5th & 6th Generation (2002-2006 & 2007-2011)Toyota Camry Discussion for years: 2002-2006 & 2007-2011
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I don't know if this is common or not but recently my 04 Camry spit out the codes P2121 and P2128. The dealer said that I need a new Accelerator Pedal Assembly. They want $427 for part and another $250 in labor. Sounds like a rip off to me.
Has anyone installed one of these? It looks like it has just 2 bolts holding it to the floor and 1 electrical connection (plug). Seems like it would only take about 15 min. at most to install.
Am I missing something? Would I be safe to install it myself or is there some type of software calibration that would need to take place? I just don't get why it would take ~2 or more hours to install this part.
If they are lying about the labor time needed, aren't they required to follow a standardized labor book for auto repairs? Do I need to report them?
I don't know if this is common or not but recently my 04 Camry spit out the codes P2121 and P2128. The dealer said that I need a new Accelerator Pedal Assembly. They want $427 for part and another $250 in labor. Sounds like a rip off to me.
Has anyone installed one of these? It looks like it has just 2 bolts holding it to the floor and 1 electrical connection (plug). Seems like it would only take about 15 min. at most to install.
Am I missing something? Would I be safe to install it myself or is there some type of software calibration that would need to take place? I just don't get why it would take ~2 or more hours to install this part.
If they are lying about the labor time needed, aren't they required to follow a standardized labor book for auto repairs? Do I need to report them?
i am not sure why you needed to start a whole new thread when you could have just continued your other one, but that being said......
there may indeed be re-calibrations needed......which ones, how many, i do not know.
the labor rate may very well be standard @ say $100 per hour. i do not believe that any dealer charges less than 1 hour anymore. many years ago, they charged by the tenth of an hour, so for instance, .5 would have been a half hour. .3 would be about 18 minutes....(or so). for instance, when i had my mud flaps installed, i was told the labor rate was 1 hour, no matter if the job took 25 minuted or 55 minutes.......1 hour is a standard beginning charge for anything. and to set the record, i wasn't about to jack up my car, remove tires, install mud flaps, put tires back on, etc,etc......i can pay for things and keep clean, i'll let someone else get dirty....
in todays cars/trucks, there can be and will be many things in the way of a mechanic to get to the part needing replacement. also time for testing will be factored into the labor charges as well. years ago, diagnostic time when you paid for the repair, was used towards the repairs. now, diagnostic times are NOT and they are a whole separate charge we pay for, THEN we pay for the repairs/parts as well.....
just make sure you ask, if the dealer does ALL the work, how long is the part/labor warranted for. as i said in your other thread, General Motors had a warranty that if you paid for parts/labor for whatever part, you NEVER had to pay for that ever again, it was covered for life......so ask the toyota dealer about their warranty on this repair/part....
The $426 assembly can be purchased on line for $307 or less if you search. It might indeed require calibration, but then it might work out of the box. For the adventuresome, buy the discounted part, install and start it up and see what happens. You can always take it to the dealer later for calibration.
__________________
2007 V6 Camry LE, Built TMMK 27 September 06
"People who think they know it all are particularly irritating to those of us who do."
The Following User Says Thank You to gdanaher For This Useful Post:
i am not sure why you needed to start a whole new thread when you could have just continued your other one, but that being said......
there may indeed be re-calibrations needed......which ones, how many, i do not know.
the labor rate may very well be standard @ say $100 per hour. i do not believe that any dealer charges less than 1 hour anymore. many years ago, they charged by the tenth of an hour, so for instance, .5 would have been a half hour. .3 would be about 18 minutes....(or so). for instance, when i had my mud flaps installed, i was told the labor rate was 1 hour, no matter if the job took 25 minuted or 55 minutes.......1 hour is a standard beginning charge for anything. and to set the record, i wasn't about to jack up my car, remove tires, install mud flaps, put tires back on, etc,etc......i can pay for things and keep clean, i'll let someone else get dirty....
in todays cars/trucks, there can be and will be many things in the way of a mechanic to get to the part needing replacement. also time for testing will be factored into the labor charges as well. years ago, diagnostic time when you paid for the repair, was used towards the repairs. now, diagnostic times are NOT and they are a whole separate charge we pay for, THEN we pay for the repairs/parts as well.....
just make sure you ask, if the dealer does ALL the work, how long is the part/labor warranted for. as i said in your other thread, General Motors had a warranty that if you paid for parts/labor for whatever part, you NEVER had to pay for that ever again, it was covered for life......so ask the toyota dealer about their warranty on this repair/part....
let us know how you make out with this.
I started a new post because when I searched the forum I could not find any threads that are titled "Accelerator Pedal Assembly". It is important to me and probably others to determine if this is a common occurence or an isolated incident. My other thread was more focused on the Throttle Body which I originally thought was the problem....and it may still be that if the Accel Ped Asmbly does not resolve my issue.
