P0330 -Knock Sensor 2 Circuit Bank 2 - Toyota Nation Forum : Toyota Car and Truck Forums


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1st Generation (1995-1999) Specific discussion of the first generation Toyota Avalon

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Old 09-26-2007, 08:41 AM   #1 (permalink)
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P0330 -Knock Sensor 2 Circuit Bank 2

With the "check engine light", I have been having this code for some time. My mechanic (non dealer) led me to believe it may be related an internal engine sensor. With some internet searches I discovered the engine sludge Class Action Suit and called the help number.

Toyota ended up with two people on the line who seemed very helpful. The net was, hey, this was not related to sludge NOR taking the engine apart, just a simple O2 sensor 2 on Bank 2. Replace that. So we did, for US$200.

Same engine check light. Same P0330 Knock Sensor 2 Circuit Bank 2. NOW WHAT? I can't get inspected in North Carolina.

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Old 09-27-2007, 11:12 AM   #2 (permalink)
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The P0330 code is for the knock sensor on the left bank. Each cylinder bank has one.

The sensor has a short, open circuit, is loose or there is an issue with the wiring. The ECU via the trouble code is indicating it cannot read any sensor output.

The 02 sensor is not related to the knock sensor, they are completely differant sensors and in differant areas of the engine. The knock sensors are screwed into the engine, the 02 sensors are located on the exhaust system.

Are you sure the dealer did not replaced the knock sensor, do you have the old part to look at? Did the dealer read the code then replace the sensor?

Last edited by toyomoho; 09-27-2007 at 11:14 AM.
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Old 09-27-2007, 01:00 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Thank you for the response.

As I indicated, Toyota on the phone said, "Oh, this is not related to sludge problems; it is just an O2 sensor. Get that replaced. No need to take the engine apart either."

My mechanic used a Denso DNO234-4061 in Bank 2 Sensor 2. On the invoice there's an additional number of "01226 13-72186". But, engine check light keeps coming back on and the same P0330 Knock Sensor 2 Circuit Bank 2 code reads out of the computer.

(1) is it possible that he didn't put the right sensor in or in the right place?
(2) is it possible that there's a broken connection between the sensor and the computer?
(3) is it possible that the computer is malfunctioning?
(4) is it possible that Toyota was anxious to steer me away from the class action suit over the sludge issue to "just replace the O2 sensor"?


How can I be sure what's really failing?
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Old 09-27-2007, 01:11 PM   #4 (permalink)
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# 1, have you done anything to your car? (mod)
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Old 09-27-2007, 02:06 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Only as follows, otherwise factory original.

My mechanic used a Denso DNO234-4061 in Bank 2 Sensor 2. On the invoice there's an additional number of "01226 13-72186". But, engine check light keeps coming back on and the same P0330 Knock Sensor 2 Circuit Bank 2 code reads out of the computer.
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Old 09-27-2007, 02:51 PM   #6 (permalink)
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looks like it's not even was the 02 sensor problem. if p0330 if knock sensor, then the thing should be replace is knock sensor, NOT the 02 sensor.

Also, sludge is really has nothing to do with either 02 or knock sensor.

By telling of what you wrote, seems toyota gave u out fasle info to get u to replace the 02 sensor.
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Old 09-27-2007, 05:04 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Perhaps the Toyota dealer was confused by the term Sensor 2, Bank 2. The 02 sensor locations are referred to by sensor number and bank (cylinder bank); such as Bank 1, Sensor 1. Did the Toyota dealer or who ever replaced the sensor actually read the codes via a code reader?

As pervious members have stated, sludge issues have nothing to do with either of these sensors or their operation. If you think you have sludge have a cylinder valve cover removed and inspect for sludge formations on the valve train. Do not think Toyota would steer you away for the sludge issue but never know. What leads to think the engine has a sludge problem, millions of engines were produced and only a small quantity have sludge issues.

For some reason it appears a 02 sensor was replaced instead of the knock sensor. The ECU codes are very specific and the computer will not give a knock sensor code if the issue is 02 sensor or vise versa. If the wires to these sensors were broken the computer would still give the appropriate code.

