A/C system questions

[Racke]

Hy guys,
I'd like to know where do I have to put the refrigerant in my A/C system for a recharge.I own a 1992 Camry LE, I think I had R12 on my system and now I read that I can make a recharge with Freeze 12 without any modifications.What do you think?
Thanks in advance for your answers !

[Nico]

If you haven't done a retrofit yet your car is still running on R12. You have two options :
- you go on charging with R12 ( but this is becoming expensive and more and more difficult to find). btw you will not be allowed to buy it yourself (as you need a special licence fo this) so you will have to go to a garage for that.
- or (and this is perhaps the best option) you make the retrofit for R134 and buy what is called a "retrofit kit". Buy it on ebay or at any auto parts store. The kit will include new o-rings, oil (ester or PAG) (your current mineral oil can't be used with R134, my advice would be to go for ester oil for a retrofit : it mixes better with any possible residues of mineral oil), new receiver dryer, and you will also receive two adapters for high and low pressure.
The procedure is as following : drain oil from compressor and refill with exactly the same quantity of new oil (around 4 oz I think) in the succion port, change o-rings, replace receiver dryer and fill in with new oil (+/- 3 oz), install new adapters. Once you have closed the system, make a vaccuum for a bout 30 - 45 minutes and make a charge of the equivalent of a bit more than 2 cans. You're done !

BE careful ! DO NOT recharge your current system with r134 as it is, r12 and r134 DO NOT MIX, if you want to see your compressor go through your bonnet, there's no better way (This has occured !)
If you have any questions just ask !

[Racke]

Nico thanks a lot!
I'm a beginner in A/C systems (this is my first one) so I'll bother you with some other questions )
Where is the succion point of the compressor?
Where are the O-rings placed?
The position of the adapters for high and low pressure?
What do I have to do for vaccuming my system?
and finally...
where do I have to put the refrigerant in the system(charge)
I mention that I have a Haynes(sadly, no specific informations for servicing your A/C system ...)

[Nico]

No problem Racke, it is a pleasure.

1) Succion port : there are two ports on the compressor (refrigerant going in and out), the succion port is the one that sucks your finger when you turn the compressor clockwise (it is the biggest whole) NB : DO NOT PUT TOO MUCH OIL !!!!
2) The o-rings are between all connections of your a/c pipes (little red o'rings): you'll need some time to remove them all but it is not complicated. Just follow all the way of your pipes and unscrew them everywhere.
3)when you are in front of your engine bay, the high pressure adapter goes on the high pressure port (red cap), it is located near the battery (just above receiver dryer) (the receiver dryer looks like a metallic bottle). The low pressure adapter goes on the low pressure port (blue cap), look at the left between timing belt cover and map sensor
4) Vaccuum : you need to buy an a/c vaccuum tool that you can buy for +/- 25 usd OR you can have the vaccuum done by a professional and then do the charging yourself.
5) charging : you do it to the low and high pressure ports with an a/c gauge (only charge via low pressure port : THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT !!!)

I know Haynes do not say anything about a/c (I have the same and searched a lot in it when I was in your situation) but if you need any help let me know I know everything you need to know about your system since I installed it myself in my 1992 Camry with junked parts.

btw I am not trying to make any sorts of ads but there was a guy in America who helped me A LOT with my a/c problems/questions and provided me with everything I needed (from r134 to gauges,...) for really good prices. If you think it can help you just pm me and I will let you know.

In fact you now have the choice between doing it yourself or go to a garage. Doing it yourself should cost you +/- 150- 175 usd including all the necessary tools/o-rings, r134,... and you will have learned something. Plus since you will have the right tools, all future chargings will cost you just a few dollars. It should cost you roughly 200 or 250 usd to do it at a garage (cheap garage and not at a dealer) but you will not have learned anything. You could also go on with r12 but like I said this is no good long term option. Up to you to see. If you have any more questions I'd be happy to help.

