manual vs automatic

[bookbinder]

I'm shopping for a late model Tacoma--2001 thru 2003. The automatics feel great, but I've always driven a stick (a Jeep Cherokee), even in city traffic, and the manual 5-speed just feels normal. My gut feeling is that 150,000 miles down the road a manual transmission will cause fewer repair problems and be simpler and cheaper to maintain, since there just fewer parts to wear out. Also, I'm curious how the automatic handles on rough roads and in 4-wheel.
Thanks for any viewpoints and comments.

[Peter]

well i drive my grandpas pick up and its auto and its great.... but with 5 spd i feel like you have more control over the car

[RubyRed]

Maybe Toyota has addressed this, but the one big advantage that I see of a stick over an automatic is that a stick permits you to force an upshift so that you can limit torque in low-traction conditions (snow, ice, soupy mud) where breaking traction will get you into trouble.

There's nothing like stating-out in 3rd gear on black ice to make you appreciate a stick.

Besides, I like shifting for myself.

[Bakemono]

Originally Posted by bookbinder

The automatics feel great, but I've always driven a stick (a Jeep Cherokee), even in city traffic, and the manual 5-speed just feels normal. My gut feeling is that 150,000 miles down the road a manual transmission will cause fewer repair problems and be simpler and cheaper to maintain, since there just fewer parts to wear out. Also, I'm curious how the automatic handles on rough roads and in 4-wheel.
Thanks for any viewpoints and comments.

Actually, in the long run a manual is more expensive to maintain. Manual trannys have a lot more moving parts and have more that can go wrong.
With an automatic you wont have any problems as long as you replace the fluid every now and then and arent constantly overheating the tranny. With a manual, you have clutches (and the springs plates and bearings), clutch master cylinders, linkage, dog gears and fluid changes.
If you prefer a manual tranny, then get one. However, there is really no advantage to a manual anymore. Today's automatic trannys get just as good fuel economy and in the long run cost LESS to maintain. However, some people still prefer the control and feel of a manual.
Cap'n

[Bakemono]

Originally Posted by RubyRed

Maybe Toyota has addressed this, but the one big advantage that I see of a stick over an automatic is that a stick permits you to force an upshift so that you can limit torque in low-traction conditions (snow, ice, soupy mud) where breaking traction will get you into trouble.

There's nothing like stating-out in 3rd gear on black ice to make you appreciate a stick.

The ECT-i trannys have a "snow" mode that prevents the tranny from shifting into 1st gear (even when stopped) and change the shift logic so that the tranny upshifts and downshifts at lower speeds to prevent wheelspin.
Besides, even if you dont have an ECT-i tranny, you can select the gears yourself with an automatic. Thats why the tranny has the different settings (P, R, N, D, 1, 2, 3).
When Im driving on snow/ice I often times put my auto tranny truck into neutral as I roll up to a stop sign and put it into 2 when I accelerate away from the stop sign. The only thing I cant do is use the clutch to launch off the line with the revs up high. However, when you have a 250 hp V8 that makes peak torque at 2200 rpm, redline drops really arent neccesary.
Cap'n

[Hermit]

It all depends on what your most comfortable with and which one will make your driving experience the most pleasant. As far as mechanical problems go, regular schedualed services on either type trans will most definitely make the odds of having a mechanical failure be very unlikely (although anything man made has its lemons here and there). Another factor when making your decision is who else will be driving the truck besides you. You are no doubt experienced with a manual trans and your clutch could last until your next trade in (unless you buy a used truck with many miles and who knows how they handled the clutch). Also If you are going to share your truck with other drivers besides yourself since Everyone uses a clutch differently this will shorten its life. If this is the case then automatic would be most practical.
But the bottom line is....you should choose which ever trans makes your driving experiences the most comfortable and the most enjoyable they can be! OH....one more thing....If your a dude who loves to take it off the black top now and then....well...I would definitely go with the manual! I have found this to be the most enjoyable.
Hope this helps and good luck with your choice. I'm sure you will be pleased with which ever one you choose! HEY....your gettin a toyota, what more is there to say?!
HERMIT the T-Tech

[qsd-dan]

I'd have to disagree about more problems with a manual trans vs. an auto. Modern day autos are highly sophisticated and contain tons of parts. I belive the problem these days is that virtually nobody PROPERLY drives a manual trans anymore. Most people are burning and harshly dumping clutches, reving the hell out of the motor between gear changes and banging through all gears... at every stoplight. This is why nobody (friends and family) drives any of my manual trans equipt vehicles!

For instance, on a flat, level surface with a stock 2wd pickup in regular town driving, there is no reason to dump the clutch over 1200 rpms, no reason to rev more than 2500 rpms between gears, and no reason to speed shift. Mabey this is why I have almost 200,000 miles on the original 21 year old clutch, trans, master and slave cylinders.

