How close can you get a stock system to sound like a Lexicon/Mark Levinson?

[MJZ]

OK, question to all you audio guys out there.

Regarding the stock '07+ Camry systems, there have been an incredible amount of discrepancy of satisfaction.

For me:

Inadequate Mids
Clear highs
Overpowering Lows
Average Sound Stage

Most of the time, I have the EQ set as:

Bass - 3
Treble - 2

This is to compensate for the inadequate midrange, and you basically turn up the volume to higher than you would at flat.

So, if you guys have ever heard the Mark Levinsons in the Lexus LS or the Lexicons in the Hyundai Genesis -> These are systems that sound superb without any tweaking.

My question is, has anyone achieved a similar sound quality by using aftermarket speakers? If so, what did you end up using and what did you cost you?

PS, if you think the Bass is inadequate in the stock Camry system, you need not apply. No offense to Bass heads, but you are clearly not Audiophiles.

[MJZ]

^ Ah I wish I could get a Lexus LS!! If only $$$ (Not sold on Hyundais)

Hahah.

I don't want to spend more than $500 for the speakers with installation to get it as close to Lexicon/ML as possible. No upgrades to Alternators and no warranty breaching either.

[Netforcer]

Lexicon system in the Genesis is amazing... no way you can get the stock system sounding like that without going aftermarket

[PhatRoyale]

The only other car that the Lexicon sound system is found in is a Rolls Royce Phantom.

[JSM1284]

Personally, I think the JBL in my 07 Camry sounded alot better than the Mark Levinson in my Lexus....

[JustAnotherAsian]

ditch the rears. not only are they playing at full frequency (nevertheless adding too much rear fill), there is a lack of phase compensation and proper staging. by the time the sound from the fronts and rears reach your ears, certain frequencies would have been attenuated and certain frequencies would have been amplified (hence the booming bass from 6x9's running at sub 20 rms).

fade to the front a little (or a lot depending on taste). you may lose bass, mids, and highs altogether by doing so, but at least the bass, mids, and highs that get to your ear are clean. you can compensate by simply raising the volume, but then you start getting to more minute phase differences between left and right, distortion from the inadequacies of the head units, and distortion from oval speakers (round ftw!). you can also compensate by tuning the bass and treble down, but then you've probably realized that you're tuning down too much of a range on either end (tuning both the bass and treble likely also inadvertently attenuates mids). 2-3 parameters are not sufficient enough- you'd need a head unit that can do at least 7 parameters, each with a narrow frequency window to change.

i've used 6x9 pioneer A6972 (or something like that) in addition to a small 8" sub in the trunk all around to compensate. i've recently realized that i was merely fooling myself. those pioneer speakers are cheap and distort too early imo. the phase difference between front and rear also gets noticeable at times. i've recently simply faded to the front, and now i'm running into the issue of not-enough-juice.

i'm considering components for the front either running off the head unit or running of a 2.1 amp.

[Tobeit]

Originally Posted by JustAnotherAsian

ditch the rears. not only are they playing at full frequency (nevertheless adding too much rear fill), there is a lack of phase compensation and proper staging. by the time the sound from the fronts and rears reach your ears, certain frequencies would have been attenuated and certain frequencies would have been amplified (hence the booming bass from 6x9's running at sub 20 rms).

fade to the front a little (or a lot depending on taste). you may lose bass, mids, and highs altogether by doing so, but at least the bass, mids, and highs that get to your ear are clean. you can compensate by simply raising the volume, but then you start getting to more minute phase differences between left and right, distortion from the inadequacies of the head units, and distortion from oval speakers (round ftw!). you can also compensate by tuning the bass and treble down, but then you've probably realized that you're tuning down too much of a range on either end (tuning both the bass and treble likely also inadvertently attenuates mids). 2-3 parameters are not sufficient enough- you'd need a head unit that can do at least 7 parameters, each with a narrow frequency window to change.

Maybe turning the radio off really eliminates any of this mentioned problems and gets rid of the overpowering bass entirely .

