I need 2vzfe and 3vzfe info

[Hotwheelharmer]

Hey all I have an idea for an ultimate sleeper but I need information on both the 2vzfe and the 3vzfe. I need to know bore size, stroke, deckheighth, valve size, difference in intake and exhaust ports, difference in the crankshafts and rods, oil pan, basically I want to keep the 2vzfe block and keep the engine looking as stock as possible but build a stroker.

[terrastrife]

FWOAH stroker good luck finding someone to make ya a crank/rods/etc :P

[Hotwheelharmer]

Originally Posted by terrastrife

FWOAH stroker good luck finding someone to make ya a crank/rods/etc :P

Ummm that is what I am trying to find out. If the 3vz has a longer stroke which I am pretty sure it does and then if I can drop the crank into the 2vz then that would be making it a stroker. Making a stroker doesn't always mean you have to buy an aftermarket kit from it.

[terrastrife]

search.

[Toysrme]

There was a website at one point that went through various Camry engine's through around 1994. i4's and v6's. It had useful information to you by showing the internals of the 2vz-fe, 3vz-e, 3vz-fe, but mainly discussed the difference between the VZ blocks.

If anyone can find the site I'm talking about, post it.

Annnyways. It's not going to work.. They are the only forged cranks you'll find in a toyota v6, and they pretty much dwarf every other crank, including the larger 3.4L 5vz-fe crank. I only know one person with a 5vz-fe that dropped in a 3vz-fe crankshaft. The block required a lot of machining to get it to drop in and lined up and it was STILL swapped out to a custom crankshaft replicating the original 5vz-fe crankshaft when the owner wanted over 600hp.
You can't even drop a 3vz-fe crankshaft into a 3vz-e without machine work... The rod's don't etc.

The rods are stronger than the rest of the VZ family (so they're probably stronger than the MZ family's), but there is nothing special about them.

The pistons are crappy; they shouldn't be used for anything.

For future reference terrastrife is right. You need to search.
bore size, stroke, valve size, crankshafts, rods can all be found online.


There is absolutely no point in doing this project. First of all, think about the resources and expertise you don't have (that you WILL have to pay for) to finish the project VS what you will have at the end of the project??? A 185-200hp 2vz-fe... Whoop Dee Doo. That can be done without touching anything in the bottom of the engine.
What *could* you do with that much money??? Custom turbo and make however much power you want. An engine swap to something more powerful.
Moral of the story is that for anyone looking for more than intermediate gains from custom engine work (that n2o can't provide) having a turbo is the only choice to keep the same engine.



Any questions?

[Hotwheelharmer]

Originally Posted by Toysrme

There was a website at one point that went through various Camry engine's through around 1994. i4's and v6's. It had useful information to you by showing the internals of the 2vz-fe, 3vz-e, 3vz-fe, but mainly discussed the difference between the VZ blocks.

If anyone can find the site I'm talking about, post it.

Annnyways. It's not going to work.. They are the only forged cranks you'll find in a toyota v6, and they pretty much dwarf every other crank, including the larger 3.4L 5vz-fe crank. I only know one person with a 5vz-fe that dropped in a 3vz-fe crankshaft. The block required a lot of machining to get it to drop in and lined up and it was STILL swapped out to a custom crankshaft replicating the original 5vz-fe crankshaft when the owner wanted over 600hp.
You can't even drop a 3vz-fe crankshaft into a 3vz-e without machine work... The rod's don't etc.

The rods are stronger than the rest of the VZ family (so they're probably stronger than the MZ family's), but there is nothing special about them.

The pistons are crappy; they shouldn't be used for anything.

For future reference terrastrife is right. You need to search.
bore size, stroke, valve size, crankshafts, rods can all be found online.


There is absolutely no point in doing this project. First of all, think about the resources and expertise you don't have (that you WILL have to pay for) to finish the project VS what you will have at the end of the project??? A 185-200hp 2vz-fe... Whoop Dee Doo. That can be done without touching anything in the bottom of the engine.
What *could* you do with that much money??? Custom turbo and make however much power you want. An engine swap to something more powerful.
Moral of the story is that for anyone looking for more than intermediate gains from custom engine work (that n2o can't provide) having a turbo is the only choice to keep the same engine.



