ICE on when stopped

[assailantsky]

Hi all,

I have a 2010 Australian version of the TCH, with 9000km on it. Sometimes when I'm stopped at the lights, the ICE will stay on for about 20-30 sec. I know its normal for the ICE to be on in the first 5 minutes of driving. However on rare occasions, this happens when I have driven the car for 30+ minutes, after an extended highway run at 100km/h+. My battery level is always in the blue zone and mostly about 60-80% at the time.

Is this normal? Or should I get this checked out? But I think it might be hard to replicate this problem as I use the car as the daily drive and it does not happen every time or at the same place. Also this may not be relevant, but I reckon this happens more often than not after an attempted gentle stop with pumping of the brake pedal.

Any advice will be much appreciated.

Cheers
R

[ukrkoz]

all i can say is that this is very sensitive to outside temperature. the colder it is, the more ICE will stay on.
also, it has mind of its own. unless your kmpl, or lp100 is real bad, i wouldn't be freaking over it.

some say, you can reduce ICE start ups having temperature set to above 72 degrees, fan in "floor" mode, then ECO button can be engaged. allegedly, it reduces ICE run time. I tried this, haven't seen any difference, but we have unusually cold spring, it's still freezing point in the morning..

[taketheturns]

This happens to my 2009 TCH also. It happens during the cold, hot, and warm days.

I noticed that I need to step on my brake pedal a little harder, passed the stopped point, when im not moving to get the ICE to turn off. Sometimes ICE stays on when im cruising lower than 40mph so Im curious to know if something is wrong.

Im hesitant to bring it to a dealer because this issue comes and goes and I dont know if theres actually something wrong.

Anybody else have this issue?

[WhiteSands]

Originally Posted by taketheturns

This happens to my 2009 TCH also. It happens during the cold, hot, and warm days.

I noticed that I need to step on my brake pedal a little harder, passed the stopped point, when I'm not moving to get the ICE to turn off. Sometimes ICE stays on when I'm cruising lower than 40mph so I'm curious to know if something is wrong.

Like ukrkoz says, make sure your ECO button is pressed. Look in your AC heater window and you should see the ECO letters in the center of the window. This helps shut the engine off when stopped during the summer and winters, if it's not really cold outside.

About the 40 mph engine shut off. Make sure your using your cruise control. Most people go somewhere then come back home. If you on what looks like a level route and the engine won't shut off at 40 mph, your probably climbing a slow grade. When going in the opposite direction in the same area, check to see if it will shut off when traveling at 40 again, with cruise.

I thought I lived in a very level desert area here in southern New Mexico. I'm finding they are some hidden slow hills that may be 2 to 3 miles long. I took a while to find them all. I picked up 5 or more mpg once I learned where these slight hills were. That's knowing when to drive 40 mph slightly downhill and 45 when going up a slight grade.

I found it's a good idea to pay attention to where small bridges are. That should be your low spot. I drive 40 driving toward a bridge I know that's miles ahead. I do speed up to 45 when leaving the bridge for a few miles till the road is more level.

The town of 38,000 has a main drag though town. I have traveled it many times at night. Last night we went around the bypass to the north part of town. We entered the main drag (very little traffic) which is a mile north of most businesses. Now headed south, I looked over the main downtown city lights and noticed the city looks to be in a valley about 200 or so feet below where we were in our car. By map shows the main drag is 5 miles long. Trees and lots of businesses can easily deceive one where the road looks level, but is not.

I drive 40 mph in the EV mode for 2 miles when headed south into town where the speed limit drops to 35 and the engine kicks back on. At that point it's mid-town where the boulevard becomes level again.

Anytime we come to town, I learned to take the east bypass when driving north where I can climb that last few miles at 45 mph. The engine seems more efficient at that speed even though the 4-lane by-pass speed limit is 55.

On trips when traveling 100 miles away I drive 60 on these 4-lane highways around where we live.

Check your tire pressure at night a few hours after parking your car. They should read 35 to 38 psi.

[taketheturns]

My problem is more when im cruising at or less than 40 and at a stop, not when im accelerating. Sometimes when im cruising with my foot off the gas, the needle points at 60 and not inside the EV mode. When im at a stop, ICE sometimes doesnt shut off either. Other time I have to push harder of the brakes but that only works when it wants.

