2AZFE - 2.4L 4cly - Swap/Replace - Camry vs Scion Engine Differences

[SilvaChris1]

Ok fellas, I'm a newb to the site, and I've searched all over the net for an answer to this. I'm posting it over in another section too since I'm not really sure if it fits here or in Hardcore Tech.

First some background info. My mother-in-law has a 2005 Camry with the 2AZFE 2.4L 4. It has 145k on the clock. The engine had a rod knocking before hand, was blowing oil back out around the filler cap, rings were going bad in it, and just jumped time 2 weeks ago. So now it's up to me to replace it for her. Right now she's riding around in my car, and my spare got hit in a parking lot so it's going to the shop. I need to get her back in her car quick. She's a single mom supporting 3, and needs to do this on the cheap. But rather than attempt to cheaply repair a 150k engine, she's opted to change it out with a lower mileage from an online company.

My question is about the differences between the 2AZFE engines. Mainly, the Camry engine vs the Scion engine, or the Camry engine vs the Highlander engine. The Camry engines are considerably more expensive than the Scion TC engines. One example is a 6 month warranty, 62K mile Camry engine for 1300-1400; and a 6 month-1 year warranty 11K mile Scion engine for 850-1000. The Scion engines are better deals by a great margin, but there must be some difference. It's not a Federal vs California emissions thing either. One place mentioned that the timing cover might need changed, but couldn't tell me for sure unless I purchased from them. I need to know what the deal is before I purchase because I want to be sure I can do it without too much trouble or cost involved.

Is it parts I can just pull off the motor that's currently in the car when we swap, or is it extra purchases at the dealership, Ebay, and NAPA?

Thanks guys, hopefully you can help me out, cause I'm lost on this one, and the internet hasn't offered any help.

[BlackCamSe]

The engine in her car must not have been maintained properly. These engines usually go allot more then 150K. The scion has the 2AZ, as does the Camry so i don't see why you wouldn't be able to swap that into your moms car with little to no modification. Keep in mind that Scions are usually driven by young kids, so the engines probably took some abuse. Also, the intake manifold and exhaust manifold, and some of the accessories MIGHT be different because i know an intake from a Camry wont fit on a Tc or visa versa.

[darksparkz]

The driveshaft might be different lengths, are you swapping engine only, or engine/tranny? You may have to swap ECUs too.

[SilvaChris1]

Originally Posted by BlackCamSe

The engine in her car must not have been maintained properly. These engines usually go allot more then 150K. The scion has the 2AZ, as does the Camry so i don't see why you wouldn't be able to swap that into your moms car with little to no modification. Keep in mind that Scions are usually driven by young kids, so the engines probably took some abuse. Also, the intake manifold and exhaust manifold, and some of the accessories MIGHT be different because i know an intake from a Camry wont fit on a Tc or visa versa.

I really don't know how well it was maintained, since it's my wife's mother's car. She says she had the oil changed every time the "maint reqd" light came on, but I can't really picture it. I honestly don't know. I do know that it's pretty much treated as an appliance, and nothing more.

Yeah, I would think that the modifications would be pretty minimal. I knew about the intake and exhaust manifolds; the replacement engines wont ship with those anyways. I have assumptions about what will need changed but don't have anything to base them on. I would think that the timing cover might need changed. Are the accessories and drive belt in the same placement/routing on the two? Is the part number different for the timing covers on the two?

And yeah, the thought of a young kid abusing the Scion engine does worry me a little, but I'd rather change the rear main seal and hope for the best on a 10k mile engine than I would to replace the rear main, front oil seal, water pump, timing set, and other things on a 60k+ mile engine. Who knows.

Originally Posted by darksparkz

The driveshaft might be different lengths, are you swapping engine only, or engine/tranny? You may have to swap ECUs too.

Engine only. Just planned on bolting up the transmission that's already in the car and bolting everything up. Would the ECU tune from the Camry have any issues controlling the Scion engine? Are there any major differences to cause worry with the tune of her current ECU?

Thanks guys, this is a good start.

[Netforcer]

In the end... even if you get the tC engine, the cost of retune, and spare parts to fit the camry will probably be equal to just getting the Camry engine... So I say save yourself and the shop the trouble and get what's right.

[SilvaChris1]

Originally Posted by Netforcer

In the end... even if you get the tC engine, the cost of retune, and spare parts to fit the camry will probably be equal to just getting the Camry engine... So I say save yourself and the shop the trouble and get what's right.

