Arrrrggghhh! Tranny drain and fill

[buchaja]

What is the deal with reading the correct transmission fluid level on my '03?

After threatening for about a year, I woke up today and decided it was time to do it: change my tranny fluid. O'Reilly's said my car took 5 quarts, so that's what I bought.

Spilled all over my driveway, naturally, but I drained what looked to be about 3 quarts out. Because I've never gotten a good read on the dipstick (NEVER!), and the Haynes manual said 5 quarts in one section and 3.7 in another, I put the entire gallon jug of new stuff back in.

Tried to read the level, again, got the same results: fluid all over the dip stick.

Called local Toyota mechanic. He said I probably overfilled and that this car takes about 3 quarts.

I said "screw it!" Drove around, cautiously to see how it felt with 4 quarts of fresh fluid. It is quieter and smoother! Yay!

Am I, or more specifically my Avalon, screwed?

Be gentle. This is my first time (with an automatic).

[buchaja]

OK. There are a few apparently following this, so I'll provide some more info for anyone searching for tips on getting the level right on a transmission "spill and fill" for a second gen Avalon.

I have no advice on when you should do this maintenance procedure on your car, only that it should be done per Toyota's recomendation. You decide when, and I'll tell you how I did mine. (I am also leaving the choice of fluid up to you. I used O'Reilly's and it was cheap - cheaper than an oil change for me, which I also do myself. You can use what I did or go with the synthetic, or disconnect the line to the radiator and do a complete flush if you're so inclined, I don't care.)

So, first things first: I put my car up on ramps. Please don't do the cinder block or the supermarket crate thing for a cheap ramp. If you don't have ramps, borrow some. Or get jack stands. I bought a pair of jack stands from Harbor Freight for around $12 with a coupon. Just don't risk your life over something as silly as a car's transmission.

My driveway is sloped down towards the street. So when I back in and us the ramps under the front wheels my car sits mostly level. This is what you want for a proper drain. Otherwise, on a level drive, I guess you'll have to use 4 stands.

I measured what I drained off yesterday and it was exactly 3 quarts. Just like an oil change, all you do is remove the transmission dip-stick to get a good flow (I just pulled mine out slightly and left it sitting in the tube). Then you can remove the drain plug using a 10mm hex wrench. Of course, make sure you have a pan underneath to catch the fluid. Oh, I did this hot too just like when I do my engine oil.

I said yesterday that had spilled fluid all over my driveway. That was slight exaggeration. I did have the presence of mind to place a large peice of cardboard down under the car before I started, so it caught most of the spilled oil which was from splatter coming out of the pan. If anyone knows how to reduce this please let us know.

OK. Now replace the drain plug. Tighten accordingly - mine is simply hand tight.

Refill the transmission through the dip stick. My transmission dipstick is orange to differentiate it from the engine oil dip stick which is yellow. It is also toward the front of the engine and a little off towards the driver's side. The engine oil dipstick is to the left of that towards the passenger side.

Now, at this point I put in the entire 4qt. jug, or a gallon of tranny fluid. This is too much. You only need about 3 - slightly less if my experience is correct. This is where I have always had problems. I could never get a good read on the transmission level in this car.

Here's what I was doing; trying to read the level when the engine and transmission was fully up to normal operating temp, in other words HOT.

When looking at the dipstick in this manner I NEVER got an accurate reading. The oil was splashed all over the dipstick, well above the full/hot mark making me wonder if it was overfilled.

So, last night I siphoned off 1 and a half qts. because of my conversation with the tech at the Toyota dealership and my accurate reading of what I had drained out.

Reading the level with the engine off - not the way you're supposed to - the dipstick said I was at the hot level (high mark) So, this was after putting in 4 qts, and siphoning off 1 and a half. If my math is correct, this means I put in 2 and a half quarts of fluid total.

Instead of trying again to read the fluid, I decided to let the car sit overnight and check it in the morning. Success! This is when I think I finally got an accurate reading.

I checked first before I started the car. The level was right where it had been last night, at the high/HOT level. I started the car thinking that maybe the level would go down from being pumped through the transmission, and that is exactly what happened. The fluid was at the lowest (COLD) mark and I could actually read it clearly. There was still some splash up higher, and well above, the HOT upper mark, but clearly the level was visible on my dipstick for the first time!

This was done in my garage, on level ground with the engine running and after putting the transmission through all gears. No ramps or jack stands necessary.

So, my summary:

My Avalon's transmisson fluid can only be accurately checked when the car is cold. And on level ground.

You don't need more than 3 quarts (and probably a little less) to refill a drained transmission on our gen 3's.

If you can change your own oil, you can change your transmission fluid (If you want arguments about whether I really changed my transmission fluid or only refreshed it take it somewhere else. I really don't care). It's cheap and easy - if a little messy.


I'm tired of typing...

edit: PS. Go SLOWLY when refilling through the dipstick tube. I got a little impatient and fluid overflowed the tube and ran down the engine bay. This was by far the biggest spill I had. Try not to get too much in your funnel at any given time.

[Capt_Spiff]

While reading your post I felt like I was standing there watching you. And I concur that the Avalon tranny dip stick is the worst to read accurately out of all the vehicles I've owned.

The secret as you said is to check the car on level ground, tranny cold, and engine idleing. The problem is not just the splashing in the pan/sump. I've found the real problem is the oil coating the inside of the dip stick tube, drains back down and coats the stick. Then the more times you check it, the more fluid you have pulled up onto the tube walls, which gives you a fake reading. After 3 trys you may as well walk away, as the fluid is now shows 2 inches higher on the stick than actual.

My solution to this (i just posted this earlier today) is to measure what I drain out, then only replace that amount. Pretty easy as you said, and not too far off from the book numbers. The book says I should expect 3.7 qts from a simple drain, and I get about 3.25 (+/- 8oz) probably because my driveway slopes left as well as down.

I also have the 2003 and you only mention the pan drain plug. This is where most of the fluid comes from, however there is a second drain plug on the diff. You'll get about half a quart from that. Both pan sump & diff sump are filled via the tranny dip stick tube.

I'm with you, it's easier that an oil change. But reading that damn dip stick,... arrrrrgggh!!!!!

[buchaja]

Thanks for the feedback Capt.

I did not know about the other drain plug.

I remember reading somewhere that the transmission and differential are combined in our cars and that they call it a transaxle. Maybe it's the same for all front wheel drive cars. Next time I change it I'll get more of the old fluid out.

Interestingly, I am getting about 10% better fuel mileage now. And even though it may be my mind playing tricks on me (though I doubt it with the increased mileage), the car feels like it coasts easier; less "parasitic losses" or drag.

I wonder what synthetic fluid would do.