Hello Toyota Nation. My First Post here. It is a long one. But I want to make sure I give you all the info you would need to help me with my question.
Over the weekend I picked up 91 Corolla Sedan. It has belonged to family friend for many years and she recently bought her first ever brand new car, another Toyota Corolla. She knew my son was starting college this fall and needed a car. The dealer had only offered her a few hundred dollars for it in trade-in, which she did not accept. She offered to sell it to my son for the same amount the dealership was offering as a trade-in.
She told me about the problems she knew of, which there were 3. Brake lights would not go off drained the battery, speedometer stopped working about 2 weeks earlier, and it was "leaking coolant". First two did not concern me. Brake lights would be a simple adjustment, or at worst replace the switch. And speedometer would most likely be a drive cable.
We went to look at the car this weekend. She showed me receipts where over the last 2 months she had replaced all the hoses, thermostat, clamps, belts, etc. Still says it was loosing radiator fluid. Checked all around under the hood looking for obvious signs of leakage and could not see any.
Checked dip stick to see if there was any foaming in the oil to indicate internal coolant leakage and found none. Oil color was not nice and honey colored so I knew she had not had a recent oil change that would hide any evidence, not that I suspected her of trying to trick me for a measly $300. She was truly trying to help my son.
Since brake lights had killed the battery I jumped it off with my truck and let it sit idling in the driveway for about 30 minutes. Every few minutes I was checking for any signs of leakage, could not see any. Decided to drive it around the block to see if getting it under load would induce a leak. We went on a 15 minute test drive with lots of starting and stopping. Got back to her house and looked and still no sign of a leak.
Since I could not see any evidence of internal or external leaking, I decided it was worth the risk to go ahead and purchase the car. Left the car running to keep charging the battery while we went inside to talk over the deal and fill out a bill or sale and title transfer. When we came back out, still no sign of a leak. Closed the hood and headed home.
My son drover the Corolla while I followed him in my truck. The drive home was less than 30 minutes and we got up to about the same speeds as the test drive, about 45 Mph. But it was less stop and go. When we got home I parked in the driveway while my son parked out in the Culdesac. I went inside while he proceeded to check out his new ride and show it to his buddy from down the street. A few minutes later he comes in and tells me it is leaking. I go back outside with him and as we approached the car I could hear water gurgling. Popped the hood and the overflow was roiling with bubbles and water was coming out the overflow hose onto the ground.
From reading here on the forums it sounds like a head gasket. The engine was off at that time. Could pressure that has already built up in the system make it keep bubbling for several minutes after the engine is shutoff?
I would think that if it was a head gasket it would have started leaking sooner. The idling, the test drive, and then more idling had the engine up to normal operating temps well before we ever went to leave. The one thing I did not do was have him turn on the ignition switch to see what the temperature gauge read.
I am hoping you tell me it is most likely a clogged radiator or stuck thermostat and that the bubbling was from the engine overheating. Cheaper and easier to replace a radiator than a head gasket!
Other ideas, suggestions, comments?
I am handy enough to fix the brake light switch and speedometer cable myself and even looked forward to using the repairs to teach my son about how to care for his car. But I am not handy enough to try and replace a head gasket myself. And I am not wanting to pay a garage over $1K to repair a $300 car. So if it is a head gasket I am going to check with the friend about getting a refund!
Check the electric fan to see that it comes on when temp gauge gets slightly above the center position. Check antifreeze, radiator and water pump To help verify whether head gasket try doing a compression test.
Usually there is water in the oil, or oil in the water with a blown head gasket alot of times the clylinders will fill with water and sound like a boat in the water when taking off. I'm sure theres other things that happen too but I've never seen a toyota 4 cylinder with a blown head gasket.
With how I drive sometimes, I'm surprised my head gasket has yet to go.
IMO, I say it's something that has to do with the cooling system, not a head gasket. For HG's, the engine would idle like crap if the gasket is blown between cylinders. OR you find oil in the coolant (or vice versa) but that could also mean a cracked block/ head or the radiator is cracked (if automatic).
So yea, a clog or the thermostat not opening like it should. Raises the coolant temp to a point where it expands and boils til overflow.
Thanks for the feed back guys. Glad to hear it is most likely cooling. I have not cranked it since getting it home and seeing the boiling. While it was idling in the driveway at the friends house I do remember the fan coming on. Her boyfriend is very auto unsavy. When he heard it come on he asked what it was and I remember telling him.
