Honest question-- Why are you interested in AE86s/GTS's?

[Jeff_R]

I am noticing the popularity in the last year with 85-87 Corolla GTS's.

Can someone explain something to me?
I always thought the main reason the Corolla's were great was due to the car being inexpensive, rear wheel drive, and reliable.

The car today only meets 1 one of the these 3 selling points.

Expensive
It is very difficult to find a nice Corolla for less then $3000. Most of the time you will spend $3000-5000 for a non-rusty, non-abused, clean example. This does not include all the parts you will be forced to replace on this 15+ year old car.

Rear wheel drive
Still has it.

Reliable
Most Corolla owners will tell you these are not that reliable. It is by no means a Honda where you can put oil in it and ignore it. If you replace every worn part, monitor oil temps, and are constantly proactive on every problem, yes...it can be reliable. The average person does not possess these skills which can make the car a complete headache.


This is the thing I don't understand. Why does everyone want one now? 5-6 years ago no one cared except true hardcore enthusiast that knew what the car possessed. I was checking out this site today and saw so many post concerning this car which totally baffles me. Does anyone understand...
-This car has a straight beam axle
-This car has a chassis that flexes. To make it stiff you need to spot weld, cage, or put self expanding foam between the panels and frame.
-The car has 80s technology.
-The car rust easily.
-You can blow headgaskets constantly if you don't watch the heat.
-The cars are loud and squeak constantly inside.
So why am I seeing these cars go for $5000+ and all of the attention all of a sudden?
At first I thought it was the whole drifting thing but that makes no sense. I saw nice Levin's and Treuno's on every page of my old Option and Car Boy magazines back in the mid 90s. I showed pics of the car and pointed them out to many people and all I got was...."EWW, that car is ugly." "Yuck, why would you want that 80s pile?"
So all the people that want one right now...why do you want it?
-Please do not answer "to be different" because that contridicts everything I see right now...everyone wants one.
-Why not a Porsche 944 for instance? They are reliable, inexpensive to fix, don't rust, built as a true sports car, and a great perfomance car. You can get a nice one for 4-5K. I have 3 friends that own them and they've had 0 problems.
-If you only want a hatchback model, why is this? The coupes are stiffer and ligher and hatchback's squeak like hell.

I am thinking it may be due to "Drifting" or that cartoon "Initial D." What do you guys think? Is this a fad or is it staying? How many of these cars are actually being drifted regularily and how many are being used as show peices or the "I have a AE86 and I spend $3000 on Jubiride fender flares, Levin front end, and deep dish rimes to make it look like a drift machine....but I've never actually did it." If this is the case, why not pick something different if used as a show queen? This car begs to be tossed around in the mountains and reved the piss out of....not sitting on carpet at a show. Again...this car is not a classic Ferrari.

Since the Japanese guys drift pretty much everything, why not get something else? They drift heavy 4 door cars like Cefiro's, Celsior's, Soarers, and Mark 2s, and they are all 3000lb+. Why not just get a manual 5.0 Mustang and drift? It's cheap, RWD, has torque, lots of replacement parts, and could drift quite well. Are you more interested in actually drifting or just looking like you play the part?

Just wondering...I've never seen so much attention all of a sudden for a car that was rarely noticed before.

[Flashmn]

Why dont you study automotive technology some more

This car has a chassis that flexes. To make it stiff you need to spot weld, cage, or put self expanding foam between the panels and frame. <- Chassis flex still exists in cars, HONDAS being one of the most Flexy cars. Problem with flexy cars is the harder your suspension gets, the more it uses the frame as suspension, hence you start getting squeeks in the frame. Modern cars are however computer planned so you see the stresspoints, but some are stiffer than others. Like mercedes is scary with its chassis stiffness, you can feel it inside that it doesnt flex much, while a civic you can really feel the flex.

Reliable
Most Corolla owners will tell you these are not that reliable. It is by no means a Honda where you can put oil in it and ignore it <- Well its also a car thats almost 20 years older than a honda. No wonder most hondas are in such a shitty condition when owners just put in some oil and ignores the rest of the car. Thats not proper way to treat your car. If you are an enthusiast you'd know. I've seen more hondas in the side of the road than corollas that are the same age, I'd say toyota makes alot more reliable cars.


Expensive
It is very difficult to find a nice Corolla for less then $3000. <- Well depends where you look, and you gotta understand a 20year old car has ofcourse problems due to its age, I'd like to see you find a equal aged civic with any less problems. I bought my corolla for 2500 with 36000km on it, it was in GOOD shape.

This is the thing I don't understand. Why does everyone want one now? 5-6 years ago no one cared except true hardcore enthusiast that knew what the car possessed. <- No one wanted a civic 20 years ago either. Yet now they're the most riced up car ever. See MY point? Things change with time, accept that.

-The car has 80s technology.
-The car rust easily.
-You can blow headgaskets constantly if you don't watch the heat.
-The cars are loud and squeak constantly inside.