Any questions?

Ok first off thanks for the info. That is the kind of info I am looking for. Second of all who says I am not searching just because I posted on a forum doesn't mean I am not looking. I just posted so I can try to get as much info as I can find. Thirdly the resources and expertise how the hell do you know I don't have enough. I know what I am doing I used to be a technician at Toyota and went through the best automotive program in the country so I think I can handle a project that I am trying to do. As for doing a project like this I am going to build a 2vzfe no matter what I can and can't do. If I can't do a stroker then I will find something else to do but it is staying naturally aspirated and I garuntee you I will get the power I want. I am building this to get some creditbility for when I start my own business. I want to own a shop that fabricates parts for cars with very little aftermarket support and build cars that are sleepers and hence the wanting to build something that is an ultimate sleeper.

[Toysrme]

Because I have only come across TWO actual talented machinist dealing with Toyota / Lexus in the last two years on the internet, and in real life.
Secondly, for the cost of custom stroking any of the VZ blocks, you can do a large number of things to make a much larger amount of power.
So the odds are stacked against you just a little bit.

I'm not trying to belittle you, it's just a waste of time and money compared to the other available options IMHO.

Just some words of caution... Others, that shall remain unanimous in these same Toyota circles you're going around now have completed, or at least started cool projects. Unfortunately they're always on cars that no one wants their mods for. They try and market (at times) great things, in the wrong marketplace, and then fold.



Your project so go for it, I just fail to see the point of building an N/A 2vz-fe for the sake of doing it when it will have a fairly hard time eclipsing any of the later engines stock power levels. Good luck with it tho!








Here's a huge tip... You like sleepers so much, eh? Go buy a gen 1-2 LS 400, or GS 400. Right now there ar at least 100 owners on ClubLexus right now that are willing to pay out the ass for who ever is able to make some headers. It has been said many times now that 1uz-fe v8's have the ability to lay down 700whp+... Bone stock... (So there's the headroom for your own project... Being able to beat the shit out of most things in any form of racing they'll let you participate in, while still claiming stock engine components??? Priceless)

There is an awsome project for ya. Make some money selling them all headers (including GS owners) Then you can fund whatever other obscure projects you want!

Think about it for a second. Who have you found that is willing to spend a few thousand $$$ on a car not worth 1000 in any condition? It stands to reason if the people can afford the Lexus, they can afford to play ball. That's why there are so many custom S/C & turbo LS 400
s, GS 400's, SC 400's, SC 300's, GS 300's, IS 300's. They all can afford to play ball!


IMHO that would be the single quickest (but not easy), most lucrative field anyone could bust into in any area of Toyota passanger cars. IMHO after that would be i4 turbo's for the S block family that rule out user error. (how many v6's are there in the camry family? around 15%... The i4 user base is broad enough for a large market)

[JetspeedCamry]

I'd say go for it!
I have a 2VZFE which is now undergoing some mods before I swap to a 5speed manual.
The potential for this motor is awesome..but realistly..as Toysrme said..doing a stoker is not going to lay down figures that surpass later model stock figures.
If your after some good figures..other things really have to be done aswell, and a turbo is a possiblity. Turbo one of these which some headwork, pistons etc..and you'll get good figures. Even an NA setup could be awesome but not just with a stroker..many other avenues have to be covered in order to get it up there.

I plan on working on my 2VZ..and theres no way i would swap for a 4. I just love the 6 so much.
The mods that I have atm are nothing special..but they certainly make a difference..and thats all that counts.

[toyrolla]

Welcome back Harmer.

Matti's site has some of the initial information you are looking for.

It gives the bore, stroke, & compression info.

http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/P...html#VZ-series

I have my factory manual with me, so I'll dig for some more info.
Drop me a PM and we'll talk.

By the way Toysrme, consider yourself introduced to the THIRD talented Toyota machinist you will ever know.

HotWheelHarmer is one of the old school Gen2 Camry gurus from way back...

[Hotwheelharmer]

Originally Posted by toyrolla

Welcome back Harmer.

Matti's site has some of the initial information you are looking for.

It gives the bore, stroke, & compression info.

http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/P...html#VZ-series

I have my factory manual with me, so I'll dig for some more info.
Drop me a PM and we'll talk.

