Engine help needed - Toyota Nation Forum : Toyota Car and Truck Forums

pejka1 · 02-26-2005, 06:38 PM

I'll try to keep this short.

I'm trying to help a friend out. He bought a 1994 Toyota Pickup, drove it for a couple of weeks....engine went out on it. His neighbor at the time said he could put a new engine in it. He got a reman Jasper engine and put it in. Couldn't get it running right. Ran rough for 20 min. Neighbor noticed a coolant leak. Shut it off to fix that. Never fired again after that. My friend has since moved about 10 states away and the truck is still here. His old neighbor hasn't been trying to fix it anymore so I thought I'd try to help. It's now in my pole barn.

The only info I have as to what happened is as follows. The neighbor seems to think that the engine ordered was not exactly the correct one. On the valve cover it says 22R-E. On the engine is stamped 22R. Does the fuel injection make any difference as to the engine type 22R to 22R-E? The neighbor said something to the effect that he felt the firing order might be different and that could have been why it was running so rough. He also said because of this the cylinder walls could be scored? Possible?

I'm still investigating here and know very little about these engines so any help would be greatly appreciated. Where would you start?
Thanks in advance.
Jim

rcannon440 · 02-26-2005, 06:55 PM

Jim, The 22R engine should be fine as long as it's between 1985-1995, the RE means its Fuel injected. The only difference is the cam shaft but this should not pose a problem. I would check fireing order and check for vacum leaks and make sure all lines were connected properly. Did the check engine light ever come on? Also make sure it is full of coolant because it will run rough if it's low. If the distributor was taken out make sure it was put back in correctly, it may be off by a few degrees.

pejka1 · 02-27-2005, 12:26 AM

I'll check on the coolant tomorrow and see if I can set the timing fairly close so it might fire again. I'm not sure about the check engine light. I just got the truck to my place, have never seen it before...and with all those vaccuum lines on top of the engine, it'll probably be days before I figure out it one or more is incorrect.

Jim

crazycruzer · 02-27-2005, 02:06 AM

Toyota, and most vehicles these days, use aluminum heads. If you lose coolant and your engine overheats, then you could have warped the heads. There are only 3 reasons why a car will not start: fuel, fire (ignition), and compression (unless it's an automatic and you don't have it in park or neutral). Disconnect the fuel line and crank the engine to see if fuel is being delivered. If so, then check for fire. Removed a spark plug from the engine, plug it back into the wire, hold the metal part of the spark plug against bare metal surface (ground) and crank the engine to see if the plug is delivering spark (may need a second person to either start the engine or observe the plug for spark). If you are getting both, fuel and fire, then you will need to check the compression. You can buy a compression tester (gauge) at any automotive parts supplier. Another way to check to see if the heads are warped is by examaning the engine oil for coolant. Check the engine oil cap for a white residue or drain the oil. Hope that helps. Good luck.

pejka1 · 02-27-2005, 01:49 PM

Today I pulled out #1 plug and checked for spark......and have it. I also tried to start it several times. The engine turns over very very slowly even after charging the battery and jumping it from my tractor battery. I pulled the #1 plug out again and it wasn't wet. Should it be after trying to start it for a while. I'm trying to avoid getting into the engine that much and don't want to start pulling the fuel line apart yet. haven't checked the compression yet. I'll probably wait to check that tomorrow evening.

The coolant level is good too.

I bumped the engine to get the timing mark to 5 degrees BTDC and then pulled off the dist. cap. It seemed to be pointed exactly at #1. I also checked the piston position with a screwdriver in the spark plug hole and it was at it's highest spot. Is it possible that when this guy put the new engine in he could have put the crank pulley in the wrong position? 180 degrees off? Or is there only one way the pully goes on?

All the vaccuum lines on the engine seem to be correct or at least they're connected to something. This is my first look at this engine so I can't be sure.

The guy that put this engine in swears that he double checked everything per the installation manual. I don't know the depth of his knowledge so I can't be sure of anything then. He did mention one other thing to me when I was picking up the truck......He said that he pulled out all of the plugs and turned it over and it didn't turn as easily as it should. Like there was some kind of friction thing going on....hence his theory of the scored cylinder wall.

Thanks,

Jim

pejka1 · 02-27-2005, 07:44 PM

I believe its getting gas. After turning it over several times with a plug out there is a strong gas smell.

