'03 Blown Head Gasket / Overheating - Toyota Nation Forum : Toyota Car and Truck Forums

f4t4bb0t · 04-13-2011, 11:35 AM

Good morning ToyotaNation. I come seeking some advice! I've had my '03 camry SE since 2005 when i bought it with 54k miles on it and not had one issue with it until 3 weeks ago. I was driving home when i happened to look down and notice the car was overheating, bad. It was pegged all the way up past the H. I immediately pulled over, popped the hood and sure enough my coolant was completely emtpy...3 days after i had gotten the oil changed none the less.

So, i get new coolant, put it in and drive home. There is no leak, at least that i can tell, but the car still over heats. It will stay fine for the first 5-10 minutes then after that the temp gauge will bounce up past the H, come back down to normal range then back up, basically very intermintent. I just went and sat in the parking lot with and held it at 2-3k rpms for 20 minutes and it never rose above normal temp. But as soon as i put it into gear and drive around the parking lot it shoots up. As soon as i park it drops back down to normal and never raises back up. I was thinking maybe the thermostat was bad since it does not constantly stay over heated but after taking it to a shop they say the head gasket is blown.

The mechanic is reputable but from what i've always heard and been told if you have a blown head gasket you'll get milky colored oil and white smoke coming from the exhaust, which i don't have, and my coolant level has not decreased what so ever. So that combined with the temp gauge fluctuating between high and normal and has made me second guess the mechanic, ergo i'm asking for advice here. If it's overheating then the temp gauge should stay high until i turn the engine off and let it sit correct?

Hope all that makes sense!

Mike Murrell · 04-13-2011, 11:43 AM

What else took place during the "oil change"? Did you do it - or someone else.

f4t4bb0t · 04-13-2011, 11:50 AM

Just a normal oil change, no other maintenance was done.

Mike Murrell · 04-13-2011, 05:58 PM

The intermittent rising/lowering of engine temp. you report is something one can see with a head gasket issue.

In my opinion - there are varying degrees of head gaket damage. Yours may not be at the point where its blown enough to make the oil look like the color of caramel candy. That's the milk shake. Then there's coolant going out the tailpipe. Start the car in the morning and place a bowl underneath the exhaust pipe. You may get condensation out the tail pipe and that's normal after sitting overnight. Is any of it the color of your coolant? A blown head gasket is going to route coolant into either your oil or out the tail pipe. Also - when HGs blow - your car will run awful/have a poor idle.

I'm still suspicious about what went on during the oil change - 3 days B4 you had the issue - then again - that may be coincidence. Who knows what they might have done.

When you added coolant I assume you diluted with water - 1/2 coolant - 1/2 water. Pure coolant will make a car run hot. It does not dissipate heat well.

Revving the engine hard at 2K-3K for that stretch of time and no overheat followed by a gingerly stroll around the parking lot makes me wonder if your water pump is weak.

Test your thermostat. Many will say to feel the upper hose. That might be right - depending on the engine design you have. Warm up car 'til temp gauge is at its normal spot. Feel both upper and lower hoses - the larger ones. If one is hot and the other is cold - your t-stat is likely stuck closed.

Or.....you have air trapped in the cooling system.

I wrote up a way to purge trapped air that's seved me well for many years - simple - but effective:

How Do You Change Antifreeze Nowadays?

If you don't have trapped air and one hose is hot; the other not - you might give a new t-stat a shot.

Lots of possibilities here.

SumairM · 04-13-2011, 08:27 PM

i doubt its your headgasket, you will also have a awful smell after a bit, im pretty sure you would of smelled it by now, from the post above, it could be your thermostat or a weak waterpump...also make sure you bleat your cooling system, theres usually a bleating screw by the radiator or upper hose, air in the cooling system can trigger a leak, or you can have your mechanic run a pressure test on the cooling system and if the head is leaking the pressure will go down and u will see coolant leaking by the head...

***heartdisease*** · 04-13-2011, 08:57 PM

It sounds like your temp is normal until the thermostat opens to me. Maybe you have a bad temp sensor? Or you could have a blown head gasket. I had one on my 1997 GMC Sonoma. It was going bad for some time and never had many symptoms until it started leaking enough to dribble on the exhaust and start to smoke. It was very much like you described, sometimes run hot sometimes not. Nothing in the oil or out the back. It was leaking on the outside of the block. I changed it myself and got lucky the Heads were very straight, the machinist didn't have to mill them. All I did to get air out of radiators is to put them up on ramps or tall jackstands and let them run with the cap off for a bit, tweaking the throttle just a bit, never had any trouble.