Thinking of starting out doing a radiator flush and fill it back with a clean 50/50 mixture? And maybe replacing the radiator cap? Also, how can I test the temp sensor for the fan to make sure it is coming on at the right temperature? I live in the south where we have mild winters. Should I just remove the thermostat for now?
radiator could be clogged, somebody could have used stop leak and clogged the radiator... or the water pump could go bad without leaking, though they usually do leak when they go bad and cause overheating.. if water is not leaking from the area of the block when it meets the head, or into the cylinders and on the spark plugs, I would check the radiator and wate rpump.
Does the water cirulate when the car is warm/hot? you can leave the radiator cap off, and let it run at idle. You should see the water circulate across the radiator, inside it...
Also, a bad theromstat can cause the coolant to boil over if it is not working correctly. In fact you may try to replace that first, it's cheap... and easy.. jsut make sure you don't leave an air pocket indie the cooling system. Some Toyota have a problem and can have an air pocket so the temp sensor doe snot read the temp correctly after working ont he cooling system..
Good Luck..
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1989 Toyota Corolla SR5, Carb.
1993 Camry LE
Last weekend I worked on the Corolla. My friend had told me she had the thermostat replaced in April. But, I went ahead and replaced it anyway. When I pulled the old one out it was discolored and the rubber gasket was hard. I do not think it was replaced, but I have the receipt where she paid for it. I think the garage may have charged her for a repair they did not do.
After changing the radiator cap we flushed the radiator and got lots of chunks of stuff out. Was red in color so assuming it was rust and scale. From what I could tell there was no oil in the fluid. Did not have any oil floating on water. I also replaced the radiator cap and replaced the brake light switch. car seemed to be in good shape.
Did not get Insurance on the car until middle of the week so we did not drive it until yesterday. Drove it around for awhile. I followed my son so that I could see if it starting dumping fluid onto the street. No signs of fluid. Temp gauge stayed below the middle of the range. Looks like two main problems down, one more to go.
Got creative about the broken odometer. Someone else may have already posted a solution like this, but a friend told me to do this. My Garmin GPS shows speed on the screen. I gave it to my son and he is using it for now. I will eventually repair the Speedo. But this will keep him from getting a ticket for now.
Now, here is the next problem that popped up. After driving around for awhile yesterday we went by Walmart where the sons girlfriend works. He wanted to surprise her. Before getting there we had stopped several places and each time the car cranked just fine. After going into Walmart the car would not turn over. Lights came on, radio played, etc. But starter would not turn. No clicking or noise while trying. Had him shift in and out of park to make sure a parking or neutral switch was not the problem. Just in case battery had enough juice for lights but not the starter, got out the jumper cables and tried it. It would not jump off.
My cables are old and could just barely reach since they are short. My truck has side terminal battery and these cables have always had trouble getting a good connection. So since we were at Walmart we went back into the store and purchased a new pair of long ones with the jaws that have the narrow part to work better on the side terminals. Would not jump off with these either. Looked for the starter and saw that it was on the back of the motor under the intake manifold. Oh joy, gonna be fun to change that!!
Called Autozone and went and bought a starter. By this time it is getting dark. So decide to head home and deal with it today. Went back today and the car cranked immediately. Shut it off and on several times and it kept cranking. Drove it home, still cranks.
So it is some kind of thermal issue. Can heat cause a starter to randomly fail? Afterwards I had to work for a few hours today. A co-worker said he had a bad battery cell cause a problem like this for him before on a Honda. Heat caused the battery to expand and the cell seperated. Then when it cooled it contracted and made contact again. My thinking was that if it was a bad cell in the battery the radio and lights would not have come on without the jumper cables. Am I correct in thinking that?
I have not installed the starter yet. Wanted to get any other suggestions you guys have to offer before deciding to replace the starter. No need to replace a part that may not be bad.
So it is some kind of thermal issue. Can heat cause a starter to randomly fail? Afterwards I had to work for a few hours today. A co-worker said he had a bad battery cell cause a problem like this for him before on a Honda. Heat caused the battery to expand and the cell seperated. Then when it cooled it contracted and made contact again. My thinking was that if it was a bad cell in the battery the radio and lights would not have come on without the jumper cables. Am I correct in thinking that?
I have not installed the starter yet. Wanted to get any other suggestions you guys have to offer before deciding to replace the starter. No need to replace a part that may not be bad.
I have this problem with both my corollas right now. Usually its worse when it's hot but today it didn't start when it was cold in the morning. I usually switch the key to the start position very rapidly and it will catch on. Don't do it too long tho otherwise your engine will flood and it will get hard to start once the starter kicks in. It is a common problem with these starters as I've had it happen to almost all my toyotas. It is the contacts inside the starter that start to wear and don't always work.
