1998 Camry - Engine Ticking

[Strum]

First let me say hello. I am a long time Toyota owner, having owned several Corona's, Celica's, Camry's and Corolla's. Currently I have a 1992 and 1998 Camry and a 2005 Highlander.

Ok, that said, I am having a problem with my 1998 Camry (four-cylinder). About a month ago I noticed a ticking noise that is prevalent at certain RPM's and at the peak point before the automatic transmission shifts. At first I thought it was a sticky lifter, but today I determined the sound is not coming from that area.

Since I never really had any mechanical problems with my Toyota's, I am not sure what it could be. The sound seems to be coming from the water pump area. Does the 4 cyl have a timing chain or a timing belt? The sound seems like metal slapping on metal and that made me think of a timing chain.

Before I take it in for repair (assuming it is not something I can repair), I thought I would see if anyone here could offer some advise.

[toyomoho]

Could be the water pump. The water pump, idler, oil pump and camshaft pulleys are driven by a timing belt. Use a piece of rubber hose as a stethoscope and try to run down the specific area of noise.

How many total miles on the engine, and how many since the timing belt was replaced (assuming it ever was)?

[Strum]

I used a rubber hose this afternoon, but I am not sure of the source. It is coming from the water pump area, but I can't say I've pin pointed it.

As for miles, it has about 90,000. I purchased it with 72,000 and I would say it probably has never had the timing belt replaced. Would the timing belt cause it to make the ticking noise?

Here's an idea of when the sound is most prevalent.

Besides at idle (about 800 RPM) and as the automatic trans is about to shift, the sound gets more prevalent. Once I am at speed, the noise will occur if I run it at 1800 RPM, but stop at around 2300 RPM.

Temp gage fluctuate from barely registering after car was warmed up (while being driven), to about mid range when in park.

I'm not sure if that helps you any. I've never experienced anything like this, so I'm at a loss other than possibly the water pump or timing belt.

[felonyr301]

change the timing belt and water pump regardless its about time to do it anyways with that many miles.

[Strum]

Originally Posted by felonyr301

change the timing belt and water pump regardless its about time to do it anyways with that many miles.

I can't argue that, but I don't want to go through that only to find out it's not the problem. I have never had to replace either on any of my other Toyota's (purchased new or used) and a couple were driven over 200,000 miles and on average 150,000 miles. I guess it speaks for the quality of the car and maybe a little luck.

What is the approximate cost to have the belt and pump replaced?

[OEMonkey]

This may sound silly to you, but please check the oil level first. Valves make ticking sounds especially when oil level is low.

[toyomoho]

Low oil could cause a ticking of the drive train. Has the oil been changed on a regular basis? The noise would be under the valve covers.

Assuming the temp sender and gage are OK. Once warmed up, the gage normally reads mid range and stays there. Any coolant system problems?

Does this car have A/C; sometimes the magnetic clutch can make noises.

Might check Camry threads, both cars use the 1MZFE engine. Many Camry owners have posted on the subject of changing the belt, pump and associated costs.

[Strum]

Originally Posted by OEMonkey

This may sound silly to you, but please check the oil level first. Valves make ticking sounds especially when oil level is low.

At this point nothing sounds silly. The oil level is fine, and it was just changed about 1,000 miles ago.

[Strum]

Originally Posted by toyomoho

Low oil could cause a ticking of the drive train. Has the oil been changed on a regular basis? The noise would be under the valve covers.

Assuming the temp sender and gage are OK. Once warmed up, the gage normally reads mid range and stays there. Any coolant system problems?

Does this car have A/C; sometimes the magnetic clutch can make noises.

Might check Camry threads, both cars use the 1MZFE engine. Many Camry owners have posted on the subject of changing the belt, pump and associated costs.

1) Not low oil - I took a piece of cut hose and checked all around the engine and it appears to be coming from the water pump area, but not necessarily the pump itself.

2) I just went out to get gas and watched the temp gage. After driving for 10 minutes the gage was between 1/4 and 1/2. Driving back the gage was in about the same position when I noticed it dropped down to just a hair above the cold line and stayed there until I pulled onto my street and reduced speed. I've had the engine run too hot, but never have I had a car that dropped down in temp.

3) Yes, I have A/C, but there appears to be no change when on or off.

4) I thought I was in the Camry thread? I'm new here so I am still trying to determine the best section to post.

Well, I guess I will see a mechanic. The guy that use to work on my car just shut down (actually IRS shut him down). Great mechanic, lousy financial guy.

