Replaced fuel pump now no start

[rvac99]

2005 Corolla CE
The car died on the highway and was towed to the dealership. Payed to have the problem diagnosed and they said it was the fuel pump and it was going to cost $1249.52
I had the vehicle towed to my home and I bought a new pump w/filter for $200. Now the car starts and idles smooth for a few seconds rough and then stalls. Stalls when gas pedal is depressed. No codes.

This is what the dealer printed out for me:
Codes for multiple misfires and lean code for bank 1. Diagnosed vehicle has spark and no fuel. Checked for power and ground at pump good. Performed active test for fuel pump on scan tool cannot get pump to work. Found TSB for fuel pump replacement. Estimate to repair with factory parts $1249.52.

[johnoh]

its fair to say that you are not getting constant fuel, but lets not assume anything else just yet. You had a problem, put in a new fuel pump, and the problem continues. So its not likely that another fuel pump will fix this.

Are you saying that the car will start but then stall, but then it can start again? If so, then the fuel pump is working (at least some of the time). You could have a clog in the fuel between the tank and the injector, or some other problem. Did you change out the fuel filter? You definitely want to have your fuel pressure tested. Your fuel pressure regulator could also be the problem. If an injector is the issue your stalling would be preceded by stumbling, as some of the cylinders fire and other(s) do not. If the stalling is just a quick complete stall, then the problem is prior to the injectors.

[rvac99]

Thanks for the quick reply.

Sometimes it starts again after it sputters out. Sometimes I get a few seconds of smooth idle then rough, sputtering and stall. Other times it starts rough and then stalls and eventually it won't start at all but will fire a few times.
I wait a few minutes and it will start and go through the same routine.

I had it running at idle for about five minutes. During some of these runs I could hear the cylinders starting to miss one by one listening to the exhaust. One would start to miss then another. The RPM's would start to slow and then it would go into the rough/shaking low idle and then stall. Sometimes the computer would kick the RPM's back up but eventually it would go rough and then stall like it was being starved for fuel.

It is acting like my fuel pressure is low or there is a lot of air in the line. I'm used to Subaru and VW's and with them I would disconnect the fuel line at the fuel rail and bleed the system. They also were somewhat self bleeding with the return line but this Toyota does not have a return line or a disconnect at the fuel rail to check for air or fuel pressure.

How do I check the fuel pressure on this car?

I could have something in the line as the line was disconnected for some time while I struggled with the retaining ring on the pump.

[invader]

Original ECU?

[MasterTecInSTL]

Clean the mass air flow sensor. It could also be a defective pump. Also you didn't happen to fill it up with E85 did you?

I've never seen a fuel pump fail on one of these. I'm not saying it's not possible just not likely. I have to wonder if the shop misdiagnosed the problem.

I had a customer once insist his pump was bad on a late 90's Camry and who insisted that I install his Autozone pump. He barely spoke english so after he towed it to me I made sure that he completely understood that I would not guarantee this would fix his problem and there would be absolutely no warranty. He signed the paperwork and I did the pump.

In the process of replacing his "bad" pump I noticed his ground wire was all corroded so out of the goodness of my heart while I was in there I soldered in a new section of wire and a new eyelet and finished the installation. When I was done the car started right up but driving it around the parking lot revealed a severe lack of throttle response.. something was obviously not right.

I tested his old pump and it seemed to be working just fine (the ground wire was the problem) so I took it back apart and put the old pump back in. Once again it started right up and purred like a kitten! Full power, nice and smooth.. everything was just dandy!

I told my boss what had happened (he wanted me to release the car running like crap) and later that night after he picked the car up I found that he ended up telling the customer that we replaced the pump and everything was good! Ends up he was too lazy to try to talk to the guy so he just handed him the keys and took his money. Oh well his problem was fixed and everyone walked away happy.. thank god he didn't ask for his "old" pump back!

The new Autozone pump simply didn't produce enough pressure. I don't know if it was defective or just the wrong one but it ended up in the trash. It wasn't even worth messing with.

[johnoh]

I haven't checked the fuel pressure on a corolla. sorry.

Aside from a line clog your symptoms also point to the possibility of intermittent power to the pump, as in a weak electrical connection, so that's something else to check.

[rvac99]

Invader: Yes original.

Master Tech in St. Louis: Very interesting...I'll check the ground and the old pump. (in the morning)

The mass air flow sensor- I assume it is in the intake tube engine side of the air filter. What should I use to clean it? Carb cleaner ok?

This car also has had a CEL 171 on numerous occations. I think this was for the mass air flow sensor. I guess I should just replace it huh?