On the cooling problem, I've had a head gasket blow and force the coolant out via the overflow bottle simply from the cylinder pressure. This may or may not be your problem but I'm simply proving that this type of problem does exist. I ended up swapping the engine for a good used one.
Hello Toyota Nation. My First Post here. It is a long one. But I want to make sure I give you all the info you would need to help me with my question.
Over the weekend I picked up 91 Corolla Sedan. It has belonged to family friend for many years and she recently bought her first ever brand new car, another Toyota Corolla. She knew my son was starting college this fall and needed a car. The dealer had only offered her a few hundred dollars for it in trade-in, which she did not accept. She offered to sell it to my son for the same amount the dealership was offering as a trade-in.
She told me about the problems she knew of, which there were 3. Brake lights would not go off drained the battery, speedometer stopped working about 2 weeks earlier, and it was "leaking coolant". First two did not concern me. Brake lights would be a simple adjustment, or at worst replace the switch. And speedometer would most likely be a drive cable.
We went to look at the car this weekend. She showed me receipts where over the last 2 months she had replaced all the hoses, thermostat, clamps, belts, etc. Still says it was loosing radiator fluid. Checked all around under the hood looking for obvious signs of leakage and could not see any.
Checked dip stick to see if there was any foaming in the oil to indicate internal coolant leakage and found none. Oil color was not nice and honey colored so I knew she had not had a recent oil change that would hide any evidence, not that I suspected her of trying to trick me for a measly $300. She was truly trying to help my son.
Since brake lights had killed the battery I jumped it off with my truck and let it sit idling in the driveway for about 30 minutes. Every few minutes I was checking for any signs of leakage, could not see any. Decided to drive it around the block to see if getting it under load would induce a leak. We went on a 15 minute test drive with lots of starting and stopping. Got back to her house and looked and still no sign of a leak.
Since I could not see any evidence of internal or external leaking, I decided it was worth the risk to go ahead and purchase the car. Left the car running to keep charging the battery while we went inside to talk over the deal and fill out a bill or sale and title transfer. When we came back out, still no sign of a leak. Closed the hood and headed home.
My son drover the Corolla while I followed him in my truck. The drive home was less than 30 minutes and we got up to about the same speeds as the test drive, about 45 Mph. But it was less stop and go. When we got home I parked in the driveway while my son parked out in the Culdesac. I went inside while he proceeded to check out his new ride and show it to his buddy from down the street. A few minutes later he comes in and tells me it is leaking. I go back outside with him and as we approached the car I could hear water gurgling. Popped the hood and the overflow was roiling with bubbles and water was coming out the overflow hose onto the ground.
From reading here on the forums it sounds like a head gasket. The engine was off at that time. Could pressure that has already built up in the system make it keep bubbling for several minutes after the engine is shutoff?
I would think that if it was a head gasket it would have started leaking sooner. The idling, the test drive, and then more idling had the engine up to normal operating temps well before we ever went to leave. The one thing I did not do was have him turn on the ignition switch to see what the temperature gauge read.
I am hoping you tell me it is most likely a clogged radiator or stuck thermostat and that the bubbling was from the engine overheating. Cheaper and easier to replace a radiator than a head gasket!
Other ideas, suggestions, comments?
I am handy enough to fix the brake light switch and speedometer cable myself and even looked forward to using the repairs to teach my son about how to care for his car. But I am not handy enough to try and replace a head gasket myself. And I am not wanting to pay a garage over $1K to repair a $300 car. So if it is a head gasket I am going to check with the friend about getting a refund!
My response:
hahahah lemme tell you ITS NOT THE HEAD GASKET!!! i just got that replaced this weekend and that darn cost me $650 just to get that darn $30 thing replaced...if it was the head gasket it would be leaking oil, which my car did until i replaced it...dude just go replace the radiator i got a lifetime warranty one from auto zone for $110 and installed that myself its as easy as unclamping the 2 radiator tubes unplugging the thermostat unclamping the 2 oil lines running on the bottom of the radiator unplugging the fan unbolting the 2 radiator supports on its top and taking it out unbolting the fan and putting it on the new fand and the reverse of that installation procedure i gave you... i did it and it took me like 2 hours by myself so change it...oh and be ready to put in some new antifreeze and do this where the mess of the antifreeze wont get on your garage,driveway, grass etc... i did this beside the curb of my home where the antifreeze runs off not on my dad's house...if u need info on how to do stuff i got the repair manual specific for the AE92... oh and if it leaked and there was too much coolant the engine gets rid of extra coolant by throwing it out through the small black hose you described but i doubt thats your case glad i could be of help brother im just happy to tell of what ive experienced after owning and loving my AE92 =) oh and PS i think its strange that the oil is a weird color if its a color like coffee with creamer that DOES mean coolant got mixed in the oil, which means what ive said on the top portion is wrong...but just to be sure its the head gasket change the oil yourself then have your son drive it and see if the oil changes color soon and if its starting to change color as above described again, for sure its the head gasket and come on my radiator got busted a year ago the original toyota one so dont hope yours will last much more if its still the original one lol wow my radiator lasted 18 years!