By the way Toysrme, consider yourself introduced to the THIRD talented Toyota machinist you will ever know.

HotWheelHarmer is one of the old school Gen2 Camry gurus from way back...

Thanks for the info man that is what I wanted. Thanks for backing me up too it is good to see that someone isn't preaching the price thing over and over again because that just gets old. As for Toysrme the whole point of building an NA 2vzfe is because I want the engine bay to look as stock as possible and I want to build a 2nd gen camry because my daily driver(until I find an 85-92 toyota truck) and it just looks like a big pos because a big tree fell on the hood and fenders and there is a lot of rust on it. I want something that will just drop jaws farther down then most anything else and I want to build something that someone could consider an "ultimate sleeper" and to me a sleeper is something that is stock looking and something that no one considers fast or has the potential to be fast. As for the stroker and such I didn't say I was 100% going to do a stroker. I said I Wanted information about the two to see if I could do a stroker. If I can't do a stroker then I will do some other building and looking into information. Right now I am just in the information stage and I know how to get information but you can never have enough information thus the reason why I Asked on here because I want to try to get all the information I can so I can analize things a lot better. And please stop this it is going to cost a ton of money. I am not some newbie here that wants to do all this stupid stuff and am just asking to look like I know what I am doing. I do know what I am doing I took a 19 second 2nd gen camry and made it a 16 second car keeping it on stock compression and naturally aspirated and it was an automatic so I think I can handle what I want to do.

[Toysrme]

^ yes you had 2 gen2 camry's, a celica, you built them both and your dad owned (or worked at) a toyota dealership.
All of that is known.


Like I said man, it's your $$$ do whatever you want. It's not lik it's going to take a lot of power to push a gen2 into 14s 1/4 miles. Intake/exhaust, ECU tuning, headwork and high compression pistons could do that. Probably without hi-po cams killing the day to day driveability.

[Toysrme]

This isn't the original site... The one that I found this on was quiet a bit longer, but this will illustrate slightly what you need to know.Here



2VZ-FE crankshaft VS 3VZ-FE crankshaft


Wish I had one of them length wise side by size. It dwarfs it. Lot more metal in that thing!



You wanted to know what 3vz-fe's looked like?

















2vz-fe intake side




3vz-fe intake port

[Hotwheelharmer]

Originally Posted by Toysrme

^ yes you had 2 gen2 camry's, a celica, you built them both and your dad owned (or worked at) a toyota dealership.
All of that is known.


Like I said man, it's your $$$ do whatever you want. It's not lik it's going to take a lot of power to push a gen2 into 14s 1/4 miles. Intake/exhaust, ECU tuning, headwork and high compression pistons could do that. Probably without hi-po cams killing the day to day driveability.

Actually I still have a 2nd gen camry(not the same one though) and I still have the celica. I am working on finishing up a 20R/22R hybrid and sidedrafts for it. As for getting it into the 14's I want to make it quicker then that. I would like low 13's or high 12's out of it which may be a little unreasonable to do if I Want it to look as stock as possible but it is something I am going to try anyways. The whole point of me wanting to build this car is because I want to own a shop that fabricates performance parts for cars that have little to no aftermarket support and also build sleepers for people so I just want to get some credibility out there for it. So building an actual car with a reputation(once the reputation gets out the sleeper kind of looses its point but it will still help with what kind of car it is). Thank you for the information you gave me. That website helps out a lot. It looks like I might be able to use some aftermarket rods made for a 3sgte because if the rods are close to the 3sfe then I can use them I need to get a 2vz rod though and do some measuring. I already have some 3sfe rods so we will see. Since the head uses the same valve train as a 3sfe and a 4age then I can do somethings to get me some more revs like TRD valve springs and some shimless buckets, The cams are going to kill me but F head cams always kill in building a motor. I have a feeling the valves will be a lot like the 3sfe valves as well which means I can put some bigger valves from a 3sgte. All of that stuff is just speculation from what I know and what I have read about the information. I think though with the information I have now I can make it produce at least low 14's to high 13's but we all know you can get quicker in the 1/4 by doing more then just motor work and I am already looking into other things for that but that stuff I Want to keep a secret until I figure it out and get it done.