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Hello freezing fellow northerners in the Toyota Nation. The past two weeks worth of icy temps have prompted me to revisit the issue of an oil change over to synthetic. I'm slightly overdue on my 96 Camry 2.2 5SFE by about 500 km which is currently using dino oil.
The motor runs good and has approx. 341, 000 km although it has the clatter of a 2.2 when it warms up, but that's another story about valve lash, no? I got the car from the original owner and he was religious with his oil changes, and I have documentation showing the last 100,000 km of work.
It has valve cover leaks and a leak at the distributor base, but that's about it. I check the oil regularly and haven't had to top off at all, although the engine does have a minor coating of oily stuff but an engine compartment clean will fix that.
But... here's the big but. I don't have a block heater plug-in at work right now so the car may sit for 7 hours without start up. I also just realized my block heater is not working, so that's a priority on the fix list.
I am thinking 0W30 Mobil or Amsoil on this car to help the engine. The reason? Where I'm at, it goes down to -25C to -35C or worse in the winter, and the car wasn't really exposed to this climate by the previous owner.
You should be ok running 0W-30. It's the second number that's more important since that will be the weight when the car is operating at normal temperature. The 0W-30 oil will probably flow better at startup in the lower temperatures.
Toyota does recommend 5W-30 even for temperatures below -29C. I doubt you'll have a problem with 0W-30.
If you can find Castrol Syntec 0W-30, that is supposed to be a very good oil, the only Castrol Syntec oil made in Germany. Sometimes it comes in green color (the oil is dyed), but don't worry about that. You can find a lot more information at BITOG.
You should be ok running 0W-30. It's the second number that's more important since that will be the weight when the car is operating at normal temperature. The 0W-30 oil will probably flow better at startup in the lower temperatures.
Toyota does recommend 5W-30 even for temperatures below -29C. I doubt you'll have a problem with 0W-30.
If you can find Castrol Syntec 0W-30, that is supposed to be a very good oil, the only Castrol Syntec oil made in Germany. Sometimes it comes in green color (the oil is dyed), but don't worry about that. You can find a lot more information at BITOG.
I'll look for that. Thanks for the suggestion. I hadn't thought about Castrol. I doubt it's available here in Lloyd, Ab though.
Buy the Mobil. They blend Toyota's oil for them. Why dont you just buy the full synthetic Toyota 0W20 from the dealer? Castrol is not a true synthetic, its hydro-cracked. And the W in 0W30 stands for winter, not weight.
Mobil 1 is a group III meaning it's as synthetic as Syntec.
Castrol Syntec 0W-30 is a true synthetic. It is completely different from all the other Syntecs.
The fact that Mobile produces Toyota branded oil is meaningless. They make the oil to Toyota's specifications. Mobil 1 is a different product entirely.
Where did you get that Mobil 1 is a group 3? Its made with PAO-Group IV and Synthetc Ester/Super Syn Group V among other things. It also isn't spelt with an "e". Castrol syntec will NOT out perform Mobil 1 but will perform just like Mobil semi 7500. Just as Connoco considers their Kendall GT-1 product a semi synthetic but it will perform identically to Mobil Clean conventional product. I have the test from a third party lab. By the way, Castrol buys ALL their base stocks from Mobil. Wheres the closest Castrol refinery? There isnt one because they are merely a marketing company. Hydrocracked is group 3. Castrols GTX is such a good product it was taken off the GM approval list GM6094M until ithey reformulated it. Thats quality oil company.
The fact that Mobil has approval by Toyota to make their product speaks volume.
If I didnt buy the Mobil 1 I would go with Pennzoils products.
There is a lot of speculation that Mobil 1 changed their basestocks to group III after they lost the court battle to Castrol back in the late 90's over the labeling of their "synthetic" oils.
There are a lot of user reviews and posts on Bob is the Oil Guy forums saying that Mobil 1 has made this change. I suggest you go do some reading over there in the archives to get a better understanding of this issue. However, BITOG is only one of the many forums who echo this saying, I've even read the same thing on Honda, Nissan, GM and Ford forums among others. Some have even made attempts to get hold of a reliable resource at Mobil, but they have always kept suspiciously mum when asked about their basestock formulation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by scooter996
Its made with PAO-Group IV and Synthetc Ester/Super Syn Group V among other things.
Super Syn is just a Mobil 1 marketing term. An oil can't be categorized into multiple groups.
How do you know that Mobil 1 basestocks contains PAO's and Esters?
Premium brands like Red Line oil and Motul are widely known users of Group V Ester basestocks. And Esso (available in Canada only) has their Extra XD-3 line of Group IV PAO based oils.
Hydrocracked oil is essentially a highly refined hydroprocessed group III mineral oil (dino) that can be passed off as "synthetic". Except in places in Germany and Japan, where stricter oil labeling laws exists, they cannot be referred to as such. Pennzoil Platinum is hydrocracked as well.
