lug nuts disappointment (reimbursement advice appreciated)

[earthmike]

Late September I got new tires put on my 2000 CE. I threw in a balance and alignment, since the car was less than one month old (to me).

Next day, I took it back because the steering wheel was crooked. They re-did the alignment.

Day after that I noticed vibration in the drive. Took it back again. The guy doing the balancing asked who did it before. The manager said, "uh, we did." Yeah. Drove fine after that.

I guess a guarantee isn't worth much if it means making 3 times the number of trips.


Yesterday I was having myself a look-see at the brakes, just to determine about when I'd need to replace them. All the lugnuts were difficult to remove -- I needed both hands and couldn't just spin the lug wrench.

When I was replacing the nuts, I had a lot of trouble with the nuts, but especially on the left rear wheel. One went on ok, one only worked backwards (taper facing away from wheel), two lugs stripped, and the last lug snapped in half.

I said to myself, "well these guys can't even do the simple stuff right, how will they be able to replace these studs?" and towed it to the dealership where I bought it.


I contacted the BBB but they said that since I took the car somewhere else they can't help me.

I called up the manager while waiting for the repair. He offered to "have a tech look at it this time" which leads me to wonder who looked at it last time? Your punk kid brother?

He also said they didn't do reimbursements, so I'm thinking small claims court if it comes to that.

Again, he can offer to fix it, but how do I trust that it's being done correctly? They couldn't even do a proper alignment and balance the first time.

I know I don't want to be argumentative or mean to them or (most importantly) lose my cool or let myself get pissed off, but it's very difficult because I'm young and impetuous.

I spoke with a govt official in the office of consumer affairs (or somesuch) who said to write a polite letter explaining why I was disappointed and to make sure that I was pursuing every legal means of negotiation AND get it in writing (certified mail, etc.) so that if it does come to a judge I'd be more on his side.

The techs at Toyota said to get in touch with the highest possible manager I could, to let him know about the disappointment and how I didn't trust the shop, to see if I could possibly get reimbursed for the repair.


I had all the nuts replaced ($3.77 ea) and the 5 studs on the rear LHS wheel ($5.88 ea). In addition, they note that the steel rim was mushroomed out where the nuts were obviously over-tightened (not catastrophic bending). They estimate in excess of 110ft-lb, almost 50% above the prescribed 77.

I would have loved to go to a junkyard to get the nuts but I just didn't have the time.

The shop is a chain of places who supposedly specialize in tire sales and service. One would think they knew what they were doing, no? These repairs cost more than it did for the new tires!

Anybody have any further advice on how to get satisfaction?
Thanks for listening,
--Mike

[Nick]

they probably didn't use the torque bar when putting your tires back on, bad workmanship, don't go there, and tell all your friends not to go there

word of mouth is a powerful tool

[woshiagni]

I couldn't really tell from what you wrote, was this done at a Toyota dealership or an independent shop? Try to go as high up in the chain of command as you can (corporate if it's Toyota). If you paid by credit card you can also attempt to dispute it... otherwise, if you have the time and you want "satisfaction", save your old parts and evidence and take it to small claims court.

I had this problem when I got my rims... I won't mention the shop's name.... but I ended up having to replace a stripped wheel stud because they wouldn't admit responsibility. I know, nowhere near as bad as your case. Sorry to hear about your situation. =(

I actually thought the tapered end of the lug nut was supposed to face outward? (I'm not sure, my 99 uses closed end lugs) This is more common than you think ... lazy shops will overtighten the lug nuts because they use impact wrenches and are too lazy to set the correct lb/ft of torque.

[earthmike]

It was an independent shop that messed up my car. I initially had the place's name in there but it would no doubt hurt my case if I was bad-mouthing them.

I had the problem corrected today at the Toyota dealership. Sorry to be ambiguous.

I'm still unhappy but I don't know if I have the energy to pursue this to the full extent. Just think how futile it would seem if I had a 9-5 job! Of course, the cost would seem a lot less if I had a regular job...

Just saw "Road House" on tv the other night. Gotta remember to "be nice."

Re: polarity of nuts: they were point-in when I found them, I haven't checked yet but it sounded like the Toyota repairman said that's proper. I also would have thought the opposite.

Re: credit card: Alas, I paid with debit card, already carrying too much balance. Sigh, more balance now...


I may edit this out later if I go to court, but the key here is the lack of trust in taking it back to the indie shop. If I need service, an indie is fine, if I need parts I know the dealer will use Toyota parts. (I know, I need to talk to more folks about better indie shops).
The fact that they offered to fix the problem (albeit after I was already on the lift at the dealer) throws a big wrench in my case. And there's no torque bar on this one either :-)


--Mike

[woshiagni]

Hmmn... =(

All I can really say is good luck.
Try disputing the charges with your bank? I haven't tried doing that with a debit card, and I know it pretty much leaves you naked, but it's worth a shot.

[earthmike]

I spoke with some friends and other folks who have been around longer than I have, and the general consensus is that since I took the car to another place to get the problem fixed, I'm probably not going to see a dime from that place.

Stay away from the Tires Plus in Buckhead. At all costs. A set of new $59 tires cost me $800.

[SKYravefever]

Blah! I -hate- Tires Plus. They are the most BULLLLLLSH*T chain.

[jamesgf]

Stay away from Tires Plus!

Here in Madison WI about a year ago the local TP got busted for breaking stuff on peoples cars and then claiming they found it and it needed to be fixed. A local TV station was doing the under cover thing, taking a perfectly fine car (checked and verified by the dealer) to various repair shops and seeing if they would find anything wrong. Tires Plus broke something in the susension (i think it was something to do with the sway bar) and told them it needed to be fixed. When confronted the manager denied it.

My sis in law took her car there (prior to them getting busted) for an oil change. She was all of 17, so they thought they could take advantage of her. They told her she needed a new water pump in her Paseo (had just been replaced with the timing belt a month earlier) and that her tires were so worn that they could not let her drive home (they were worn, but with in legal limits). She had to call home (they wouldnt give her keys back) and her mom gave them hell and they let her go.

Sounds like a great place to do business eh?

my 0.02
-j