I just can't get the thing to crank any faster. I hooked up a larger battery to it and it still struggles to turn over at all. I don't think it's even fast enough to get it to start. What could have happened to it in the 20 minutes it ran? Time to pull it apart and check out the cylinders?

crazycruzer · 02-27-2005, 08:20 PM

Have you checked the engine oil and see what kind of condition it's in?

Smoke · 02-27-2005, 08:49 PM

Have you checked the timing chain, tensioners and sprockets for correct timing alignment?? I would not worry about cylinders or compression right now!! Sounds like timing!!

pejka1 · 02-27-2005, 08:57 PM

Engine oil looks good...correction-->I just drained the oil. It had alot of gas in it. but also seemed to have a greenish tint when I put the light right up to it (just a hint of green). I thought that when there was coolant in the oil it would get milky looking. The oil itself didn't look milky but was very thin in consistency.

I haven't checked the timing chain, sprocket etc. Is it possible that the guy put the crank pulley on incorrectly? The white mark on it lines up perfectly with 5 degrees BTDC now when #1 is at highest point. Top of exhaust stroke maybe?

The thing that scares me about it is that it will barely turn over at all. VERY VERY SLOWLY. Acting almost likes its seizing.

I'm going back to the barn now to check on a couple of other things.

Thank, Jim

crazycruzer · 02-28-2005, 01:06 AM

Did you fried the starter by cranking it too much? I believe certain auto supply retailers will test the starter for you for free to make sure it's cranking out enough torque to turn the motor.

pejka1 · 02-28-2005, 01:17 PM

talked to the guys at toyota today. They said that more than likely the timing was so far off when the guy started it and let it run rough for 20-30 minutes that it probably did some damage to the rod or valve. Probably the valve. I'm going to check the valves tonight if I get some time to pull the head off.

ToyoLoyal · 02-28-2005, 01:41 PM

personally I don't think that running for 30 min would cause that much damage, but I guess it is possible. If the timeing is advanced way to much the engine will crank slowly.

Just because the crank marks line up, the piston is up, and the rotor points to #1 doesn't mean timing is right. The piston could be on the exhaust stroke. Pull the dist. turn the engine one revolution and put dist back in and see if that makes a difference.

Was the new engine complete, or was the head off and someone had to install head and timing chain? Has anyone messed with the timing chain? Possibly the cam is not timed right? With the crank mark on TDC, the dot on the cam gear should be straight up. This would be compression stroke TDC for cyl #1.

That's all I can think of at the moment, good luck.

1tiredyota · 02-28-2005, 04:35 PM

my truck did the same thing. the head gasket was blown and it had water in the cylinder. since water wont compress, it bent a valve and was hard to turn over, very hard! i ended up pulling the whole engine. come to find out the shop that charged me 2000 to rebuild the engine did not stagger my rings, and didnt even put the rod caps back in the correct order. my advice, if you get some time just tear it apart and look at it. its only costing me a set of rings, 25$ rocker bearings, a valve job and gaskets. Its not that bad just takes some time to do it all. it just sounds like a compression issue to me, hopefully im wrong for your sake, good luck!

pejka1 · 02-28-2005, 10:52 PM

I pulled the head off today and noticed some minor scratches on piston #1. The others are perfect. The corresponding valves showed no signs of damage. The crank turns easily now with the head/cam off.

I believe the timing was just that far off. Before I took off the head, I lined up the white tick mark on the crankshaft pulley with the 5 degrees BTDC mark and checked the distributor position. It was directly at #1. When I took the head off, #1 piston was nearly at the bottom of the cylinder. Shouldn't it have been at the top or very close to it?

Is there another was to make sure the crank sproket/chain are aligned properly without pulling off oil pan/differential/cover/brackets/etc.? I guessing no and I'll probably remove them anyway cuz I have alot of time in getting to this point, I don't want to do it again.

I'm pretty sure the new engine was complete with head on. I don't know if the guy who installed the engine put the chain/sprocket on.

HighRaven · 03-01-2005, 10:03 AM

the crank pulley only goes on one way same with the sprocket. trust me i just had mine apart 2 weeks ago. while you have the head off set the crank at TDC and then when you put the head back on make sure that the head is ready for top dead center.
if you dont you will bend a valve if its to far off. the 22re is an interference motor. all in all i agree with everyone else it just sounds like the timing was to far off.