Nico

Originally posted by Racke
Nico thanks a lot!
I'm a beginner in A/C systems (this is my first one) so I'll bother you with some other questions )
Where is the succion point of the compressor?
Where are the O-rings placed?
The position of the adapters for high and low pressure?
What do I have to do for vaccuming my system?
and finally...
where do I have to put the refrigerant in the system(charge)
I mention that I have a Haynes(sadly, no specific informations for servicing your A/C system ...)

[Nico]

Oh yes by the way and before I forget ! many professionals will tell you that a retrofit should also include new hoses, new compressor,... there obviously seem to be many "variants" of what a retrofit can be. THIS IS SIMPLY NOT TRUE ! Just change o-rings, oil and receiver dryer and this is it. r134 is indeed a thiner molecule and that's why all o-rings need to be changed by the appropriate ones. In fact the mineral oil you used previously will have created a kind of "protection barrier" for your hoses and given them even more protection. The only important thing is that you must remove as much as possible your mineral oil out of your system, at least 98% in fact.

[Racke]

Nico,
Thanks again for your complete details.I have all the details and from next week I will start with my "diggings" )
I owe you big one,
Racke

[Racke]

Nico,
Thanks again for your complete details.I have all the details and from next week I will start with my "diggings" )
I owe you big one,
Racke

[Silver Streak]

Hey, I did this retrofit last year...I forgot all the details but here's some info I found on my computer...I have no references for it though.

"You can just get the system recharged if there are no leaks. However be
aware the the older type of refridgerant is getting rather expensive and
will only continue to climb since it's not made anymore. If you switch over,
you will need to replace a lot of parts due to incompatibilities. This is
expensive too. The new stuff also doesn't cool as well as the old. New
vehicles are manufactured to take this into consideration.

There are retro kits for recharging using the new R134 refrigerent
available at auto-part stores. The one I used was made by Interdynamic
I believe & included the newer type connectors for recharging plus
some pretty simple instructions for making the conversion. Seemed
to work ok on my 92 Tercel but stil pretty early in the season. Kit
only costs about $30 american so worth a shot. Good luck
dc

If your A/C system still needs R12, try looking at this page:

http://www.autofrost.com/autofrost-X3.pdf


The new R134 cools as good as the old R12 I have a 1978 Ford fairmont and all I did was get the 134 fittings and installed 134 cools just as good as the old R12."

[Racke]

Thank you Silver Streak,
Do you know something about a product called Freeze 12?
Also I heard that exist on the market another product called Duracool 12a... There are some guys who told that these products don't require A/C system modifications(ex. O-rings change, new adapters etc.)

[Nico]

In fact this refrigerant type is a substitute to R-12. Most of the people who tried it would strongly not recommend it, mainly because it doesn't transport oil as well as other refrigerants do (causing frequent compressor breakage).In fact, just like r134 mineral oil doesn't mix with this refrigerant. And also because some people say that being a bit new it might not get a big place on the market and leave you in 1 or 2 years in exactly the same situation as the one you are now.
Here is an interesting link :
http://groups.google.fr/groups?q=Fre...ink.net&rnum=2

[Racke]

I appreciate ...like always.I'm happy for having the chance to talk to you.
Thanks

[Nico]

No worries Racke ! that's what we're here for

[Silver Streak]

Lucky you I found my receipt, here are the prices of everything in Canadian $. The UV dye is needed to detect any further leaks in the system... as you can see the labour for the conversion is only like an hours work. The repair of the valve (which I found later to be a TSB!!!) was the major work.

Labour
Repair of Expansion valve $100
Conversion to R134a $50

Parts
A/C Dryer 134a $102
A/C Dye $20
A/C oil $20
A/C 134a kit $50
A/C Gas $45
3 seals $9

Total of $396

[Silver Streak]

BTW, it's been 2 years since I did the retrofit and it's nice and cold still.

[amerikim]

I just bought my 93 Cam, how do I tell whats in there?