Computers do fail but never heard of one giving the wrong codes. The knock sensor can be tested. If you have the old part it can also be tested for proper operation.
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Old 09-27-2007, 05:26 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Someone somewhere is confused. This should take seconds for a competent technician to figure out.
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Old 09-28-2007, 07:55 AM   #9 (permalink)
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P0330

Well, I clearly got mis-info from the Toyota "help line". I DID question if the O2 replacement made sense, and so did my mechanic. But, we were both willing to try it, as it is less invasive and cheaper than the Knock sensor. But, obviously, it was stupid.

Now, the question is: what knock sensor? I have searched the parts lists on the web, and there appear to be THREE different replacement Knock sensors for 1996 Toyota Avalons. Two of the parts IM lines were unable to identify which, and referred me to "my" Toyota dealer.

My experience with three local dealers early-on was poor, so for years I have avoided them with both Avalons, doing all maintenance with mechanics with whom you can talk, interact and pay less agressive prices. I may have to suck up and go Toyota now, I guess.
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Old 09-28-2007, 08:09 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toyfortwo View Post
Well, I clearly got mis-info from the Toyota "help line". I DID question if the O2 replacement made sense, and so did my mechanic. But, we were both willing to try it, as it is less invasive and cheaper than the Knock sensor. But, obviously, it was stupid.

Now, the question is: what knock sensor? I have searched the parts lists on the web, and there appear to be THREE different replacement Knock sensors for 1996 Toyota Avalons. Two of the parts IM lines were unable to identify which, and referred me to "my" Toyota dealer.

My experience with three local dealers early-on was poor, so for years I have avoided them with both Avalons, doing all maintenance with mechanics with whom you can talk, interact and pay less agressive prices. I may have to suck up and go Toyota now, I guess.
You may want to look into finding a new mechanic. I don't really get why he would follow the advice of someone from an 800 help line and replace a completely unrelated component to the code that is clearly present in the system memory.

You need to find a technician, be it at a dealer or otherwise. OBDII codes do not indicate which part has failed and needs replacing; it tells you what system is failing, and it is up to a human with an understanding of modern EFI principles do determine where the fault lies. It needs to be diagnosed.

In this case, I would put a fair amount of money that the problem does not lie with the knock sensor. Piezo-electric crystals like those used for knock detection are extremely durable, and I can't remember the last time I found one that had failed. Your problem most likely lies with the wiring between the sensor and the computer. By generating PO330, the computer is trying to tell you that it is not receiving a signal from the sensor located in bank 2. This does not mean replace the sensor, it means someone has to figure out why the computer can't see anything from the 2nd knock sensor.
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Old 09-28-2007, 08:32 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Hmmmmmmm.......... Now that all makes real good sense.

One more question: Once the computer is reset, it takes about a 30 minutes of driving for the check engine light to come on again. Is that consistent with the possibility of a connection failure rather than a sensor failure?

Gee, if it is the connection between sensor and computer......then there is (1) just some potential that tightening or something can be done or (2) that the wire/cable can be replaced..... I like the sound of that. Anything to keep from taking the engine apart for $500+ or more.

And a Toyota Tech would be the best one to know where those connections are made and where the wire runs.
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Old 09-28-2007, 09:48 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toyfortwo View Post
Hmmmmmmm.......... Now that all makes real good sense.

One more question: Once the computer is reset, it takes about a 30 minutes of driving for the check engine light to come on again. Is that consistent with the possibility of a connection failure rather than a sensor failure?
There are a certain number of parameters that need to be satisfied before the computer determines whether or not there is a problem (these are called OBDII "monitors"). The knock sensor monitor fails when there is no signal from the sensor. The only way to figure out why is to diagnose it.



Quote:
And a Toyota Tech would be the best one to know where those connections are made and where the wire runs.
Yeah, usually, but keep in mind that the quality of the work lies directly on the shoulder of the person doing it, not what is on the front of the building. There are plenty of smart independent techs out there that are capable of fixing most problems on modern cars. The main benefit of taking it to the dealer is the inherent obligation that they have to fix Toyotas. At a dealer there shouldn't ever be an excuse for not being able to fix a car that comes in the door, and you'll always have some sort of recourse with the service manager if something goes wrong. The big letters on the front of the building mean that the service dept. does not have the option of blowing a customer off as an independent owner can.
But anyway, find a good technician, and cling to him. If you take your car to a shop and it gets fixed right the first time, go meet the guy that did the work, ask for his name, and see that he tends to your car the next time around.
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