bubbles, coolant missing

[AE95]

I was shocked to find my fuel efficient, smooth running easy starting 1988 All-Trac wagon was swallowing coolant and is blowing froth and large bubbles when i idle it with the cap off.

It looks like a head gasket failure. It pains me. The car has done 120,000 miles. Its rust free and everything works, even the air-con.

I see on this site an ad for "Thermagasket's Carbon and Metal Alloy Head and Block Repair System" Is that worth a try?

Or is there any other effective additive for a 4AFE cooling system? The gasket leak can't be huge as it is using only a hundred millilitres a day and there is no sign of water in the oil.

I think the gasket sprang a leak just a few days a go. Since then i have driven it all day around town with no fluctuation in the normal operating temperature.

I don't have the skills to do a gasket repair myself.

[REN69]

I'd buy a headgasket kit from Toyota and get a reputable shop to change it for you so that you don't pay high dealer prices OR buy a used low-mileage motor from a Japanese Motor shop and get that installed. Gaskets are not easy to do, I wouldn't attempt this myself unless you have all the tools to remove half of the motor to do a gasket. This is the main reason why I suggest doing a swap, because chances are a gasket job won't be cheap. I'd say start pricing around Toyota dealers and other shops and see how much a gasket job will cost you, then price out a motor from a Japanese motor shop and see what the difference is.

[AE95]

thanks, is it worth trying a chemiweld additive for the meantime? I was thinking that if i was going to replace the engine, i might as well use this one all up. It'd be nice to extend its life somehow.

[Flashmn]

I see on this site an ad for "Thermagasket's Carbon and Metal Alloy Head and Block Repair System" Is that worth a try?

Definate no, you'd be replacing everything after a while there. it clogs up everything and thus can amount to a much higher price for repairs than a simple headgasket.

[Raddman]

Originally Posted by Flashmn

Definate no, you'd be replacing everything after a while there. it clogs up everything and thus can amount to a much higher price for repairs than a simple headgasket.

So true...stay away from that junk, It will only make things worse!...~Radd Guy....

[Nad1370]

^^ +1

Coolant leak will just get worse and might cost you more money.

If this thing has been good and reliable to you, then why not spend a little to get more.

[AE95]

I noticed clouds of white and blue smoke on my way home today. For the past few days, the car has been starting with a quite loud pop or clap sound just before it turns over and idling roughly. Oil has been leaking out of the oil cap. It wasn't overheating until today.

So I've done about 28,000 miles since I started this thread and there was always a very small but steady usage of coolant. I changed the coolant once.

[AE95]

I put a product called Chemiweld in the radiator. It is made in australia and costs $10 for a container, which can treat 8 - 12 litres of coolant.

Basically you just drain the cooling system, fill it back up with water, get the engine warmer than usual, add the chemiweld slowly and let the engine idle warm for 20 minutes. Then after driving for a while flush the cooling system and put normal coolant back in.

I did this, and found all the vapour and smoke has completely stopped coming out the exhaust. I have driven a total of about 50 kms so far, with no problems. The engine actually runs with more power than before. One thing that has changed however is the oil light does not come on at all now when the ignition is turned on and the car is started. The oil level is fine, there is quite a bit of water mixed in with the oil and i wonder if this has mucked with the oil pressure sensor.

Its an interesting study anyway, and for anyone who has an old engine not worth fixing, you may like to see how long this 1988 4AFE lasts, I will keep you posted.

[Bitter]

ya, that motor wont last long with that water mixed in. you've already damaged the bearings, its a matter of time before one starts to spin and clunk or the heat stops working because the magic fix plugged up the heater core, you get hot spots and a warped head/block because the magic fix clogged cooling passages, or it completely overheats because the magic fix clogged the radiator. now, not only willl you need a new engine, but also radiator, hoses, heater hoses, and heater core. amazing what $10 can end up costing isnt it? everyone here said do not use it, and for good reason!

[aarong420]

scary....
when i start my car in the mourning, it does the same. It idles with white smoke or vapor coming out of the exhaust. Im not losing any coolant ,But i notice the car does sometimes just give a little bog. Im wondering if the two things are linked.

[aarong420]

Thats in a 20V btw.

[Bitter]

nah, some white is normal. thats condensation from combustion. combustion creates water, that water comes out the tail pipe as a visible vapor sometimes.

[AE95]

Originally Posted by Bitter

ya, that motor wont last long with that water mixed in. you've already damaged the bearings, its a matter of time before one starts to spin and clunk or the heat stops working because the magic fix plugged up the heater core, you get hot spots and a warped head/block because the magic fix clogged cooling passages, or it completely overheats because the magic fix clogged the radiator. now, not only willl you need a new engine, but also radiator, hoses, heater hoses, and heater core. amazing what $10 can end up costing isnt it? everyone here said do not use it, and for good reason!

Hey bitter, thats all fine advice but it is not relevant to my situation.

This 1988 wagon has 250,000 kms on the clock and is a used import, which means it likely had its odometer wound back when imported and therefore has done even more ks. Not only that, the clutch is slipping, and it being a 4WD, a new clutch will cost around $900. All four tyres will not get through the next safety check. The back axle is not properly aligned, and while still within spec, it makes the car "crab" according to an alignment guy, and is uneconomic to fix. It causes the front tyres to wear out prematurely he said. Do you get the point? Two years ago I was undecided whether it was worth repairing. Now, 45,000 kms later, I'm certain it is not.

The car without a blown head-gasket would be worth about $1000, to fix the head gasket would cost about $1200, or a second-hand engine fitted about $1000, then the clutch $900, tyres $320. There is a very wide selection of good corollas in the $1500 - $2000 range.

You might like to google Chemiweld and read various forum accounts of people who have used it. Many have got another 10,000 to 25,000 kms from their engine. I found several users who then stripped the engine down and could find no trace of the substance in the water galleries and had no issues with fouled radiators or heater cores. One guy kept his blown gasket racing engine going for 6 more months. A friend actually recommended the stuff to me after his experience when his daughter's run-about blew its gasket. He put in Chemiweld and her engine lasted another four years of daily driving! That said, there are also a few forum accounts of people who chemiweld gave only a month's respite from the dreaded white clouds.

There definitely are all kinds of magic fixes out there, but technology is always improving and sooner or later there'll be a genuine permanent gasket repair in a bottle. Maybe Chemiweld is the closest thing to that.

Anyway, i've only done 50 kms so far, lol, I've got plenty of spare oil, I might splash out another $10 on a new filter and drain the watery oil out and then see how i go.

[Bitter]

we have the same stuff here in the states and its sold under alot of names, if you're not planning to keep the car then fine use it. but all those stop leak products DO cause problems later on which can add up to be very costly, believe me, i see cars with that crap in them often enough to know what it does to them and its not pretty.