2000 engine blown, will 2003+ engine work?

[tastyratz]

so due to previous owner negligence my 2000 engine is toast. I can get a 2003+ engine for the same price with the better intake system and more hp. Is there anything else that might stop me from just dropping in the newer 1zz? any other changes that could be a problem? I know its been mentioned that it uses a smaller starter - if I use my 2000 tranny will that matter? flywheels different? Will my 2000 ecu and harness control it fine?

Anyone else done it?

[daniel2002p]

i think they still use the 1.8 in the 00 but im no expert in that year

D

[01loadedLE]

I dont have any answers, but what happened to the engine and how many miles were on it?

[tastyratz]

160k miles

This is a repaste of a post from another board:

I dont know what to think of this.

My DD is a 2000 corolla with the 1zzfe. I have had what sounds like a nasty valve tap that started about 6k miles ago. One day driving it like I always do, like a redheaded stepchild it started on the highway. Check my oil - all gone a short time after a recent change. took 5 quarts that night.

The tap would only tap on light accel - heavy or decel were fine. Car had alot of hesitation and power loss. Started drinking oil like it was gas and went through about 7 quarts in that 7k miles. Tried pushing the teardown off till the 240 was on the road but she didnt make it.

Saturday it got significantly worse and loud over the course of say 50 miles or less. Out of nowhere it would tap at all times including accel and decel. I started hearing a sputtering sound like a real nasty exhaust leak at the same time. At that point I had 1 gear less power feel (I.E. 2nd felt like 3rd) Driving home it just suddenly got real real loud and it lost so much power that it couldnt sustain 60mph. I shuddered off to the side of the road and it made a terrible squeel that was like a high pitched metal dragged on metal sound. Towed it home.

Spent the last several days Ripping off the head of a mechanics worst nightmares design (pray you never need to work on one of these). After having to literally strip everything from the engine to get it off This is what I see: (mind you I am sure the puddles of coolant and oil smears are just from the removal and werent just sitting there.)



phone pics are the best I have for right now

Now in the cylinder on that piston is what appears to be big chunky flakes of carbon about 2 sheets of paper thick. Tons of it fills the thing but that coulda fallen off when I hit stuff with a hammer. All the cylinders looked like they had alot of the chunky carbon nasties..

I didn't see any piston damage that stuck out like a sore thumb when I was in there. Valves werent sticking out at all sorts of crooked angles.

Exhaust valves were white white and almost look like little blisters. Exhaust header is black for the first inch then whitish with a ting of yellow all the way down I can see including on the o2 sensor but I dont see white at the tailpipe.

White residue first thing I think of is coolant burning - but the radiator is topped off, I haven't noticed a wet exhaust or almondy smell, and I haven't had to add a drop since I got the car.

Plugs look pretty normal to me.
Looking now at the overflow tank I noticed it was fairly low. Whether that was always low or not I do not know, I dont remember what it was when I got the car.

I have since pulled the pan and havent found anything nasty in there. I cant find any conclusive evidence as to what has happened, therefore I want to replace the whole thing. If I came across a straight answer on the teardown then thats 1 thing, but if I dont find it when I am in there - nothing will stop history from repeating itself

[Mayur]

It will work. It has been done before.

[REN69]

Yes.. but he will need the full harness and ECU, 01-02 1ZZFEs had VVTi, the 1998-00 didn't, so at least the ECU will be different.

I'm sure someone else in here has a little more experience with these motors than me, they'll eventually answer.

[Buurin]

Originally Posted by REN69

Yes.. but he will need the full harness and ECU, 01-02 1ZZFEs had VVTi, the 1998-00 didn't, so at least the ECU will be different.

I'm sure someone else in here has a little more experience with these motors than me, they'll eventually answer.

You can forget about any 05+ 1ZZs thanks to drive by wire throttle.

Actually 00 has VVT-i, but I know nothing about running a 03-04 1ZZ with a 00 ECU.

Yes, get the entire engine wire, but watch the huge grommet; it may not fit the original hole. And you may have to fabricate a bracket to mount the new ECU. No guarantee it will mechanically fit a 00. And you may be looking at a fair bit of repinning wires. Download the 04 repair manual floating out there somewhere. It helps.

But before you go that far tastyratz, consider that the 03+ 1ZZ is a little more peaky than those in 00-02. Gains in torque is very, very minimal and may need to be revved higher to get it. OTOH some more tuning was done to give it better gas mileage.

[tastyratz]

00+ had vvti and coil on plug (I believe earlier 8th gens did not) so the wiring should be the same.

I have a friend with a 2005 which I am driving right now while I fix mine since he let me borrow it. I am going to do a close examination between the 2 and assume that if its no different on the 05 it hasnt changed from 00 to 05. Mechanically they should be no different, so running it with the 00 ecu shouldnt be a problem unless they had different size injectors - in that instance I would just swap the 00 ones in. If any sensors have changed then that would make an issue running the engine. Since everything appears the same outside I will assume I can swap any sensors on the engine if need be.

With the idea of them being more peaky - I actually found his car to always have more low end torque than mine so if anything I think of it as the opposite. I will welcome the extra few horse and possible better gas mileage. I will be doing some closer looking over the next few hours between our cars

[REN69]

It did change in 05 the 03-04 are similar, 05-08 are different.

[tastyratz]

well I tore everything apart yesterday and it didnt seem like there were any overly significant differences. 05 had the drive by wire and it looks like it just has some different coolant and vacuum hose routing where it attaches to the intake manifold - big deal. I ordered the engine this morning from the junkyard and they will be dropping it off. Maybe I will get lucky and have it in by this weekend

[REN69]

Nice.. let us know how the project goes.

