Frustrating 192K service at the dealer.

[towtruck]

Am feeling a bit ripped off and am looking for some opinions on what to do.

Yesterday, I went to my local Toyota dealer for my 192,000 km service on my 2005 Corolla.

Was in and out in less than 90 minutes for $426. Yikes, but there was a lot on the list to be done.

Went over the bill yesterday afternoon and it was not adding up.

Every page of the bill has the labour rate stated as $89.

The total service is listed as 4 'jobs'.

Job #1, transmission fluid change, time is 0.30 units, cost is $48.67
Job #2, maintenance service, time is 1.0 units, cost is $86.00
Job #3, change spark plugs, time is 0.40 units, cost is $35.15
Job #4, coolant change, time is 0.50 units, cost is $69.33

Labour total was listed as $239.15. At $89 an hour this equates to almost 2.7 hours.

I was not sure if 'units' means actual minutes or if it means percentage of an hour, so I worked it both ways.

Units as minutes would give a total time of 3 hours.

Units as a percentage would give a total time of 2.2 hours.

So all my hour estimates from the bill are over the 90 minutes that I was at the dealer.

I called the service manager yesterday to ask about the bill. It was a frustrating conversation. I didn't get any clear explanation as to why the numbers didn't add up, but I did hear that:

- the bills are detailed the way they are to help their accounting and it is confusing to the customer.
- the units listed on the bill are what they actually pay the tech and are not actually the time it takes to do the job.
- I still don't know if units are minutes or a percentage of an hour. I believe they are hours.minutes.
- the labour rate of $89 is for other things they do in the shop, ie. not maintenance items which have their own special prices.
- their prices are comparable to the local Honda dealer. Nice to know, but I have a Toyota.
- front end alignment equipment is expensive and their unit is better than the ones at Canadian Tire. Totally random comment since I didn't have an alignment done.

At this point I was frustrated and was late to take my 4 year old to her ballet lesson. I told him that I wasn't happy with the bill or his explanations and couldn't see bringing the car there for service if I can't figure out the bill and that I had to go.

I am all fired up to the point of writing this rant and writing a complaining letter to the general manager, not that either of them will accomplish much than to make me feel better by venting.

Should I pursue it further with them or drop it and save myself the aggravation with the thought that this is what I get for getting the service from the dealer.

Thanks!

[nitronate33]

it is true that many auto body shops and dealers have different labor rates depending on the job. this sounds like it is the case. units are hours, for sure. certain jobs require more skilled techs and therefore are more expensive per hour. this is normal in just about any industry, so it makes perfect sense.

i would not fight this, you are picking at details that you were just not fully informed about.

my suggestion would be to learn how to do these jobs yourself, they are friggin' easy.

[towtruck]

Thanks for the voice of reason nitronate33.

The next maintenance is mine!

[nmehes]

Only at a dealership would someone agree on a price. Pay what they agreed to and then be upset afterwards.

[03mooncorolla]

Customer pays the rate (or hours) detailed for that repair task, if the tech repairs it in under that time. IE: The shop benifits by getting more vehicles in that day or the tech does by completing more bill able jobs that day, and really the both gain.

But the truth is most shops do work in this manner, brake, exhaust, transmission shops, flat rate for the task and do it in less time, skill and expertise add up. but problems can arise that is why the rate is what it is.

No garages that I am aware of will rebate the customer if they take less time on maintenace repairs, unless a quote was given for example on electical repairs and the fault was found quickly you would only pay for time taken.

I think you just had someone who did a poor job of explaining how garages(to be honest) make their money.

FYI I just recently paid to have the coolant changed in my car at the same cost. only difference I dropped mine off and didn't wait for it and have no clue how long it took.

You could call and see if you get a better explaination from the GM, but really just call around some garages and ask what the rate would be for the work you had done, if it's not the same I'm sure it would be more.

The dealer is for all intensive purposes the expert for repairs to you car.

Hope this helps you

[Bob Shiftright]

I had a similar service performed at an indy garage a few months ago @ 6823 miles (I inherited the car and it hadn't been driven much in the last few years.)

Coolant change, oil change, transmission fluid change and brake fluid change. I do a lot of my own routine maintenance work, but lately used fluids have become difficult to dispose of, so I'll let a shop do the changes.

I provided a case of Mobil-1 and a Toyota oil filter. I changed the engine air filter and cabin microfilter myself. I didn't change the plugs because -- well, the car has so few miles on it. I thought it would be a waste.

The indy shop is ASE certified. My bill was $274.02 (US) with tax. This is in the NYC area, which is usually on the high side for labor cost.

The filters were about $50 and the Mobil-1 about $20. So (roughly) $350 total. Considering that you also had the plugs changed and a Toyota dealer did the work, it doesn't sound too far off.

My experience has been that new car dealers are generally more expensive than indy shops.

[nickxrs]

There is absolutely nothing fishy. I work at a Toyota dealership as a Tech. We have standards for how long everything takes. Like replacing front brakes and cutting the rotors is about 2.5 hours, it usually only takes about a good hour or hour and a half. The tech then gets paid his flat rate for 2.5 hours. No tech is getting rich off your bill, especially because most of the time a lot of the techs don't make their 8 hours a day even if they're there for 8 hours.

All in all, you didn't get ripped off, but you need to realize that dealerships are pretty expensive, BUT all of the techs work on toyota's all day and have more experience with those types of cars than others do.

[devinsdad]

The problem comes when, as you say, the job is listed at 2.5 hours. A skilled tech gets it done in 1.0 or 1.5 hours. The customer is still billed at the 2.5 hour rate. Therefore, the customer is getting taken for money that isn't warrented. No dealer makes that much money off the sale of new vehicles. The big coin is in repairs and routine maintenance of those vehicles.