I will ask today at the dealership that agreed to sell me the part at a discounted price if there is any calibration involved in the install and also about the warranty on part/labor. Originally toyotaparts.com employee told me it was under the std Toyota warranty of 1 year.
As for labor, I still think they are ripping me off. I paid the $55 diagnostic fee and they want to charge me $250 for labor of which the $55 would be applied to the repair job if I have it done there within 30 days. But still, 2.5 hours of labor charge seems excessive to me unless there truly is more to it than I understand at this point.
That is why I hope there is someone else on this board that has knowledge of this particular install and the time involved. I hope they show up soon because I am picking the part up today and thinking of doing it myself.
I started a new post because when I searched the forum I could not find any threads that are titled "Accelerator Pedal Assembly". It is important to me and probably others to determine if this is a common occurence or an isolated incident. My other thread was more focused on the Throttle Body which I originally thought was the problem....and it may still be that if the Accel Ped Asmbly does not resolve my issue.
I will ask today at the dealership that agreed to sell me the part at a discounted price if there is any calibration involved in the install and also about the warranty on part/labor. Originally toyotaparts.com employee told me it was under the std Toyota warranty of 1 year.
As for labor, I still think they are ripping me off. I paid the $55 diagnostic fee and they want to charge me $250 for labor of which the $55 would be applied to the repair job if I have it done there within 30 days. But still, 2.5 hours of labor charge seems excessive to me unless there truly is more to it than I understand at this point.
That is why I hope there is someone else on this board that has knowledge of this particular install and the time involved. I hope they show up soon because I am picking the part up today and thinking of doing it myself.
i may (or may not) have particular knowledge of this repair, on this particular car, or the cost involved, but that's only because i was an ASE Certified mechanic for a mere 17 years, and just don't turn too many wrenches anymore, plus i hardly have any reason or reasons to check on prices..... but this doesn't stop me from trying to help out with advice when i can....i can also assure you that YOU CAN do this yourself......HOWEVER.....if the pedal needs to be re-calibrated.....how you going to get it to the dealer....???
i would hope (for you) that when you go and re-connect the battery cable, and let the engine idle for "about 10 minutes" that the accelerator pedal sensor will "learn" what its supposed to do.......and frankly, it should.
as i have said more than a few times now, let us know how you make out.
The last one I worked on like yours had a throttle position sensor built on the side of the pedal.
It had slotted holes and 2 small screws holding it down.
Now, this particular car had no throttle response for 1/3 the pedal travel. Then wham, high revs came in.
I just adjusted those 2 screws and had my pedal responce back. If you're going to do this yourself, and install a new pedal, try that on the old one first.
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Think of the pedal as a joystick attached to your computer. The computer needs to know what electrical value presents itself for zero ohms impedance and for infinite impedance and you need to calibrate for accuracy. They (the pedals) will all be close, and if construction of the pedal assembly is consistent then it should be extremely close to correct, so if money is tight, I certainly would give it a shot. It takes 2 bolts to remove it and the plug is a press fit. If it does not act normally you can always take your new pedal to the dealer and pay the hourly rate to reinstall and calibrate, but I suspect it will be fine. Pull the battery positive and let it sit for awhile and then everything will be relearned.
On a related 'learning' note, it might help to turn the ignition key to the on position and depress the pedal to the floor a few times. I have no idea if this would train the computer to any new settings, but it isn't going to hurt
__________________
2007 V6 Camry LE, Built TMMK 27 September 06
"People who think they know it all are particularly irritating to those of us who do."
Last edited by gdanaher; 12-08-2010 at 10:09 AM.
The Following User Says Thank You to gdanaher For This Useful Post:
The last one I worked on like yours had a throttle position sensor built on the side of the pedal.
It had slotted holes and 2 small screws holding it down.
Now, this particular car had no throttle response for 1/3 the pedal travel. Then wham, high revs came in.
I just adjusted those 2 screws and had my pedal responce back. If you're going to do this yourself, and install a new pedal, try that on the old one first.
My car is acting the same way you describe for the pedal travel. Can you explain in more detail what you mentioned about adjusting the two screws? I can clearly see the two bolts that hold the pedal assembly to the floor. I don't think they are what you are referring to. Are you saying that there are screws to adjust near the sensor that would reposition the pedal where it can be calibrated differently? How can you adjust that pedal without having the car rev when you start it if the accelerator ends up in a depressed position after the adjustment?
As it is right now, I can get my car up to 50mph, but it doesn't shift to a higher gear and the rpms are at 3000. I had to drive somewhere yesterday and with the delay in the pedal and the high rpms, I'm sure I was not getting the best gas mileage... and it kind of wore me out by the time I got back to the house.....
