Just wondering if people have experience with the fuel economy of the 1.8L XRS Corolla. Yes, I know that if you wring it out, it won't get the best milage, but....I wonder if any 1.8L XRS owners have tried to see what their best mileage possible was.
I was wondering if you can drive the XRS such that you get close to the fuel economy of the non-XRS. Not that you'd drive it like that all the time, but....just wondering if you can squeeze more fuel economy out of the XRS from time to time by driving conservatively.
I was wondering if you can drive the XRS such that you get close to the fuel economy of the non-XRS.
I imagine you could drive an XRS very easy and achieve the fuel economy of a non-XRS driven pretty hard. There's a pretty big difference in economy between the two. In current EPA numbers, the XRS is 22/31, and an S model (manual) is 28/37.
From what I understand, you have to drive a non-XRS awfully hard to get below 30 MPG (well, manual transmission that is). I've never gotten below 30 MPG with my '07 LE 5-speed, ever. My overall average is over 35 MPG, and that's mostly commuting miles.
My CE 2005 Automatic dipped once to 28/29 mpg in July when it was over 110 and my AC was cranked. That was a few years back. Otherwise, I have not been able to break the 30 barrier. Typically get between 31 to 33 mpg. However, for the past 2 tanks, using non-ethanol blended fuel I got 36 mpg and 35.8 mpg.
Yeah, that is quite a big difference in the EPA numbers. It seems kinda weird that they were un-able to design the XRS engine with better fuel-economy at lower revs. They can control the valve timing.
There's only so much you can compensate for with valve timing. That engine makes about 100 hp/L.
In order to make that same kind of power, the 2.7L I-4 in the new Venza would be pushing 270 horsepower. It's not; instead, it's about 180-190 hp I think. The Camry's 3.5L V-6 would be cranking out 350 horsepower. It's not. A 5.7L Corvette would have 570 horsepower. It doesn't, even with supercharging.
The cams are designed with lots of lift and overlap to get that kind of power. They already added one thing to it that the normal cars don't have, which is variable lift adjustment. So they actually control valve timing AND lift. But again, there's only so "tame" you can go on the low end if you want 100 hp/L on the top end.
Plus, you have the super-short final drive ratio, which helps fuel economy none. The XRS screams down the interstate, at what, 3500-4000 RPM right? The CE/S/LE is barely turning 3000 RPM at the same speed (the 5-speed in my LE spins my engine 3000 RPM at 75 MPH). How fast does the 2ZZ-GE turn at 75 MPH?
Yeah, I wonder. I should get a tach for my CE for curiosity sake. They actually say the 2.4L Camry powered XRS Corolla's have fairly good fuel economy, but, they also have shorter than ideal gearing. Begs the question, why not a 6th in the 2.4L XRS?
On the other end of the spectrum, I wonder what turbo-charged 1.8L and 2.4L XRS engines would be like performance wise (5 to 7 PSI...no major re-build with lower comp pistons)....but that's going to inhale mucho gas. I wonder what a turbo 1.8L non-XRS would be like.
Yeah, I wonder. I should get a tach for my CE for curiosity sake. They actually say the 2.4L Camry powered XRS Corolla's have fairly good fuel economy, but, they also have shorter than ideal gearing. Begs the question, why not a 6th in the 2.4L XRS?
On the other end of the spectrum, I wonder what turbo-charged 1.8L and 2.4L XRS engines would be like performance wise (5 to 7 PSI...no major re-build with lower comp pistons)....but that's going to inhale mucho gas. I wonder what a turbo 1.8L non-XRS would be like.
You can wonder and speculate all you want, but the 9th gen XRS is still the car to have when it if you want a Corolla that performs well straight out of the factory. It all comes down to the sweeet 2ZZ-GE + 6 speed manual combo.
The 10th gen XRS is too heavy while the lower model 9th gens were built for commuting.
As for the answer to your other questions, you should send Toyota an email asking the engineers that.
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Last edited by PhatRoyale; 09-23-2009 at 09:57 PM.
Aside from the required minimum Octane 91 premium gas requirement, the XRS performs almost identical to a 1ZZ when the revs are kept below 5000 rpm. The high lift cam does not engage until 6000+ rpm so the fuel economy is very close to the 1ZZ and since it a short geared 6 speed with a 4.53:1 final drive, it gives a bit worse fuel economy than 1ZZ.
Nonetheless, I usually average 32 - 33 mpg in mixed city and highway driving if I do not drive too aggressively. If I drive very conservatively on the highway, I can get anything up to 38 mpg.
