Can axle seals be ruined easily?

[JesusJones]

I just bought a used 96 toyota corolla dx 4a-fe with 5 speed transmission.

I had a 01 corolla ce before but my girlfriend got hit by a semi truck when she was driving(No injuries)

So I wanted another corolla because I really liked my other one. I found this one and I thought I bought it for a good price and the guy had just swapped in a 107 000 km engine, put new tires and brakes and overall I was happy with my purchase. But the damn thing is leaking gear oil. I took a peak underneath and could see that it was leaking from both sides around the axles. Searching around for a while on the web I found out it may be the axle seals.

I want to ask some people who are more experienced than me if some one who isn't really a mechanic would most likely damage the seals when he is doing an engine swap. Or is it pretty hard to bugger them up?? And any other ideas as to what the issue may be if it's most likely not the axle seals?

The guy I bought it from is in Vegas till Friday( explains why he was so set on the price) So I don't know if he's gonna help me out at all or if he even knew about it before he sold it to me.

Thanks for your time,
Rudy


P.S. I'm guessing I should stay away from any sort of "stop leak"??

[Bitter]

you can damage them when taking the axles out and more easily when putting the axles in.

[1jzdreamer]

Yes, if your not careful when taking the axles in and out, the seals (especially once older and harder) will crack or tear if the cv shaft hits it during removal or installation. about 20 for the 2 seals and about 3 hours to replace them depending on your technical ability.

[JesusJones]

Thanks for the responses,

Kinda puts my mind at ease, I'm gonna call him tomorrow and see if he will meet me half way at all.(I'm not expecting anything, but you can always hope)

If not, spending 20$ and 4-5 hours ripping this car apart in -6 weather won't be that bad :P Hopefully I don't rip the ones I'm putting in though.

Puts my mind at ease knowing it won't be a 500$ repair or something crazy.


And I may as well ask. What kind of gas mileage are you guys getting from your cars? Mine seems to be guzzling the gas down(like 24-25mpg). The only thing I suspect is the spark plugs that have a gap of almost .045 and look like they were sanded. Would that make a big dent in your gas mileage? I'm also gonna test the o2 sensors as well, unless some one tells me not to.

I want my car to be at it's best. Like everyone here

Cheers

[Kiwi-Corolla]

Originally Posted by JesusJones

And I may as well ask. What kind of gas mileage are you guys getting from your cars? Mine seems to be guzzling the gas down(like 24-25mpg). The only thing I suspect is the spark plugs that have a gap of almost .045 and look like they were sanded. Would that make a big dent in your gas mileage? I'm also gonna test the o2 sensors as well, unless some one tells me not to.

I want my car to be at it's best. Like everyone here

Cheers

Around 27-38mpg, depending on how aggressively I drive. The spark plug gap could definitely be a contributing factor to the fuel consumption. Well worth testing the o2 sensors, make sure your air filter is nice and clean too.

[speedy25]

Its easy for axle seals to get damaged if you arent careful when installing the axles. My guess is they are leaking from the engine installer being careless.

Make sure you oil the lips and the seal surface when you put in fresh ones. Assembling them dry can tear the lips or fold them over. Also check the seal surface on the axle. If its rusty, use some fine sandpaper to remove rust and any nicks.

-SP

[JesusJones]

Originally Posted by speedy25

Make sure you oil the lips and the seal surface when you put in fresh ones. Assembling them dry can tear the lips or fold them over. Also check the seal surface on the axle. If its rusty, use some fine sandpaper to remove rust and any nicks.

-SP

Thanks for that tip, I will be sure to do that.

I will replace the plugs check the sensors get a K&N reusable filter and put in my custom 25$ cold air intake(granted it fits and will work with a map sensor) . And if all goes well I will post pictures so that everyone else can get a 4-6mpg bump. For only 25$

Cheers,
Rudy

[JesusJones]

Ok a quick reply here would be very helpful.

I finally(after three days of stubborn bolts and nuts, completely rusted in pins and breaking 2 breaker bars) managed to get the one axle out and the other will be out right away. I already pulled one seal and just wanna make sure I do this right the first time.

I managed to instantly forget which way the seal came out. But since I still have one to pull out I will know soon which side goes in first. But if you could still tell me that'd be great. Ex. The side with the spring goes into the tranny first. Or the side with the spring will face outwards towards the axle?

