from high speeds until I reach 40 the car slows down calmly and quietly. Sounds similar to what you may be having, if not hopefully someone out there might be able to chime in on this situation. Ive never experienced this in any of the other cars that I've owned. Good luck with your Issue GooBee.

[RareBird]

I too have the same car - 2008 XLE V6 auto, purchased Jan '08. I already have 18k mile on my car.

I don't notice any flare. The car does not like to accelerate if you're in 40-60 range. above 70 it will sprint and move fast.

Have no complains, love the fuel economy [I get 27mpg average] with nice acceleration and silky smooth tranny.

I owned and drove daily for 8 years a V8 350hp muscle car before this Camry. I actually like this Camry a lot more. One problem for me - Camry CANNOT brake from 80 to 50, then change lanes and get going quickly - it's just beyond it's tuning. My 'bird 'flew' when i pressed the gas again in this situation and I was 1/4 mile ahead before anybody knew what happened. I'd think with 260+ horses it should not be an issue, but it is. Camry's definitely tuned for fuel economy, not quickness. For comparison, it was a great trip when i got 15-17mpg in my bird.

[ghz]

I have the same issue in my '09 SE V6. It happens somewhere between the 3-4 or 4-5 upshift, where it will occasionally slip out of gear for a moment, causing the revs to go up a few hundred or so. Letting off the throttle usually does it, but I still have trouble reproducing it. I'm sure the dealer isn't going to find anything when I tell them (as evidenced by them trying to convince me it was normal over the phone). It doesn't really matter though, since I'll probably trade the car before my extended warranty is up. I'd hate to be the poor guy who buys the car after the warranty is up only to have the damn transmission fail.

-G

[RedruM7]

Originally Posted by RareBird

I too have the same car - 2008 XLE V6 auto, purchased Jan '08. I already have 18k mile on my car.

I don't notice any flare. The car does not like to accelerate if you're in 40-60 range. above 70 it will sprint and move fast.

Have no complains, love the fuel economy [I get 27mpg average] with nice acceleration and silky smooth tranny.

I owned and drove daily for 8 years a V8 350hp muscle car before this Camry. I actually like this Camry a lot more. One problem for me - Camry CANNOT brake from 80 to 50, then change lanes and get going quickly - it's just beyond it's tuning. My 'bird 'flew' when i pressed the gas again in this situation and I was 1/4 mile ahead before anybody knew what happened. I'd think with 260+ horses it should not be an issue, but it is. Camry's definitely tuned for fuel economy, not quickness. For comparison, it was a great trip when i got 15-17mpg in my bird.

To be honest, in my opinion the camry is not tuned for responsiveness, speed wise its definitely quick. I know precisely what you mean though. The v6 camry is really fast, but like I said just not very responsive or precise, if your really handy with the manual mode you can get kind of get around this. I find driving the camry agressive in tight turns very hard, I think the lack of a true clutch shows its flaws, because in my 3000GT I could just use the clutch rev the engine and pull out of the curve keeping the engine in the sweet spot.

I had the flares too (basically the car goes into neutral for a split second between shifts and it revs the engine and not the wheels) they flashed it, worked fine for about a week and came back.

Originally Posted by BDawg

I have a 2008 Camry V6 as well, and it appears that you have an issue similar to mine. Over last few months what I've been noticing is a problem on decelerating. While may car is slowing down say when coming to a stop or a light the engine and the speed come down smoothly Until I hit 40mph. Between 40-25 mph the engine breaks hard, producing somewhat of a jerk and what feels like an abnormally rapid deceleration. Outside of that range below 25...or decelerating from high speeds until I reach 40 the car slows down calmly and quietly. Sounds similar to what you may be having, if not hopefully someone out there might be able to chime in on this situation. Ive never experienced this in any of the other cars that I've owned. Good luck with your Issue GooBee.

The rough breaking sounds like the car may be downshifting into first gear too early, because that happens to me when I quickly downshift to first. First time I've heard of this problem in automatic mode, try manual mode and see if that still happens.

[BlackCamSe]

my camry just reciently started flareing. Its only by 500RPM or so