If the revs are kept between 6000 and 8400 rpm then the fuel economy goes down the drain.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhatRoyale
You can wonder and speculate all you want, but the 9th gen XRS is still the car to have when it if you want a Corolla that performs well straight out of the factory. It all comes down to the sweeet 2ZZ-GE + 6 speed manual combo.
The 10th gen XRS is too heavy while the lower model 9th gens were built for commuting.
As for the answer to your other questions, you should send Toyota an email asking the engineers that.
__________________ SSM 05 Corolla XRS 6 Spd VVTL-i 2ZZ-GE /04 Corolla S 1ZZ-FE (sold)
At 120kph (75mph) I believe she's turning about 3600rpm. I know at 100kph it's about 3200rpm.
Fuel economy is not the strongest point of the 2ZZ-GE. I'm getting 24mpg (just over 10L/100km) with about 95% city on 94 octane. I'm not driving the car to its economic potential either. I don't drive on the highway very much so I can't give a number.
Can you get the 2ZZ-GE upto the economy of a 1ZZ-FE: I doubt it. FE engines are designed from the get-go with fuel efficiency and emissions in mind. The GE engines are designed for maximum performance sacrificing fuel economy and emissions as a result. Typically high horsepower/liter engines don't have great fuel economy (Ferrari 360 Modena 3.6L = 10MPG city, 16MPG highway vs. VW Passat 4Motion 3.6L = 18MPG city, 26MPG highway).
Technical stuff...
The 2ZZ-GE doesn't have good fuel economy at lower revs because it's a more square engine with a 82mm bore and a 85mm stroke with a high compression ratio (91 octane min), contrast to the 1ZZ-FE's 79mm bore and 91.5mm stroke with lower compression ratio (87 octane recommended). 1ZZ-FE is designed with torque and fuel economy, the 2ZZ-GE is designed for horsepower at the top end, rather than low end torque.
The engines in day to day use differ quite drastically performance wise.
1ZZ-FE: The 1ZZ-FE has it's power instantly at lower revs (below 4000rpm) causing the engine to be zippy around town compared to the 2ZZ-GE. Typically most manufactures will design a engine towards a torque bias because it's more suitable in every day driving and will help with fuel econonmy, and engine efficiency in day to day use.
2ZZ-GE: The 2ZZ-GE Feels lazy below 4000rpm. Above 4000rpm the engine will wake up, and begin to "want" to change RPM quicker. The power of the engine comes near towards the top end (high rpm) which is not ideal for day to day driving. silver04rollas has informed TN on various occasions that although Toyota stated the peak torque for the XRS at 127lb-ft @ 4400rpm, it's actually 133lb-ft @ 6700rpm just after the 2ZZ-GE hits lift.
Gotcha. Well, I guess my CE is what it is. I do wish I could open up the exhaust and intake and mod the ECU for a little more power, but....I can't seem to find any real ECU mods. Would I get any HP if I put in a slightly larger OD exhaust? Maybe mandrel bent?
You might net 10 hp or so by installing an aftermarket exhaust and intake system. Maybe add a header to that as well.
The transmission (in my opinion) is the real limiting factor. If you have the automatic, it really sucks the life out of the engine. The manual transmission cars perform remarkably well for what they are in my opinion. The '07 LE 5-speed was tested by Car & Driver and posted a 7.9 second run to 60. That's pretty quick for a 126 horsepower car that easily returns mid-30s for MPG. There were slower cars tested during that comparison that returned relatively poor fuel economy.
You might net 10 hp or so by installing an aftermarket exhaust and intake system. Maybe add a header to that as well.
.
2ZZ responds to even bolt-ons extremely well. Some of it is due to very restrictive intake from factory (a 1ZZ airbox) so the dyno proven gains on XRS from intake alone is 11 - 14 wheel HP (that is about 15 - 17@crank), PPE engineering race header adds 10 - 11 wheel HP (about 12 - 13 HP@crank).
A stock XRS dynos at 153 - 155 wheel HP and with intake/race header/exhaust, the dynos are in the 180 - 182 wheel HP region. That is about 30 wheel HP gain from three bolt-ons
__________________ SSM 05 Corolla XRS 6 Spd VVTL-i 2ZZ-GE /04 Corolla S 1ZZ-FE (sold)
I remember the Celica GT engine had 140 HP (GTS = of course the 180 similar to XRS). I wonder if the Celica GT engine with light mods would be a neat compromise for a Corolla. Lot's of work though.
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