And I want to sand the rust off of the axle very carefully correct?

And I don't have the tool for pushing in the seal but heard it can be done by hand. Or using a large socket. How far do I wanna push it in. I heard the word flush a lot, but flush with which part of the seal?

the seal I bought has no sort of lip that prevents you from pushing it in too far so just wanna make sure.

Thanks!



Ok So when I pulled the passenger side shaft I noticed that the seal was slightly unflush with the transmission(pushed in too far) Is that the kind of thing that would cause it too leak? The seals I pulled really don't look all that different from the brand new ones. So would improper installation of them cause the leak?


Well I figured it out. But already forked up my seal with the tool I was using I was so close to having it in there too.




And once again I'm editing:
I bought a seal tool and a new seal. Hammered it in the best i could get it. It was a little crooked. Maybe a mm in on the bottom and a mm out on the top. Is that probably gonna leak?? or be OK

And would the seal being seated tooo far in cause leaking? I'm just trying to figure out why the seals weren't working in the first place?
Thanks for your time,
Rudy

[speedy25]

File this in your brain- Bearings and seals are always installed with the markings OUT.

If you havent installed seals before, your best bet may be to use a block of wood between the hammer and the seal. yes the seal gets driven in flush with the metal its inserted into.

If its crooked, work on it some more to get it straight. Its not very hard.

NOW.... I was under my car recently and noticed that the driveshafts wiggle in their holes much more than I think they should. If you have the same symptom, a new seal may not fix the problem. The rubber can only compensate for so much runout.

-SP

[JesusJones]

Originally Posted by speedy25

File this in your brain- Bearings and seals are always installed with the markings OUT. -SP

Filed.

Yea I was using a long piece of wood and the head of an old sludge hammer to try and get it flush. That was as good as she got. And I was a little nervous about screwing up another seal or deforming that one by trying to hammer down the one sidemore than I already had. But I will give it a few more whacks tomorrow.


I didn't notice any wiggle in my adventures but will double check it tomorrow.

Thanks,
Rudy

[Bitter]

a large socket makes a good seal driver.

[JesusJones]

Biggest socket I had was 36mm and that was too small. Then I tried a big old steel pipe. Also too small. Then I got close with a piece of a chain link fence. Managed to just fit over the lip, but since the other end was rounded it wasn't to good for hammering or anything.

So for 27$ (with tax) i bought this seal tool. Comes with a bunch of plastic parts that you put together to make it work for whatever seal you have. And it has a big metal washer that helps it be durable. The only thing it doesn't do is stop you from hammering it in too far. For that I wrapped it in a bunch of duct tape to give it an extra wide lip. But still once that seal was angled I couldn't do much with it. So out came the 2x4.

I worry though. I already put the damn thing back together and fear taking everything apart will damage the seal. Where as right now it might just work.

learning is fun

Cheers

[Bitter]

yea, or a seal driver kit works too. you can't drive it too deeply, theres a lip inside and you'll feel it bottom out. small firm taps will push it in evenly and slowly, be careful when removing them not to damage the case around the seal. any damage to the area which the seal seats in will cause a leak as well!

[JesusJones]

I donno about the too deeply part. I called up my local transmission shop and asked him how to properly seat the seal. He told me to make it flush with the transmission to within 1/16 of an inch.

And when I looked at the original passenger side seal it was definatley pushed in far enough to make it very NOT flush with the transmission. When I pulled this seal it was also in pretty much perfect condition, so the only reason I can see that it might of been leaking would be because it was seated too far in. And the seals I now have are exactly the same. No fancy lips to keep anything from going in too far.

How sure are you about that??


I keep hearing people say they use a half inch driver to push the seal in. I figured that the driver would push on the outside of the seal....but do you actually put it in the middle of the seal just around the very inside edge and then drive it in?? That would make a big difference in my method. ???
In my little picture the seal is black. And I am using a driver that is like the red part. But do you guys use one that is like the green part? That goes in the inside??

[JesusJones]

Well I got them in.

And the drivers side actually stopped leaking(fingers crossed) But the passenger side is leaking very slowly. I will try taking it back out and reseating it. I'm betting I can do it in 1 hour now.

Does pulling it back out usually cause damage??

Rudy