[Countrykid]

Originally Posted by qsd-dan

For instance, on a flat, level surface with a stock 2wd pickup in regular town driving, there is no reason to dump the clutch over 1200 rpms, no reason to rev more than 2500 rpms between gears, and no reason to speed shift. .

Mine seems to rattle, ant act like it has no power below 1400 rpms, so I start out at 14-1600
rpm. and shift around 3k rpm. Maybe it is because it is an 05' PreRunner, with a 2.7 Ltr. Engine.
And if I dumped the clutch at 1200rpm, it will die, but easing out on the clutch it will go, but you get a rattling sound and and fells like it has no power until 14-1500rpm.

[Bakemono]

Those rpms are a little low. Never engage the clutch over 1200 rpm??? Thats not always an option because sometimes you need to accelerate quickly off the line to blend into traffic.
Also, shifting at 2500 rpm is too low in my opinion. I used to shift my '85 4Runner at about 3,000 rpm. Any lower than that and it would lug when you grabbed the next gear.
Cap'n

[FineWynsFJ40]

Manuals are great for towing and most things, due to control over gears and such. Great for driving under speed limits, set the gear and RPM, and you won't really have to worry about going over. I drive a 30 year old H41 with 230,000 miles on it, and it runs like the day it was made. Autos are better in cities due to stop and go, but a manual is superior in most other respects. A properly maintained and driven manual will give a great service life and not require major overhauls. Beat on it and you will be sorry, as is true of any other thing. For dune running, autos are better for their seamless upshifts, but you can play a manual to do little tricks and things on other trails that autos could never do, plus being in TOTAL control of your vehicle.

[qsd-dan]

Originally Posted by Captain_Toyota

Those rpms are a little low. Never engage the clutch over 1200 rpm??? Thats not always an option because sometimes you need to accelerate quickly off the line to blend into traffic.
Also, shifting at 2500 rpm is too low in my opinion. I used to shift my '85 4Runner at about 3,000 rpm. Any lower than that and it would lug when you grabbed the next gear.
Cap'n

I was speaking in regards to a 2wd pickup....with no load in the bed. I'm sure a 4runner, especailly 4wd equipt with oversized tires ect, will have to rev higher in both clutch disengagement and between gear shifts to hit the powerband.

[98wrangler]

Its listed in the Autotrader.com area code 84062 pleasant grove. Here is the deal with Toyota trucks i owned a 97 5sp and traded for the Auto 99 trd truck for a reason. With the auto its better for towing no clutches to wear out over time like a manual trannys. It drives like a lexus with the auto has the lock out tourqe converter button a big plus. For cherokes i think Auto is the way to go same with tacomas, Jeep wranglers get the stick. If you interested in mine check out on the AT web site asking $14,200 MSRP was like 25k new and was truck of the year then. Auto extracab,v6,TRD so its got bilstein shocks,heavy duty springs,auto tranny cooler,Electronic yota rear locker,31 inch pirelli tires,bedliner,sliding window,pr locks,windows,lits,cruise,cd player,air. Just had serivced at brett brown toyota they did Front brake pads,plugs and tune up,oxy sensor,throtle body cleaning + maf,timming belt change all belts,said water pump had slight leak so replaced at this time. Its ready to roll i spent $1000 in updating. I also got a 98 wrangler for sale gunmetal blue if interested.

[Mike-in-WV]

No need for a stick on road or off in the boonies. It's just a matter of choice. Don't know why so many people think you can't shift an auto tranny. Guess they haven't driven one very much.

For many years now I have owned nothing but 4x4 autos and have had them in some real tight spots on the edge of these mountains and would not go back to stick for anyone. Mike

[Those People]

All I know is friends of mine with autos always tell me of these outrageous repair bills. I never hear it from the manual people. I always have owned manuals and I probably aways will. I just like them.

[Bakemono]

Originally Posted by Those People

All I know is friends of mine with autos always tell me of these outrageous repair bills. I never hear it from the manual people. I always have owned manuals and I probably aways will. I just like them.

Thats fine if you personally prefer a manual tranny. However, I have never seen a single instance where a manual tranny has proven itself to be less expensive in the long run vs. an automatic.
My brother has a '92 Ford F-150 that has 230,000 miles on it with the original tranny. Its a 4-speed cable-shift (no electronics) tranny. He has never gotten the tranny flushed, and he has only dropped the pan once in that time. If a Ford tranny can last that long, a Toyota tranny should be able to last at least twice as long.
There is still more moving parts in a manual, and with that more possibility for things to go wrong. Also, its not all that hard to abuse a manual tranny. In fact, a lot of people are abusing their manuals and they dont even know it.
Cap'n