Think of the pedal as a joystick attached to your computer. The computer needs to know what electrical value presents itself for zero ohms impedance and for infinite impedance and you need to calibrate for accuracy. They (the pedals) will all be close, and if construction of the pedal assembly is consistent then it should be extremely close to correct, so if money is tight, I certainly would give it a shot. It takes 2 bolts to remove it and the plug is a press fit. If it does not act normally you can always take your new pedal to the dealer and pay the hourly rate to reinstall and calibrate, but I suspect it will be fine. Pull the battery positive and let it sit for awhile and then everything will be relearned.
On a related 'learning' note, it might help to turn the ignition key to the on position and depress the pedal to the floor a few times. I have no idea if this would train the computer to any new settings, but it isn't going to hurt
Yes, thank you. I think I will try the install myself after a quick discussion at the dealer when I go there today to pick up the part. I appreciate your info provided above.
For the record, money being tight is not the issue for me. What irks me is that the dealer may be overcharging by a substantial amount which would be extremely unethical and I will be reporting them to the appropriate agency if it turns out to be so.
If they are doing it to me you know they are making it a regular practice of doing it to others also.
i may (or may not) have particular knowledge of this repair, on this particular car, or the cost involved, but that's only because i was an ASE Certified mechanic for a mere 17 years, and just don't turn too many wrenches anymore, plus i hardly have any reason or reasons to check on prices..... but this doesn't stop me from trying to help out with advice when i can....i can also assure you that YOU CAN do this yourself......HOWEVER.....if the pedal needs to be re-calibrated.....how you going to get it to the dealer....???
i would hope (for you) that when you go and re-connect the battery cable, and let the engine idle for "about 10 minutes" that the accelerator pedal sensor will "learn" what its supposed to do.......and frankly, it should.
as i have said more than a few times now, let us know how you make out.
thanks.
Glenn;
I don't want you to feel like I am discounting your advice. I appreciate your background and willingness to help. I'm hoping that if the pedal needs to be recalibrated after installing the new one, I can just pop out the new one and put the old one in again. Or I have free towing on my insurance so I could exercise that option if needed.
I will definitely take your advice to let the car idle for 10 min. That is a good suggestion.
I just talked to the parts guy where I am picking up the part and asked him about the install. He said based on conversations he has had several times with the techs that this is a 7 min. install. There is no calibration required. Just bolt it in and I should be good to go. I will undo the battery and let it idle for 10 min but other than that it should be a pretty simple job.
I still want to talk to another person in service dept just to confirm. I will update my experience here.
My car is acting the same way you describe for the pedal travel. Can you explain in more detail what you mentioned about adjusting the two screws? I can clearly see the two bolts that hold the pedal assembly to the floor. I don't think they are what you are referring to. Are you saying that there are screws to adjust near the sensor that would reposition the pedal where it can be calibrated differently? How can you adjust that pedal without having the car rev when you start it if the accelerator ends up in a depressed position after the adjustment?
As it is right now, I can get my car up to 50mph, but it doesn't shift to a higher gear and the rpms are at 3000. I had to drive somewhere yesterday and with the delay in the pedal and the high rpms, I'm sure I was not getting the best gas mileage... and it kind of wore me out by the time I got back to the house.....
When you have the pedal out and in your hands, you'll see what I was talking about. Should have factory yellow paint on the screws.
It's been over a year since I did that so memory is dim at this point.
However, I do remember I had the scan tool right there in front of me watching the voltage readings on the data list.
When I gave the TPS a tweak and saw the proper voltage, I was back in business.
Since you don't have the proper diagnostic tools, it would be a shot in the dark for you.
A new pedal should get you going and be done with it.
The Following User Says Thank You to Tech1984 For This Useful Post:
I just talked to the parts guy where I am picking up the part and asked him about the install. He said based on conversations he has had several times with the techs that this is a 7 min. install. There is no calibration required. Just bolt it in and I should be good to go. I will undo the battery and let it idle for 10 min but other than that it should be a pretty simple job.
I still want to talk to another person in service dept just to confirm. I will update my experience here.
i think the partsman would be telling you the right way, as he has something to lose, and that's YOU as HIS customer....!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tech1984
When you have the pedal out and in your hands, you'll see what I was talking about. Should have factory yellow paint on the screws.
It's been over a year since I did that so memory is dim at this point.
However, I do remember I had the scan tool right there in front of me watching the voltage readings on the data list.
When I gave the TPS a tweak and saw the proper voltage, I was back in business.
Since you don't have the proper diagnostic tools, it would be a shot in the dark for you.