[WhiteSands]

Originally Posted by taketheturns

My problem is more when im cruising at or less than 40 and at a stop, not when im accelerating. Sometimes when im cruising with my foot off the gas, the needle points at 60 and not inside the EV mode. When im at a stop, ICE sometimes doesn't shut off either. Other time I have to push harder of the brakes but that only works when it wants.

Coasting and engine running, could be the traction battery is still charging till it reaches 80%. I also find my engine goes into the EV mode easier at 39 or 40 mph.

I had problems getting mine to shut off the first few years I owned my '07 TCH. I read in the forms to press the ECO button and keep the cabin temp adjustment using the numbers. Once you put it on HI or Low it will remove the ECO setting.

I also found if I stop completely, (not allowing any roll) and wait sometimes up to 30 seconds when stopped the ICE will shut off.

You being in Southern Cal, and may be using a special formulated gasoline for your state. I have no idea if that would have some effect on these two problems you mention. Some advice might be to use a gas from toptiergas.com/ web site. Click the link, Retailers for the list of about 16 brands of gasolines that have extra ingredients over the governments minimum limits. If your using a brand not listed it may tank 3 tanks to get the full benefit from the better gas. I always use 87 octane in mine. Chevron and Phillips 66 are my best choices where I live. Shell is a good choice, but the station here in town is hard to get into due to the traffic.

[assailantsky]

Originally Posted by ukrkoz

all i can say is that this is very sensitive to outside temperature. the colder it is, the more ICE will stay on.
also, it has mind of its own. unless your kmpl, or lp100 is real bad, i wouldn't be freaking over it.

some say, you can reduce ICE start ups having temperature set to above 72 degrees, fan in "floor" mode, then ECO button can be engaged. allegedly, it reduces ICE run time. I tried this, haven't seen any difference, but we have unusually cold spring, it's still freezing point in the morning..

Thanks for the reassurance. I have an average of 5.8L/100km. Now come to think of it, it does happen more on my way home which is usually after sun down. I have my ECO mode on all the time, AC on 23-25c. Here in Australia right now the temp don't get much colder than 15c, morning or night, so having it on might have an effect for me. Maybe its still a bit too cold so the ICE comes on the rare occasions.

[assailantsky]

Originally Posted by taketheturns

My problem is more when im cruising at or less than 40 and at a stop, not when im accelerating. Sometimes when im cruising with my foot off the gas, the needle points at 60 and not inside the EV mode. When im at a stop, ICE sometimes doesnt shut off either. Other time I have to push harder of the brakes but that only works when it wants.

I found that sometimes my economy needle does funny things as well. It almost like its confused or something. Sometimes when I'm completely off the throttle, the info screen says i'm recharging battery, but the needle is no at 0 or in EV zone, its sitting somewhere between 0-5L/100km. The problem you described at a stop is exactly my problem.

I'm just wondering if our TCH have the same firmware (older ver?). Or is there only one version for everybody?

[ukrkoz]

assa, you need to read up about HSD. it does illogical stuff. there's big science to it, and i am not up to par to explain. read for urself.

keep in mind, engine does not shut of at speeds above 40 mph. engine turns on at speeds above 42mph. i just had this clarified, it has to happen to prevent MG2 from spinning to fast.

needle flattening out at 60 and staying there means nothing. you need to watch it on energy screen to actually know what's happening. engine may be on, or off. it all depends. basically, you might be rolling down the hill with engine shut off, but because u r rolling faster than 42mph, engine is engaged to keep MG2 from over-spinning and mpg gauge simply does not know how to show it. energy screen does. lack of tachometer on that car is screwy in terms it is hard to tell when engine is on or off.

assa, unless you have to, you do not have to have a/c on to keep it all in eco mode. eco will work with 72tepm/fan to floor. though i understand a/c is electrical, and allegedly does not reduce mpg, i really doubt it does NOT. hence, i have window visors installed and use them for natural air flow instead. gets me by all the way through till july.

also, can you translate liter per 100 into miles per gallon?

[Tideland Prius]

5.8L/100km is about 40mpg US.