^- Just like every other car in this world too. Everything rusts, blows gaskets, etc. THats a part of life. While we're at it, all of these cars actually have 30's technology. Like Vtec for example, you think honda invented it? Nope, it was invented in the 30's, but wasnt regarded as good at that time, mainly due to technological inferiority, well.. what can you say?

They drift heavy 4 door cars like Cefiro's, Celsior's, Soarers, and Mark 2s, and they are all 3000lb+. Why not just get a manual 5.0 Mustang and drift? It's cheap, RWD <- AND big cars eat alot more gasoline than small cars. Our 3000lb Volvo eats three times as much gas as my corolla and twice as much as our mercedes. The more you race it, the more its gonna cost you. Good luck finding a Cefiro or Celsior or Chaser MK-II in the USA.


EDIT: just using honda as an example as you were...

[Jzs147-RR]

Very simple..

1-The car is old so insurance is peanuts
2-body is old so perfect sleeper
3-its a Toyota so the engine is strong and has pep (my engine has 300 000km on it and still runs fine)
4-it outhandles stock Integras and shivics (drifting the real way)
5-easy to repair
6-Its a light RWD no more like it are made
7-not a honda
8-does not have vtec
9-does not need stickers to go fast

[Lafora]

why do i want one now?

cuz NOW is the first time i could afford one myself

6 years ago i was 17. if you had 5 digit savings when YOU were 17 then props to you.

but i wasn't so lucky..so i had to wait a few years

regarding the point where you say the car has 1980s technology.

the car of my dreams is the Caterham 7

that car has 1960s technology

it runs CIRICLES around some of the VERY best of cars today

that shows you something about old technology doesn't it. i'm not saying all older tech is better than new ones..but just cuz it's old, doesn't mean it's a piece of junk

[wunderboy]

When I first bought mine, I didnt know of this site, the AE86's history, or InitialD. I bought it cause it was a light, RWD import, with a comfortable cockpit, and a DOHC. Any auto enthusiest would purchase a car like this for under $1000 wouldnt they? Add to that that its not a civc, or prelude, like all my friends had, and I think it speaks for itself.

[Fuel Injected]

The number one reason I want one is insurance and the FR layout...id rather have an S13 since it comes with an LSD stock, and will be years newer however my monthly rates will be shitty since Im 21 and already own an MR2 turbo.

Plus I also love everything about the car...the retro styling, high reving N/A DOHC 4A-G engine, RWD layout, toyota namebrand, lightweight etc...I can go on and on

I think your post is overly pessimistic, plus theres nothing wrong with wanted one after seeing Initial D provided the buyer actually researches the car and appreciates what it really is.

[boroEF]

the increasing growth of the ae86 popularity astounds me as well. as you said, 10 years ago not many people knew or cared about the car except for a few hardcore enthusiasts. only they knew what an ae86 was, the potential and what it is good for. now after so long, everyone and their dog knows what an 86 is, csi keeps calling them "hachi's"(8?!?!? wtf) and people want to buy them with either dreams of drifting or want to be like takimi....of course there are a select few which are still true enthusiasts and have no intentions of being a poser of any sort..

ae86 always had it's publicity prior to initial d through option magazing, best motoring etc....but it has never grown so much until the initial d craze started up...

in any case, i too am baffled at this and point my fingers at the cartoon intial d :p

edit: if i wanted to drift i'd get an s13 and pop on a type x front end....that's sick....

[Lafora]

shaun:

you gotta drive it to appreicate the true beauty in the balance of the car.

no you ain't driving mine i like my cars right side up :p

[boroEF]

Originally posted by Lafora
shaun:

you gotta drive it to appreicate the true beauty in the balance of the car.

no you ain't driving mine i like my cars right side up :p

i understand where u are coming from but can u explain about the "true beauty in the balance of the car"??? it has been said by both you and sam that the ae92 handles more neutral and thus stock to stock, 92 would be quicker at a track...and yet u talk about the true beauty of the balance of the ae86.....explain!!!

[ek-9]

I want to be Takumi and am currently looking for a job as a over night tofu delivery boy. I'm buying my dad some tofu making lessons, getting him to smoke and asking him to live the rest of his life with his eyes closed. I punch my best friend repeatedly in his face to fatten up those lips and my girlfriend is dressed like a japanese school girl.

Is that what you wanted to hear?

[rezzle]

I own a 92 GTS, FF. I realize this is a car not in the 'year range' you mentioned but it is similar enough in most respects for me to get mad and post a response.


It just so happens to be a personal choice and as there are different people in the world there will be different opinions.

Let me tell you my opinion and in doing so I will change your opinion of the AE86 and in my case the AE92.
To that of mine.
One of love admiration adoration and wonder.

