2008 Avalon or 2007 ES350 - Toyota Nation Forum : Toyota Car and Truck Forums

confuzzled · 01-30-2011, 09:34 PM

Hi everyone, I could use your opinions.
I am considering buying a used 2008 Avalon with 30 - 40,000 miles on it.
For about the same price I can also buy a 2007 Lexus ES350 with about the same milage on it. Is there much of a difference in insurance and maintenance
(Toyota verses Lexus dealer maintenance / parts & labour charges)? Is it true that the ES350 is built in Japan? Is there that much of a difference between how these two cars drive / ride / handle / brake? I haven't driven either yet, and have just started looking on the internet before I head to the dealers. I guess I would like to hear why someone choose a Avalon over the ES350 or a ES350 over the Avalon. I guess that I am kind torn between the two as I like the size of the Av but I also like the more modern look of the ES. So all your thoughts, experiences and input would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks

***Tom in Tacoma*** · 01-30-2011, 10:31 PM

A couple of things that come to mind are; the ES350 is based on the Camry not the Avalon (with the Avalon you'll get a larger car with much more room), it's recommended to run premium fuel in the ES350, regular fuel in the Avalon (over the life of the of the car that will amount to quite a cost difference).

Both cars are considered 'near-luxury' and offer similar creature comforts and features. Why not get a more roomy car with lower operating costs?

AVA1 · 01-31-2011, 06:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by confuzzled

Hi everyone, I could use your opinions.
I am considering buying a used 2008 Avalon with 30 - 40,000 miles on it.
For about the same price I can also buy a 2007 Lexus ES350 with about the same milage on it. Is there much of a difference in insurance and maintenance
(Toyota verses Lexus dealer maintenance / parts & labour charges)? Is it true that the ES350 is built in Japan? Is there that much of a difference between how these two cars drive / ride / handle / brake? I haven't driven either yet, and have just started looking on the internet before I head to the dealers. I guess I would like to hear why someone choose a Avalon over the ES350 or a ES350 over the Avalon. I guess that I am kind torn between the two as I like the size of the Av but I also like the more modern look of the ES. So all your thoughts, experiences and input would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks

confuzzled

I to am In the market for a Avalon. At this moment I'm driving a 04 Lexus GS300, that I love everything about. In the past my wife had leased a 2004 ES330, and when that lease was up we got into a 2008 ES350. I can tell you that the Avalon's that I have seen and driven (all have been touring models) drive just like the ES350, the 04 ES330 had a softer ride "not by much mind you". I do know that the shop cost for a Lexus Dealer Ship is more than that of a Toyota's brand, even that they are both the same product. I do know that the Insurance is a little bit more for the ES's in my personal case.

The funny thing for us back in 08 before her lease was up, we looked into the Avalon, the day that we when to drive it we showed up to the dealer just a little bit late, I think that the sales guy thought that we where just wanted to go for a joy ride so we where told that since it was so late in the after noon he couldn't get the key for the car that was blocking the Avalon. So we were like what a lame excuse, and did a deal on the 08 ES350, mind you the two dealers are side by side we literally walked off the Toyota lot, and onto the Lexus lot.

You will have to look into the OP cost for the ES vs. Avalon, but I can tell you that the Insurance is a little bit more, shop rates are more, and yes the ES does take premium. look at this way the Lexus is a "premium" brand/product that doesn't mean that you getting more for your money. With the Avalon you will save some money, but in some peoples eyes the "L" on both ends of the car makes the difference.

So at the end of the say its up to you

StoreKeeper · 01-31-2011, 07:12 AM

I'm getting a 2011 Avalon and wonder what body frame they share comapred to Lexus?

I drove the CTV,G37 Sedan and the Acura TL and found that the Avalon was the best in romm and overall comfort.

Any time I hear "Sport Supension" I think Rough Ride

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tom in Tacoma

A couple of things that come to mind are; the ES350 is based on the Camry not the Avalon (with the Avalon you'll get a larger car with much more room), it's recommended to run premium fuel in the ES350, regular fuel in the Avalon (over the life of the of the car that will amount to quite a cost difference).

Both cars are considered 'near-luxury' and offer similar creature comforts and features. Why not get a more roomy car with lower operating costs?

AML · 01-31-2011, 08:27 AM

What trim level/options are on the Avalon and the ES? Comparing these two cars, I think the trim and options are going to be the deciding factors for me. Both cars are similar in comfort, refinement, and luxury. Although the Avalon is a much larger car.

grandpapa · 01-31-2011, 11:01 AM

the avalon vs ES probably comes up to everyone's mind (at least twice for us in the last 9 months)

Anyway, if you are visiting the toyota forum here, most of us will tell you avalon has better value, lower cost to fix.... compares to Lexus forum, owners will say better build, nicer finish....