I can appreciate what you're saying, but they're supposedly *technically* "the same engine"? I am the installer on this one cause she doesn't have the money to pay a shop to do the work, or to spare on an expensive high mileage. I'm fairly mechanically inclined, and have been involved in more than a few tear-downs/rebuilds, installs over the years. The trouble is going to be mine either route we take, lol. That's why I'm asking here. Nobody on the internet seems to know. I called 3 different local dealers, and they let me talk to some tech's, none of which could tell me anything other than "the head and block should be the same, but other than that, I'm not sure". Then I called some local salvage yards, and got the same answer.

I know this won't be a direct drop in without work, but I'm hoping somebody can tell me what all is different. I know another member here has been asking the same question too. The real reason behind this isn't just the savings; for the lower price, you end up with a better warranty, a fraction of the mileage, and don't need to buy a new timing chain, tensioner/guide, and water pump to keep the warranty valid. I can live with not buying those extras, still keeping the warranty, and just having to swap parts off the motor that's still in her car.

Somebody please help.

[dorman68]

This is info I have received from a salvage interchange index.




If your car has federal emissions these will interchange
CAMRY 04-06 2.4L (VIN E, 5th digit, 2AZFE eng, 4 cyl), Fed
SOLARA 04-06 2.4L (VIN E, 5th digit, 2AZFE eng, 4 cyl)


If your car has California emissions these will interchange
CAMRY 03-06 2.4L (VIN E, 5th digit, 2AZFE eng, 4 cyl), Calif

[Redline_Me]

The only thing that i would see any difference in is the positioning of the motor and trany in the engine bay. I'm sure that Camry and Scion use the same motor and trany. I suggest you put a Camry and a Tc next to each other and see what the differences are in the shaping of the headers and intake manifold. I know that for turbo applications in the Camry they use a Tc manifold but shave the block to make it fit.

[SilvaChris1]

Originally Posted by dorman68

This is info I have received from a salvage interchange index.

If your car has federal emissions these will interchange
CAMRY 04-06 2.4L (VIN E, 5th digit, 2AZFE eng, 4 cyl), Fed
SOLARA 04-06 2.4L (VIN E, 5th digit, 2AZFE eng, 4 cyl)

If your car has California emissions these will interchange
CAMRY 03-06 2.4L (VIN E, 5th digit, 2AZFE eng, 4 cyl), Calif

Thanks man. I appreciate that. It might offer us a couple more options.

Originally Posted by Redline_Me

The only thing that i would see any difference in is the positioning of the motor and trany in the engine bay. I'm sure that Camry and Scion use the same motor and trany. I suggest you put a Camry and a Tc next to each other and see what the differences are in the shaping of the headers and intake manifold. I know that for turbo applications in the Camry they use a Tc manifold but shave the block to make it fit.

That makes sense. Does anybody know if the motor mount attaches to different locations on these engines? Another thought... does anybody have access to the part numbers for the timing covers for each engine? Are they different?

Thanks guys, I appreciate the information and advice.

[Redline_Me]

I wanna say that the motor mounts are different because i don't think the Tc has that top mount on the passenger side. But it is possible that the holes are there, since i would think that the same cast was used when the head was made for both cars. This is only speculation though.

[SilvaChris1]

Originally Posted by Redline_Me

I wanna say that the motor mounts are different because i don't think the Tc has that top mount on the passenger side. But it is possible that the holes are there, since i would think that the same cast was used when the head was made for both cars. This is only speculation though.

Do the mounts bolt to the same locations on these engines, and just different places on the car? Or do they bolt up in separate places and need those places replaced. Alot of things mount to the timing cover, so that might be one of the reasons right there. I wonder what would need changed on the driver side?

[Redline_Me]

idk the best way is as i said take a look at both engine bays.

[Pawel062]

you can also try to pm gene on here. he might be able to tell you the differences.

[SilvaChris1]

Originally Posted by Redline_Me

idk the best way is as i said take a look at both engine bays.

Yeah, you're right about that. I just thought I'd ask since my mind is kinda running in all different directions right now. I'd look at another engine bay, if I had a Scion around here right now. It's about a 45 minute drive to the nearest dealer. I've gotta take my car in for an estimate tomorrow (old lady backed into it in a parking lot) so I'll stop by the Toyota/Scion dealer on my way back home.

I finally got a little information from a dealer today. They confirmed what I was already pretty sure about... the two engines definitely use different timing covers. He could not tell me what the differences were in them though. Said that the block and heads were definitely the same, and that the only thing I should theoretically have to change would be things that bolt to the engine (which I should already have in her busted car). He said sensor locations *might* be different, but even if they were, the wires should still reach, and if they didn't I can just extend them.

[SilvaChris1]

Originally Posted by Pawel062

you can also try to pm gene on here. he might be able to tell you the differences.

Thanks I will do that. What is his user name?