I stumbled on to this site and figured someone had to experience a similar problem. Being a long time Toyota owner I think this is a pretty interesting site.

Thanks to all - I appreciate your help and I'll check back to see if there are any other thoughts about the problem.

[Radial GT]

when my timing belt was at 104K it made ticking noises. I changed it, and good thing it was all cracked. And the ticking was actually the belt having slack and tapping the plastic case. Does the noise go away when you get the RPM up to about 2K or so? That is what mine would do.

[kamrhee]

I could vouch for the slapping sound that Radial GT is talking about. I had that happen when I changed my timing belt and the idler pulley loosened. I changed mine at around 130K. Changed both timing belt and water pump. Should have changed the thermostat too since its not that expensive and it was right in front of me. As for the water pump going, mine gave a chirping sound. I thought it was one of the pullies.

If its time to change the water pump and timing belt as maintenance schedule calls for then go ahead. If that sound is still there, start investigating. At least you have eliminated 2 item on that list.

Have you changed the coolant lately? Could be affecting the thermostat and giving you the weird temp. reading.

Let us know what comes out of this.

kamrhee

[Strum]

Originally Posted by Radial GT

when my timing belt was at 104K it made ticking noises. I changed it, and good thing it was all cracked. And the ticking was actually the belt having slack and tapping the plastic case. Does the noise go away when you get the RPM up to about 2K or so? That is what mine would do.

I think you and kamrhee might be on to something. I was poking around the engine trying to detect vibration from the ticking and I believe it is coming from the plastic housing. Still not 100% sure, but the sound and vibration appear to be from that area.

Yes, the sound drops off just over 2K rpm. It will start again just before the trans shifts and stop again as the RPM's go down after shifting.

Kamrhee, I changed the thermostat yesterday and the temp gage spiked at "H" within minutes. Opened up the housing to make sure it was seated properly and the thing still spiked. Opened up a third time and reinstalled the old one. Still have the running cold problem, but better than running hot. I am guilty of putting in a NAPA thermostat and it didn't look anything close to the one I pulled. The new one had smaller gage springs and the travel of the plunger (probably not the right terminology) was about 3/4" longer. I'll have to go out and get an OEM this week.

I think you're right about changing the pump and belt. The car has close to 90K miles, so certainly it's that time.

Do you have an idea what the cost would be to have the pump and belt replaced?

[kamrhee]

Strum,

I'm still consider myself a noobie at this but judging from experience, its better to get original parts than second guessing a replacement one. You could get one for alot less at out of state part stores or even toyota dealership that ships. The parts that I bought from a dealership in New Mexico was about a little over $200 with shipping. Timing belt, water pump, several seals, 2 drive belts (for alternator and power steering), spring for the idler pulley, valve cover gasket and a drive belt for a V6!. They actually gave me a part that I didn't need but ended up paying for it. If its for the 1mz, I'll just use it for the highlander. As for labor, I don't have an idea, maybe 40-50 bucks an hour?? Maybe the gurus here at TN could help you on that. If you're inclined to do it yourself like I did, just invest in some tools and you could probably do it. I will not lie and say it was a walk in the park but if you keep at it and also with alot of help from the people here, you can do it. If you're not sure, then let a mechanic handle it.

I forgot to mention that when I changed my timing belt and didn't tightened enough the idler pulley, it made that slapping sound. It occured at around 1400 to pass 2000 rpm. below and beyond those number there was no sound. I opened the upper timing belt cover and saw that the belt actually slaps the lower belt cover and stretches when the rpm goes up. Just try to hold the idler pulley remove as much slack and tightened the bolt to the correct torque spec.

When you said you changed the thermostat, are you refering to the one in the water pump? Cause if you are, then you can just change it yourself if you went that far. Is there another thermostat that you're changing? Also, the water pump doesn't take certain coolant and read alot of posting about water pump failure. Do a search on this a read to familiarize yourself with the situation. I hope I was able to give some pointer. Like I said, I consider myself a noobie in this and learning. The moderators and alot of the people here are helpful and will give you the inputs you need.

kamrhee

[Strum]

Well, it ended up being rod end bearings. The things were pretty torn up, but everything else is in good shape. The mechanic said that the engine is real clean inside, but the previous owner must have driven it at low oil levels.

I still need to change the timing belt. The engine running cold was due to a bad thermostat.

Well, the problem had me puzzled, but at least it's fixed.