corolapete · 04-13-2011, 10:07 PM

low mileage and already head gasket problem? thats scary? Your symptoms is one of head gasket problem. I had that happen to my other car which I got rid. I hope its not the head gasket but most likely it is.

f4t4bb0t · 04-13-2011, 11:31 PM

I had it pressure checked at another mechanic and he said it failed immediately, indicating a blown head gasket. Now i'm stuck with attempting to change this myself or just sell it to whoever is willing to buy it. After doing some research i've found that you typically run into the issue of finding stripped out head bolts after removing the valve cover (refering to the thread on camryforums.com that has over 9 pages of replies and 28k+ views). This actually makes sense b/c i've had a gradual oil leak over the past year. I'm defintely not paying the 600-1k they quoted me at for replacing the head gasket, espcially if they are going to run into other issues in the process.

The car is my beater, i just use it to get back and forth to work. It just hit 140k miles before this happend, but i was expecting to get a lot more out of her. Now i have to decide if i want to attempt to fix this myself or just sell it for what ever i can get. I consider myself some what mechanically inclined (worked on helicopters for the past 8 years doing electrical work) but i've never done anything major on a car. I guess i'm just afraid that if i attempt to do this myself and end up finding stripped out head bolts that i won't be able to fix it and end up having to scrap the car after that. Has anyone here actually done a head gasket r/r on these 02-04 camrys that are known for stripped head bolt issues and not ran into this issue?

***heartdisease*** · 04-14-2011, 07:12 AM

I have never done one on a little car. I would say if it is your beater with little value now why not go for it? Unless you have to spend a bunch on tools you have nothing but upside for your time.

corolapete · 04-14-2011, 08:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by f4t4bb0t

I had it pressure checked at another mechanic and he said it failed immediately, indicating a blown head gasket. Now i'm stuck with attempting to change this myself or just sell it to whoever is willing to buy it. After doing some research i've found that you typically run into the issue of finding stripped out head bolts after removing the valve cover (refering to the thread on camryforums.com that has over 9 pages of replies and 28k+ views). This actually makes sense b/c i've had a gradual oil leak over the past year. I'm defintely not paying the 600-1k they quoted me at for replacing the head gasket, espcially if they are going to run into other issues in the process.

The car is my beater, i just use it to get back and forth to work. It just hit 140k miles before this happend, but i was expecting to get a lot more out of her. Now i have to decide if i want to attempt to fix this myself or just sell it for what ever i can get. I consider myself some what mechanically inclined (worked on helicopters for the past 8 years doing electrical work) but i've never done anything major on a car. I guess i'm just afraid that if i attempt to do this myself and end up finding stripped out head bolts that i won't be able to fix it and end up having to scrap the car after that. Has anyone here actually done a head gasket r/r on these 02-04 camrys that are known for stripped head bolt issues and not ran into this issue?

Thank you very much for the update. I was in the same dilemma as yours 4 months ago with my beater. I ended up selling it because of my high mileage (190000). You are right when someone works on the head gasket you don't know what other problems you will have down the road. I might be wrong but that was my advice to me. Basically flipping a coin or rebuilding the motor that my cost more than the car is worth. My time is worth more than worrying about a beater. I end up buying a corolla for a beater.

profuse007 · 04-14-2011, 12:04 PM

It sounds like the headbolts are the culprit as more are being reported.

dave0919 · 04-14-2011, 01:28 PM

Might be trapped air in the cooling system. Is this a I4 or 6 cylinder? head bolts fail in the I4's (threads in the block) and can be fixed with 30mm long inserts. Job is not too bad and runs about $400 to $500. You have to replace the head bolts, water pump, idler pulley and gaskets. Inserts run $30 and you can rent the kit for $100. Also might want to check the ground wire connections on the rear of the head. When mine failed it had no water in the oil.

f4t4bb0t · 04-19-2011, 02:20 AM

I might try that trick for getting air out of the cooling system that Mike posted, seems simple enough =P Last time i checked the hoses both felt fine, neither are hot or anything. I did notice that the heat was NOT working so maybe there is air trapped in there...

And i know a thermostat is only $20-$30 but is there anyway to test it? I think i remember reading something about putting it in a pot of boiling water to see if it worked but i'd like a bit more detailed description heh.

I'm moving next weekend so i need to figure something out, might just put it on craigslist and see if i get any offers for it. No clue what i should put it up for though.

Mike Murrell · 04-19-2011, 11:37 AM

f4...

Not saying the tech who examined your car mis-diagnosed - but other than a bit of coolant - the air-bleed thing I suggested above is pretty much a freebie.

Ya never know.

Give it a shot