I payed more than average for mine, but I just happen to be a toyota 'lover' and I bought the first one that came my way with a decent body. Mine also happened to have a supercharger. With a rolling start I have not lost to any stock car I have come across, FORD V6 mustang, Eagle Talson TSI, Bonniville 3.8, the list goes on. Yet surely some day something with what you call 'new' technology will beat me. Hasn't happened yet. Oh ya I can turn with all of these cars too, with its 'old' technology.

Econobox? I think not.
Here are some of the stock features of my car.
Power windows
tilt
power door locks
4 wheel disk brakes
front and rear sway bar
factory alloy rims
deep comfortable adjustable bucket seats they fit me fine I am 5' 9" and 180 Lbs.
16V DOHC 7500 rpm engine
Power sunroof
Responsive power steering.


Ugly 80's? Tell your freinds to take a flying leap.
Honda copied this bodystyle with the prelude 10 years after Toyota designed it. Why? because it was Ugly? no because it is sporty.

Might be a personal preference but I love the looks.


Head gaskets blow? WTF are you talking about? The only way you can blow one of these babies is to run the thing outta coolant. If you do that then you are an idiot and deserve it. Formula AtlanTic race cars use a nearly identical setup to what is in these babies STOCK AND THEY RUN TO 9000 rpm! The engine is tough the rods and bottom end are strong enough to handle up to 250 HP you do that to a 'new technology honda' without shot peening the rods and soon they will bend. Trust me I have held one of those honda rods in my hands.

I am probably going to buck the trend here because of my age but I don't like Anime I have never watched Initial D nor do I care to. So I have no idea what you are talking about here.

Price? Blue book prices still show a 1989 corolla is 3k US less than a 944. I owned 3 European cars in my time. Have you? Have you ever had a car that had no less than THREE $189.00 universial joints??? Have you ever tried to insure a European sports car?? DUDE there is more to value than the initial price and for what you get the initial price of these cars is pretty good.


Don't knock it till you try it. The AE86 and even the AE92's are Amazing and RELIABLE I say reliable because they are not driven like a sunday milk run civic they ! compel ! you to DRIVE them like they were designed to be run, hard in,and hard out of the corners that 4age revving to 7500 RPM over and over. They take it they love it. Try that with a 'new' technology Neon or Mistubishi V6 and you WILL be changing the head gasket every 80,000 KM. (Just changed one in my Niece's neon three weeks ago now that I think about it.)

RWD.
I am not an inital D freak i am too old to car and have driven my fair share of autocrosses slaloms and rallies to give a shit about drifting. I know when it should be done (not often) and its usefullness (very if needed). These models of corolla's FF or the FR are great handling cars. I will out-turn most any RWD car made on a tight slalom course European, American, or Japanese. Except for a well setup AE-86 which will be a close match. Go figure. On the local race track here a modified AE86 held the MODIFIED CLASS SOLO1 (high speed slalom) track record for something like 3 years running. That included racing against your venerable porshe 944. Mustang 5 litres, Lola's, and Nissan 300z's.

Oh ya forgot to mention....

This site the one you are checking out .. is chock full of hardcore TOYOTA enthusiasts and we do indeed KNOW what these little sweethearts have to offer.

Don't knock it till you try it. Get behind the wheel of one, you'll get the Toyota feeling.

[Lafora]

Originally posted by boroEF


i understand where u are coming from but can u explain about the "true beauty in the balance of the car"??? it has been said by both you and sam that the ae92 handles more neutral and thus stock to stock, 92 would be quicker at a track...and yet u talk about the true beauty of the balance of the ae86.....explain!!!

i dunno how to explain.

just feel i'm physically connected to my car (and to a certain extent, mentally as well...fucker just knows what i want it to do) when i'm at the track.

let's say the funny left hander in nelson

if you botch the entry, what do you do to correct it?

if i see my car facing the exit too early, i just mash the gas and she'll point right where she's suppose to point again.

i don't think FFs have THAT capability yet at least not the ones i've seen last time that were at nelson.

[boroEF]

Originally posted by Lafora




i don't think FFs have THAT capability yet at least not the ones i've seen last time that were at nelson.

dohhhhh

that's why u make sure u take the right line..or ur fucked and u gotta let off the gas boooo

but i gotta yell at this jeff guy too:
blowing head gaskets? excuse me...toyota gaskets are just as strong, if not more durable than honda gaskets.....if anything, hondas are more prone to blowing out the gaskets just because of the fact that they gotta rev high to make power...so u gotta rev that sucker really high....hard on head gasket :p

by "ae86 not being reliable" ppl mean they just gotta fix things...it doesnt mean that the motor brakes down like a ford or something....it's nearing 20 years old....what do u expect? u think brakes wont seize, suspension wont blow and the car wont rust?

the almighty honda has those problems too ya know

[Chris Corolla S]

What they said ^^

[Tommi Tiardi]

Well, to be honest to you all

Yes, is the initial D thing, dammit, that's what it is!!!!!

my car is going to have a 20valve dry sump group A 240hp guys

:p :p