A new pedal should get you going and be done with it.
what he can do is mark on the new pedal assembly, maybe with "white out" or something similar the position of the mounting. then if need be, maybe the repair shop (not the dealer) can zero it in for him....
I just picked up the part and brought it home. Whipped out my ratchet set and unplugged the battery. Then I opened the drivers side door and put the knee pad on the floor of garage, kneeled down and unplugged the connection and took out the two bolts of the old pedal assembly. Promptly opened the new pedal assembly and installed it with the two bolts from the old one and plugged back in the connection.
Then I reattached the battery cables and shut the hood of my car. Got in the drivers seat and pressed the pedal to the floor a couple of times. Then I turned the ignition on and PRESTO! Worked like a CHARM.
I let it idle for a few minutes and took it for a test drive around the neighborhood. It has excellent response, maybe better than before but who knows because I have been driving around a few days with the delay on my pedal so it seem extra responsive to me now.
I can't remember where my idle engine rpm was before the new pedal. It idles at the notch just below the 1000x. I would say it idles somewhere between 650-750 rpm. Is that the proper idle speed of the engine?
I certainly hope this thread gives others the confidence to do this simple job themselves if the same thing happens to them. I want to thank all of you who responded to me with your kind words of advice. Also a big thanks to Ralph at the Toyota Parts Desk who gave me great confidence in the DIY job. He even double checked the labor requirements before I arrived to pick up the part. He assured me there was nothing difficult I would encounter. Essentially, just plug and play as was mentioned in one of the posts above. Almost like a joy stick on your computer.
If I can help anyone else who sees this post please let me know. I'd be more than happy to do so.
Saved approximately $373. over the Dealer price for the job.
Finally, my last step is to report the Dealer who wanted to charge me $650 + tax for this job. I am going to start by filing a complaint with Toyota Headquarters about this dealership.
Can anyone tell me the name of the particular regulatory agency that oversees labor charging standards? I'm sure they would be interested to hear my story.
Last edited by cyberslider; 12-08-2010 at 07:24 PM.
Reason: edit price I saved for job as I forgot tax
I just picked up the part and brought it home. Whipped out my ratchet set and unplugged the battery. Then I opened the drivers side door and put the knee pad on the floor of garage, kneeled down and unplugged the connection and took out the two bolts of the old pedal assembly. Promptly opened the new pedal assembly and installed it with the two bolts from the old one and plugged back in the connection.
Then I reattached the battery cables and shut the hood of my car. Got in the drivers seat and pressed the pedal to the floor a couple of times. Then I turned the ignition on and PRESTO! Worked like a CHARM.
I let it idle for a few minutes and took it for a test drive around the neighborhood. It has excellent response, maybe better than before but who knows because I have been driving around a few days with the delay on my pedal so it seem extra responsive to me now.
I can't remember where my idle engine rpm was before the new pedal. It idles at the notch just below the 1000x. I would say it idles somewhere between 650-750 rpm. Is that the proper idle speed of the engine?
yes, this is where about my engine idles at... good going by the way, congrats...!!
Quote:
I certainly hope this thread gives others the confidence to do this simple job themselves if the same thing happens to them. I want to thank all of you who responded to me with your kind words of advice. Also a big thanks to Ralph at the Toyota Parts Desk who gave me great confidence in the DIY job. He even double checked the labor requirements before I arrived to pick up the part. He assured me there was nothing difficult I would encounter. Essentially, just plug and play as was mentioned in one of the posts above. Almost like a joy stick on your computer.
just remember though, this time, you got lucky on this type of repair. sometimes however, you may have to pay either a dealer or repair shop for others.
Quote:
If I can help anyone else who sees this post please let me know. I'd be more than happy to do so.
Saved approximately $373. over the Dealer price for the job.
Finally, my last step is to report the Dealer who wanted to charge me $650 + tax for this job. I am going to start by filing a complaint with Toyota Headquarters about this dealership.
Can anyone tell me the name of the particular regulatory agency that oversees labor charging standards? I'm sure they would be interested to hear my story.
frankly, IF the labor rates are posted, and being a dealer they WOULD BE, the dealer DID NOTHING WRONG.......anyone can charge as MUCH AS THEY WANT...there ARE NO PRICING guidelines that have to be followed. if the repair industry were to be regulated that way, then all places would charge the same. you WILL NOT win anything you set out to do about this dealer. Toyota Corp WILL TELL YOU AS WELL, THEY CANNOT control dealer costs or charges, as EACH dealership is its own business. all Toyota CAN SAY to you is, "we cant't tell a dealer what to charge, how to charge, how to do the repairs, how to accept payments"......you will get no where's.......
but in the end, again, i am happy for you, the car is idling at the right rpm's, you are happy....just drive.....and be happy. you WON.......!!
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