Like touringcamry said, the 0W30 grade German made Syntec is the only confirmed group IV based oil that Castrol makes, all the other grades are group III.
Quote:
Originally Posted by scooter996
Castrol syntec will NOT out perform Mobil 1 but will perform just like Mobil semi 7500.
How do you arrive at that conclusion?
Quote:
Originally Posted by scooter996
Wheres the closest Castrol refinery? There isnt one because they are merely a marketing company.
If anything, Mobil has the largest advertising campaign of ANY oil company out there.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by TURBO Das Automagazin
A BRZ, a curvy mountain road makes one liter of happiness hormones.
How do I know that "Mobil 1 basestocks contains PAO's and Esters?" I talk to our Chemist's.
How do you arrive at the conclusion that " Castrol syntec will NOT out perform Mobil 1 but will perform just like Mobil semi 7500."
I have seen the test data of our products vs. the competition.
Super Syn pertains to anti wear, NOT marketing.
I appreciate your suggestion of " doing some reading over there in the archives to get a better understanding of this issue." but Id hate to confuse their opinions with our facts. Everybody with a computer thinks their a lube engineer.
How do I know that "Mobil 1 basestocks contains PAO's and Esters?" I talk to our Chemist's.
How do you arrive at the conclusion that " Castrol syntec will NOT out perform Mobil 1 but will perform just like Mobil semi 7500."
I have seen the test data of our products vs. the competition.
Super Syn pertains to anti wear, NOT marketing.
I appreciate your suggestion of " doing some reading over there in the archives to get a better understanding of this issue." but Id hate to confuse their opinions with our facts. Everybody with a computer thinks their a lube engineer.
Im sure you know that Esso is Exxon Mobil.
It's nice to know that you work for/are associated with Exxon Mobil. Everything makes sense now.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by TURBO Das Automagazin
A BRZ, a curvy mountain road makes one liter of happiness hormones.
The other people may have some good advise especially the guy who works for the oil company. But i would simply shoot an email to toyota and ask them! They built the car and test the living sh$t out of the engines in all conditions, so maybe they know better than anybody on an internet forum whether you should use 0-30 oil or not. Maybe toyota had tested it and found a reason you shouldnt use 0-30 at any time in their engine, who knows what it could be - But to my mind, toyota is the one to ask about this.
I think if you stuck with the grade and weight the owners manual says, and use mobil 1, and not dino oil for your arctic weather, maybe that is the best you can do for using the right oil with regard to cold start. But again - thats my opinion and just what i would do.
Last edited by DressUpYourPet; 12-17-2007 at 04:36 PM.
The other people may have some good advise especially the guy who works for the oil company. But i would simply shoot an email to toyota and ask them! They built the car and test the living sh$t out of the engines in all conditions, so maybe they know better than anybody on an internet forum whether you should use 0-30 oil or not. Maybe toyota had tested it and found a reason you shouldnt use 0-30 at any time in their engine, who knows what it could be - But to my mind, toyota is the one to ask about this.
I think if you stuck with the grade and weight the owners manual says, and use mobil 1, and not dino oil for your arctic weather, maybe that is the best you can do for using the right oil with regard to cold start. But again - thats my opinion and just what i would do.
Agreed, and I thank you for your opinion. But I also understand that Toyota, like any manufacturer, designs and engineers the vehicle with a series of well executed compromises. This car is sold all the way from the tropics to the near-Arctic.
The 2.2 might run wonderfully in minus 35 when it is brand knew with 5-30 dino oil. Doesn't any car? What happens when it is subjected to the same conditions at over 340,000 km?
The engine and it's recommeded oil are designed with a broad ownership group in mind. I'm not the same guy as Joe Kokomo in Bimini, where the car is more likely to have issues of sea air and corrosion in 20C conditions, than extreme cold.
In 96, when my car came off the factory floor, things like Mobil 1 or any synthetic for that matter, were not quite the same technology as they are now. So Toyota can't tell a used car owner anything new about a used product; it's not in the business of used cars, other than the "certified used car programs". If you start having problems, Toyota reps will just tell you to go to the nearest dealership and replace this, replace that. Any manufacturer will do that.
What the used car ownership group is trying to do is increase, improve and otherwise help our cars last longer, before we put heavy money into them. So hence the dilemma with things like oil, headlights and tires etc.
But I respect what you are saying, the owner's manual generally is the bible to follow.
Everything makes sense now. Everything might not make sense but there are numerous misconceptions about motor oil in the market place. Its just consumers have never been aware of the truth of alot of them. I get to see alot of data that other dont.
I work with both the Toyota reps in the northern Ohio market. In the very near future Toyota and Honda will be running 0W20 and 5W20 ONLY in ALL their vehilces to improve apon their CAFE numbers. It wont matter what climate your running your vehilce in. Currently we are switching over numerous accounts to these bulk viscosities. 10W30 will be the new 10W40, merely a viscosity from the past.
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