[tastyratz]

More work last night. Man the stock 03 exhaust manifold is CRAP! what a terrible design (albeit cheap) I think I should gain a few horse just running the stock 00 manifold. I ported the front of it out nice too which looks to gain a little bit.

Upon closer examination it looks like all the vacuum lines and coolant lines should take care of themself. Started bolts up and fits, alternator/power steering should be fine.

I have found 2 differences that matter but not much. The head has a sensor between the larger and smaller coolant outputs on the drivers side - its held on with a 19mm base and threaded in. The 03 has a 2 wire square plug and the 00 has a 2 wire. Whoopie I should be able to unscrew it and swap them.

Also,
The knock sensors have changed. the 00 has a single wire resonant type sensor, and The 03 has a flat response type with a hole in the center and is mounted to a stud thats epoxied into the hole the 00 used. Blocks appear to be the same. To use the 00 setup I found a boss almost the exact side I need towards the front of the engine and a few inches lower. I will just ream it to the right size and tap it for the knock sensor. Its already so close toyota practically did the work for me.

1 last thing, the intake. Because the 00 had a MUCH MUCH smaller throttle body it had a smaller intake tract. To take advantage of the new manifold I will be picking up a 3" intake system designed for the 03+ and adapting it to work.

operation driveway drop should commence this weekend if all goes as planned.

[tastyratz]

so far so good...
[bitch]
Man working on this car is a load of crap, I hope I never have to do anything again. Hardest car to do almost anything on out of the MANY MANY cars I have had, crappy design in terms of serviceability. Why did you not think anyone would ever work on your cars toyota?
[/bitch]

Noticed when my friend pointed it out the other day that the port walls are actually pretty crappy, they seemed fine at first. Spend 1-2 hours doing a full port cleanup on intake AND exhaust. Looks smooth as butta now. Did it all on the engine with the valve area stuffed with paper towels and vacuumed out the metal shavings after I was done. Couldnt get in to do bowl work but it was a very simple cleanup otherwhise. Also ported the stock 2000 exhaust header at the top since the welds were fat and intrusive. Couldnt get in by the collector to well with the tools I had. Between everything the porting should have some nice gains.

So I have the old engine out and the new one in. Havent hooked anything up yet. That hole for the knock sensor was indeed very close to 7/16" so I drilled it with a drill then tapped it 12x1.25mm for the knock sensor. Goes in like a charm. Coolant sensor came right out with a wrench and I swapped it with the old one.

Stock mounts for 2003 engine passenger side will not line up by about 1-2 inches. Had to change both top half and engine side half with the 2000 mount. Throttle cable matches up, vac lines appear so far pretty self explanatory. Engine is physically in place and bolted to the transmission. Just have to do the electricals tomorrow and it should drive by the night. I am using factory 2000 ecu and wiring.

Very easy just in terms of adapting the 03 on the 00 chassis. Since the 03 is rated 5hp more yet it has an absolutely terrible exhaust manifold design I suspect that the manifold alone might be worth a good 8 horse gain on the 00's. Considering the 03 mani is probably something you can get on ebay for less than 50 bux shipped it might be a simple mod worth looking into for current 98-02 owners. The manifold is very easy to swap and only a few minutes, the throttle is 2.25 on the old intake and 2.75 on the new one. Also has a clean throttle cable bracket that eliminates the 00 rubber bushing getting in the way of throttle feel.

I guess it all only matters once I fire it up though.

[Buurin]

Originally Posted by tastyratz

so far so good...
Since the 03 is rated 5hp more yet it has an absolutely terrible exhaust manifold design I suspect that the manifold alone might be worth a good 8 horse gain on the 00's. Considering the 03 mani is probably something you can get on ebay for less than 50 bux shipped it might be a simple mod worth looking into for current 98-02 owners.

I thought you said the 03 manifold are worse than a 00 manifold? Now you're saying us gen 8 ppl can gain a few horses by swapping in a (ported) 03 manifold?

[tastyratz]

03 HEADER is terrible. 00 gen has a much better 4-1 exhaust manifold design. 03 has a better designed INTAKE manifold which makes more power and has a more appropriately sized throttle body. I am saying using the 03 intake on the 00 chassis will net more power.

Big issue I bumped into however. It looks like I cant runn the manifold the way I am right now anyways :-(

The intake manifold goes in and is much nicer, however factory 00 radiator has a center outlet up top which wont allow the radiator hose because it is literally barely touching the intake.
Looks like its not good for any cheap easy gains after all. Im looking at the possibility of running a radiator from another car. 03+ radiators are too large and wont fit this chassis as far as I can tell. 91 sentra SE-R radiators look like they are appropriately dimensioned with usable outlets if I were to go that route. I will not confirm nor deny at this point.

Its official, the car starts and runs. Its running like crap right now, but my buddy after realized when putting the intake manifold on he didnt put the gasket so it could be that which is hurting it.

I also found out the hard way that the 2003 fuel line that clips onto the firewall is NOT the same clasp system as the 2000. Thought my buddy clipped it on but it was sitting on mock- after running for about 5 min the line popped off and sprayed fuel. A closer inspection had me get to that conclusion. I dont know if the rail or the injectors were different, car didnt run any different when I swapped the whole rail/inj./line setup and it looked physically the same so I would say it probably is the same minus the connector. Tomorrow I will be in search of a radiator no more than 27" wide with a driver side top nipple and a center or passenger side bottom nipple