In my case, 9 months ago, we checked out 06 Limited vs 05 ES (assume your 08 vs 07 is pretty much the same). I picked 06 Limited because of the rear seat space, fully loaded features vs the ES. 2 months ago, I checked out 05 Limited vs 05 ES again. Once again, I picked Avalon even though the ES actually has less miles and cost only $1500 more at Lexus dealership.

If you want the nicer experience, go with Lexus, from sales, waiting room, to service. Just remember it comes with higher cost. If you compare VALUE, Avalon has better features, lower insurance and easier to sell in the future (just my opinion). If someone sidewipe my car, small scratch, I probably feel terrible on the Lexus over Toyota. They are both pretty good but for me, I really need the comfort of the back seat since I carry folks around. Key factor

In here, we all (almost all?) pick the Avalon, but again, if you visit Lexus forum, they pick ES

They both are good cars just a matter of what you really looking for.

StoreKeeper · 01-31-2011, 02:04 PM

The Avalon and Lexus what model share the same frame?

confuzzled · 01-31-2011, 05:06 PM

I know that it is a matter of personal taste in the end, but I keep wondering if there really is a premium in a premium brand such as Lexus verses Toyota or is this all just another clever marketing ploy that promises inclusion or a step up because you drive a Lexus instead of a mere Toyota product. I being a (somewhat) humble, hardworking consumer am more loyal to my wallet then to any car manufacturer and in the end I am not really interested in designer labels or automotive snobbery. I am however interested in getting the best / most for my money and if someone can prove to me that the Es350 is a better car than the Avalon then that is what I would look more seriously at. By better I mean build quality, materials / parts used, design, performance and overall reliability. Purchase cost is not as big of a factor because I intend to buy used and therefore there is not as big of a price difference.

***Tom in Tacoma*** · 01-31-2011, 05:12 PM

Then based on what you just said I would definately recommend going with the Avalon. That "L" badge costs too much (in my mind).

StoreKeeper · 01-31-2011, 05:27 PM

Is the ES350 the same frame that a Avalon is built on, just a different body on top of the frame?

AML · 01-31-2011, 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StoreKeeper

Is the ES350 the same frame that a Avalon is built on, just a different body on top of the frame?

The ES350 shares the same platform as the Camry. I believe the Avalon is on its own frame this generation (if not, it's pretty modified/reengineered).

Like I said earlier, the deciding factors for me would be the options and trim level of both vehicles. If it was the ES350 Ultra Luxury w/ nav, HID, panoramic roof, rear sunshade, Mark Levinson etc. I would get the ES over the Avalon (including the Limited).

If it was just a moderately equipped ES350 with just navigation, Mark Levinson and none of the other options, I would get the Avalon Limited.

Material quality may be a little better in the ES350. Does the Avalon have real wood? I also can't remember if the ES350 uses semi-aniline leather or not. The average person may not care about this stuff, but it's something personally I would notice. Sound deadening quality may be equal because both these cars are built around the same price point.

AVA1 · 02-01-2011, 05:34 AM

Its funny only until recently the "Lexus" brand only existed here in the States. Originally in the early 90's that was done to justify the offset in price. Because in Japan and the rest of the world there only existed one brand. For example my "Lexus GS300" is know though out the rest of the world as a "Toyota Aristo".

grandpapa · 02-01-2011, 10:23 AM

I suggest you visit the Lexus forum to see how users view/pick their Lexus over Toyota.

From what I read so far, sounds like you value your wallet just like most of us here so really you know pretty much everyone here will tell you to pick the Avalon. However, I do think you have your eyes on the ES. Why don't you compares both in person, drive them and see what you like. You mentioned $ is not the factory so it makes it even easier.

User review can only give you so much, you have to try it out yourself and see which car will best fit your style. Not knowing what you drive right now, I also suggest you to check out both Lexus and Toyota dealership. The experience is totally different.

AML · 02-01-2011, 11:32 AM

Don't forget that even if you do get the Lexus that you can still easily get it serviced at your Toyota dealer. I used to work for a Toyota dealer and we always got Lexus's (ALL models) come in for services. Only when the services were major and Lexus specific did our customers go across the street to the Lexus dealer.

confuzzled · 02-01-2011, 09:40 PM

Usually I will stick with dealer maintenance until the drive train's warranty is up and then use an independent mechanic for some work and do some of the maintence myself but I am getting kind of tired of being Mr. Fixit and will probably hand over more of the work to a mechanic, dealer or independent.
I would be curious to know the difference in hourly shop rates between Toyota and Lexus. Does any of you know what it is?