It'll depend on the situation. I have had that come up in the Prius (moreso in the old Prius than the new one). If the engine is cold or drops below a temperature threshold, it'll keep running to keep itself warm (one reason why we block the grill on the Prius). Sometimes it'll run to bleed off excess charge (it only happens after you come to a stop after a long downhill and your battery is at 8 bars, so this one is rare for most people). These are the two situationst hat I can think of.

Also, note that there was a software change between the old and new Prius. Given that the TCH came out in 2007, it's possible that it's running off the old software.

I don't know the full details behind it but basically the new software allows the Prius to check that the temperature has reached the minimum threshold and shut off the engine while the car is in motion (we're assuming you're starting the car from a cold start). On the old Prius, even if the temperature has reached its minimium threshold, the engine will continue to run at low speeds until the car comes to a complete stop and the engine is able to shut down. Only then will the engine shut off while "coasting". If you never stopped at a light or a stop sign, it'll keep running.

Could this is a reason for what taketheturns is seeing?

[ukrkoz]

everything's possible. see what can be done with s/w use. also, i call this article from bs a little bit, as there is no direct connection between gas pedal and throttle neither in Prius nor in TCH. but i can tell that driving in barefoot running shoes does give better feel of the pedal.


Enthusiasts in Japan have hacked their Priuses, and use zen-like driving techniques to get up to 116 miles per gallon (they go 1000 miles on a 13 gallon tank of gas). In Japan they are called "nenpimania", Japanese for "mileage maniacs". Their techniques involve hacking the cars' computer systems, adding special tires, strategically placing tap, cardboard and foam rubber over the engine and grill. They also drive barefoot, and strive to perfect what they call the "pulse and glide" driving method, which requires sensitivity when pushing or releasing the accelerator. Some drivers use only their big toe to push the accelerator. :: Via The Raw Feed and Chicago Tribute. (Note: Photo shows American, not Japanese, Prius hack.)

[ukrkoz]

also, 1000 miles devided by 13 gallons = 79mpg. not 116.

[assailantsky]

Originally Posted by ukrkoz

assa, you need to read up about HSD. it does illogical stuff. there's big science to it, and i am not up to par to explain. read for urself.

keep in mind, engine does not shut of at speeds above 40 mph. engine turns on at speeds above 42mph. i just had this clarified, it has to happen to prevent MG2 from spinning to fast.

needle flattening out at 60 and staying there means nothing. you need to watch it on energy screen to actually know what's happening. engine may be on, or off. it all depends. basically, you might be rolling down the hill with engine shut off, but because u r rolling faster than 42mph, engine is engaged to keep MG2 from over-spinning and mpg gauge simply does not know how to show it. energy screen does. lack of tachometer on that car is screwy in terms it is hard to tell when engine is on or off.

assa, unless you have to, you do not have to have a/c on to keep it all in eco mode. eco will work with 72tepm/fan to floor. though i understand a/c is electrical, and allegedly does not reduce mpg, i really doubt it does NOT. hence, i have window visors installed and use them for natural air flow instead. gets me by all the way through till july.

also, can you translate liter per 100 into miles per gallon?

I'll give it a go with AC off, but 22c/72f seems a bit too cold for my liking, the system on my TCH is freezing cold as it is. I'll try to use my moonroof more and see if that helps.

Thanks for the reminder, on the info screen (big touchscreen), when my "problem" happens, all arrows are greyed out and that the ICE is not charging the battery or driving the wheels. Does that indicate that the ICE is on to warm the engine?

As Tideland pointed out 5.8L/100km is about 40mpg, I do about 1/3 city, 2/3 highway (80-110kmh or 50-70mph, usually in medium traffic)

[ukrkoz]

mate, sorry, i was not clear enough. ECO will not turn on if your temp is set BELOW 72 degrees. you can keep it at 98 if you want to. as far as it's 72 and above.

ur overall lp100km are within average norm. let it be. or, you can do what i sometimes do - put my fivefinger shoes on and drive with them. unforgettable experience. you can caress that gas pedal like a woman...

[assailantsky]

Originally Posted by ukrkoz

you can do what i sometimes do - put my fivefinger shoes on and drive with them. unforgettable experience. you can caress that gas pedal like a woman...

Haha, I'll give it a go and see if my missus likes that idea.