Go to toyota and buy two solenoid contacts. They are inexpensive and since you have to pull starter anyway it's worth a try. They are a very common Toy issue. If that fixes it you will have a much better starter than the rebuilt Autozone unit. Here is a link for general info:
hahahah lemme tell you ITS NOT THE HEAD GASKET!!! i just got that replaced this weekend and that darn cost me $650 just to get that darn $30 thing replaced...if it was the head gasket it would be leaking oil,
My response:
Don't be so sure.
A blown head gasket can manifest itself in several different ways, and doesn't necessarily have to leak oil.
Here are possible symptoms:
1) Water in your oil, giving a milky colour to your oil.
2) Oil in your water, some times first seen in your plastic overflow tank, as a dark scum on top of the coolant.
3) White vapors from your exhaust and funny smell, sometimes even droplets.
4) Rough idle, sometimes accompanied with white exhaust vapor and funny smell.
5) High coolant tempreature.
6) Very high coolant tempreature, resulting in boil-over.
7) Over pressurization of your cooling system resulting in boil-over, without a high tempreature.
8) Excessive crank case venting, resulting in a lot of oil fumes and smell.
9) Fouling spark plugs, possibly accompanied by rough idle, and or blue smoke.
Any one of these symptoms by itself, could indicate a blown head gasket. All depending where it blows (between which galleries)
High pressure oil to coolant, will give you oil in your coolant.
Coolant to low pressure oil, will give you coolant in your oil.
Cylinder to low pressure oil, crankcase venting and fumes. (This could also be rings)
High oil pressure to cylinder, could give you plug fouling and or blue smoke. (This could also indicate rings or valve stem seals)
Coolant to cylinder (which is what you could possibly have) could give you the exact symptoms you are experiencing, or (4), (5) and (6) listed above
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'88 Corolla, AE92 SR-5, 7A-FE swap/GT-S suspension
'87 Corolla, AE82 FX-16, 4A-GZE swap (autocrosser)
'03 Tundra 4X4 Access Cab, (FX tow vehicle/Home Depot runner)
Modification: Changing something to what you thought it should have been from the start!
A blown head gasket can manifest itself in several different ways, and doesn't necessarily have to leak oil.
Here are possible symptoms:
1) Water in your oil, giving a milky colour to your oil.
2) Oil in your water, some times first seen in your plastic overflow tank, as a dark scum on top of the coolant.
3) White vapors from your exhaust and funny smell, sometimes even droplets.
4) Rough idle, sometimes accompanied with white exhaust vapor and funny smell.
5) High coolant tempreature.
6) Very high coolant tempreature, resulting in boil-over.
7) Over pressurization of your cooling system resulting in boil-over, without a high tempreature.
8) Excessive crank case venting, resulting in a lot of oil fumes and smell.
9) Fouling spark plugs, possibly accompanied by rough idle, and or blue smoke.
Any one of these symptoms by itself, could indicate a blown head gasket. All depending where it blows (between which galleries)
High pressure oil to coolant, will give you oil in your coolant.
Coolant to low pressure oil, will give you coolant in your oil.
Cylinder to low pressure oil, crankcase venting and fumes. (This could also be rings)
High oil pressure to cylinder, could give you plug fouling and or blue smoke. (This could also indicate rings or valve stem seals)
Coolant to cylinder (which is what you could possibly have) could give you the exact symptoms you are experiencing, or (4), (5) and (6) listed above
I can see the starter getting heatsoaked, the GTS is known for this problem.
My old GTS used to do this all the time as I would drive on the highway for a while then parked it and it wouldn't start until it cooled, but eventually the starter went and I replaced it with a spare and the problem was gone.
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Possible head gasket
glad i could be of help brother im just happy to tell of what ive experienced after owning and loving my AE92 =) oh and PS i think its strange that the oil is a weird color if its a color like coffee with creamer that DOES mean coolant got mixed in the oil, which means what ive said on the top portion is wrong...but just to be sure its the head gasket change the oil yourself then have your son drive it and see if the oil changes color soon and if its starting to change color as above described again, for sure its the head gasket and come on my radiator got busted a year ago the original toyota one so dont hope yours will last much more if its still the original one lol wow my radiator lasted 18 years!
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