[invader]

Carb or brake cleaner works. The inner MAF sensor can only be sprayed. The visible IAT sensor head can also carefully be wiped clean after it's sprayed. Both sensors are in the same black plastic unit
P0171 lean code is usually caused by leaking intake manifold gasket. If you have the original black gasket, it most likely is leaking. You can tell from black oily residue beside where it sits on engine head surface. Replace with Toyota's revised orange silicon gasket.

[rvac99]

Fuel pump is only putting out a trickle. Maybe 1 psi. I managed to separate the fuel line from the fuel rail by cutting a piece of tubing and pushing it into the connection to separate the locking clips. I found the same flow rate at the outlet of the fuel pump unit.
Intake manifold gasket will be in tomorrow.

Does anyone know if this is the correct psi/flow rate for the fuel pump?

This is a Denso pump. The same as the old one which is confirmed dead as a door nail.

The pump does not ground anywhere near the fuel tank and I found no resistance in the ground at the plug. Voltage was right up there at 13+ when the engine was running. I also ran the pump with jumper wires and a spare battery. Same result.

[olbus]

I believe it is supposed to be 44-50 PSI at idle.

[invader]

Connector on fuel pump: 3 2 1
................................................. 5 4

ON–VEHICLE INSPECTION

1. CHECK FUEL PUMP OPERATION

(a) Connect the hand–held tester to the DLC3.
(b) Turn the ignition switch ON and hand–held tester main
switch ON.

NOTICE:
Do not start the engine.

(c) Select the active test mode on the hand–held tester.
(d) Please refer to the hand–held tester operator’s manual
for further details.
(e) If you have no hand–held tester, connect the positive (+)
lead form the battery to terminal 4 of the connecter, and
the negative (–) lead to terminal 5.

NOTICE:

These tests must be done quickly (within 10 seconds)
to prevent the coil burning out.

Keep the fuel pump as far away from the battery as
possible.

Always do the switching at the battery side.
2. CHECK FUEL PRESSURE

(a) Prepare for inspection.
(1) Purchase a new fuel tube, and take out the fuel tube
connector from its tube.
HINT:
Part No. 23901–0D010
(b) Work for prevent gasoline from spilling out.
(See page

11–1)
(c) Disconnect the EFI fuel pipe clamp. (See page 11–1)
(d) Disconnect the fuel tube from the fuel main tube.
Install SST (pressure gauge) as shown in the illustration
by using the SST and fuel tube connector.
SST 09268–41047 (90467–13001, 95336–08070),
09268–45014 (09268–41200, 09268–41220,
09268–41250, 90467–13001)
(f) Wipe off any splattered gasoline.
(g) Start the engine.
(h) Measure the fuel pressure at idle.

Fuel pressure:
304 – 343 kPa (3.1 – 3.5 kgf

Vcm2, 44 – 50 psi)

(i) Stop the engine.
(j) Check that the fuel pressure remains as specified for 5
minutes after the engine has stopped.

Fuel pressure:
147 kPa (1.5 kgf

Vcm2, 21 psi) or more

If pressure is not as specified, check the fuel pump, pressure
regulator and/or injectors.
(k) After checking fuel pressure, disconnect the negative (–)
terminal cable from the battery and carefully, remove the
SST and fuel tube connector to prevent gasoline from the
splashing.
(l) Reconnect the fuel tube to fuel main tube.
(m) Install the EFI fuel pipe clamp.

(n) Check fuel leak. (See page 11–1)

[MasterTecInSTL]

If you have full power at the pump and a good ground at the pump then it looks like you have a defective pump.

[i4getlots]

as johnoh asked, did you replace the fuel filter?

[rvac99]

I removed the pump this morning and found the o-ring was pinched. The directions that came with the new pump said to place the new ring into the pump. When I installed the pump into the housing it folded over.

This time I placed the o-ring inside the housing on the nipple that inserts into the pump. When I put the pump on the nipple and pushed it into the housing it made a nice solid snap into place.

The car is running fine now.

Thank you Johno, Master tech, and invader for your help.

[MasterTecInSTL]

Originally Posted by rvac99

I removed the pump this morning and found the o-ring was pinched. The directions that came with the new pump said to place the new ring into the pump. When I installed the pump into the housing it folded over.

This time I placed the o-ring inside the housing on the nipple that inserts into the pump. When I put the pump on the nipple and pushed it into the housing it made a nice solid snap into place.

The car is running fine now.

Thank you Johno, Master tech, and invader for your help.

Thanks for the follow up! Maybe someone can learn from this! Too many people would be too "ashamed" to come on and admit that installer error caused something like that.

I have a lot of respect for you for keeping it real with us and I'm especially glad that you figured it out and got it running! Congrats!

Welcome aboard!