[MJZ]

I'll try fading to front and see if it helps... thanks.

[ebumdude]

aftermarket speakers and amp is your best bet. i dont want to push a particular product on you, (not like I sell them anyways)...but, POLK makes really good component sets that are affordable that will satisfy your sound needs.

they are affordable if you buy them from ebay instead of polk.com.

[87XJRob]

I have heard both and not really impressed.....my stock (non JBL)08 avalon did not sound far behind either and it really sucked :-). I replaced the front and rear with cheapie MB Quarts 6.5" discus components($90 per set) and dug up my old Soundstream X-over and reference 200 and hooked them off a single Dave Navone LOC tied into the front links of the stock deck and it blows away any of those High priced stock setups. The Lexicon system has 17 speakers and my 9 speakers(replaced the factory 3.5 in center dash with PolkDB and have a 12" Increminator Audio Leathal Injecion in an undersized box in the trunk) blow them away. Mids and Highs alone could probably be powered of the deck and sound better than those systems, but I had the amp, crossover, and sub laying around, so why not? Granted I had the amps, crossovers, and some of the wiring and did all the labor; I only have a few hundred in the system and after looking at the stock wax paper cones for the 6.5s and 6X9s and the headphones for tweets; I knew they had to go and were the reason it sounded so flat. Heck, my wife's 03 tahoe with stock Bose rivals these two "high end" systems.
I got my comps at http://www.sonicelectronix.com/, they carry most brands at cheap prices.

[MJZ]

I drove a rental '08 base Avalon and the sound was inferior to the stock Camrys (Equalizer tweaked on both).

So not sure where you are coming from. Bose sounds like crap, and doesn't come close to MLs or Lexicons.

[Streaker]

I have the stock JBL system with an Infinity subwoofer in the trunk. I find that fading to front helps.

[CharmCityES]

i have mark levinson

the sound quality is superior to any other system ive ever heard

[87XJRob]

If I am not mistaken, stock and premium sound on camry's are JBL (and have better processing) than the base (pioneer)Avalon(premium is JBL); so that statement is true. At the end of the day, you pull your 07-09 camry door panel and you will find the same crappy 6X9 with paper cones and magnets the size of your thumbnail. You may have a little better processing in the camry(subjective to individuals ears, of course) but at the stock level you are still polishing turds(speaker quality). You say equilizer tweaked on both....I don't consider adjusting (on non-JBL Avalon)bass, treble, and crappy noise compensation processing called ASL low-medium-high (always kept in the off position) any sort of equalization.
Generalization that bose (AKA blose) sucks is acceptable, but I am judging this based on what I have actually heard/owned; the 11-speaker Bose in 03-06 Tahoes, Yukons, and Escalades are on par with 08 Lexus GS/ES Levinson, and the 09 Genesis Lexicon systems. 07 and newer Tahoes, Yukons, and Lades Bose systems suck compared to the previous generation.

Lexicon looks like paper cones to me and look comparable to toyota stock....
while for pennies on the dollar, I have clear, clean, and better imaging out of my front MB Quart components (powered by a 200 watt amp with the gain turned to half) than Lexicon's 17 speaker (528 watts) could dream of. I did a side by side comparison at the Hyundai lot to shut the sales guy up about how superior the sound is even to aftermarket sound, he didn't like me too much after I proved my point in front of other customers/salesmen; yes I don't have 7.1, but in reality who listens to DVDs all the time(that didn't go over well either).
I have installed Home/Car Audio for over 17 years, so I know a little about sound quality and installation; I have yet to hear a factory system of any caliber/make that I was overly impressed with. I don't consider this worth the $4000 extra (10% of the cars cost, and far beyond any Hyundai's worth).

http://www.hemagazine.com/Lexicon_Hy...s_Audio_System

[MJZ]

^ Thx for analysis Rob.

For Cost/$ cheapness, what units would you suggest that I could install to boost the mids/soundstage/clarity/dynamic range?

Someone above suggested Pioneers.