4age/4agze? - Toyota Nation Forum : Toyota Car and Truck Forums

AreSTG · 03-02-2005, 12:44 PM

hi guys dont know the last time i posted here(if ever) but when i went to register found out my e-mail address and username were in use(means i registerd sometime in the past)

anyway, i am gunna buy an AE86 for my next project car and go ALL out on it.

my plans are 4age, and put on a turbo. gunna be completely re-working the engine P&P, literally everyhting i can do to the engine.

what im wondering is, are the 4age and 4agze internals the same? or has the 4agze been beefed up?

i was planning on just useing the engine i get with the car(maybe buying another and keeping original as a backup parts engine), and started thinking that maybe the 4agze has a stronger build, better capable of handling high boost form a turbo(it did have a s/c).

so if anyone could state some basic differences and pro's and con's(if any) i would greatly appreciate it.

Tim

lifeisviewtiful · 03-02-2005, 01:07 PM

i don't know too much abou the internals of the engine. if you get a 4agze it will most likely come with a supercharger. why would you want to swap it with a t/c.

heh they both have their pros and cons but here's an article that goes into a little detail about the 2 engines. but hey who cares which setup you go with, they are both beautiful engines and they both will give you decent speed, there a simple factors in place which will determine which setup you prefer(transmission type, driver application, speed preference) they both rock.

AreSTG · 03-02-2005, 01:28 PM

yea, i know the 4agze comes with a s/c. i am just a turbo guy, what my last car had, and what i wanna do on the corolla i get. The only reason i'll buya 4agze other than use a 4age is if its different inside, i mean not like i probably wont be replaceing pistons and stuff, but if its stronger right down to rod's and stuff or cam's, or even the whole bottom end, i'll go for it

TrentAE92 · 03-02-2005, 01:42 PM

I'm not an expert, but the 4AGZE has a Beefier Block, Diffrent Crank Shaft, and Better Lower Compresion Pistons which you will need anyway. Later, you could always install a bigger cam shaft, and an engine management system when going to a turbo.

AreSTG · 03-02-2005, 01:52 PM

kool thanks, if its stronger then im going for it. Some one on my paseo site told me they saw it comes with forged pistons, that'd kickass

toyotaspeed90 · 03-02-2005, 02:43 PM

ok... no

the 88+ (some 87 mr2's) bigport 4age and all smallport 4age's have the same block.... for the most part... which is a 7 rib block..... the gze, however, comes with oil squirters.

the later 4age and 4agze's use the same crank with 42mm journals.... the rods might be beefier, but i'm not 100% sure on that one (i would be surprised if they actually are different)....

the pistons are different.... the stock 4age ones are cast..... the 4agze are forged and lower compression (8.0:1 for the US and early jdm gze..... 8.9:1 for the later JDM only models)

AreSTG · 03-02-2005, 07:21 PM

a guy on another site i frequent foudn thsi for me, and added the seperate line at then end oto about the horsepower:

" The 4A-GZE represents Toyota's first ever attempt at designing a supercharged engine. The supercharger design is roots type which is cooled/lubricated with its own special supercharger oil. The boosted air is cooled by an Nippon Denso air-to-air intercooler mounted right underneath the engine cover's (unique to the SC) cooling vent. When the 4A-GZE was introduced, Toyota added significant strengthening to the block so that it would be able to handle the rigors of forced induction. It has extra ribs and a great deal more metal all over the block. In addition to this stronger block the 4A-GZE had 2 extra things added to it to make it different from the 87+ 4A-GE engines, that being Forged Pistons and Oil Jets to cool them. Surprisingly the camshafts from the 4A-GE are used, but they work quite well. "

there is also a later version of the 4agze with the MAP air sensor that makes 160hp - 15hp more than the previous

89yotarollagts · 03-02-2005, 07:59 PM

if i were u id go with the 4AGZE u can get quite a bit of power out of it as is very good motor im actually looking forward to doing one of these swaps this summer so good luck with your project

AreSTG · 03-02-2005, 08:01 PM

ty, gl with yours too.

i guesse even for the piece of mind its got some stronger parts should be worth it.

are you gunna use the s/c? or are u thinking of some type of setup like im planning with a turbocharger?

89yotarollagts · 03-02-2005, 08:28 PM

id like to keep the supercharger im not looken to make alot of power maby 200 at the most

toyotaspeed90 · 03-02-2005, 09:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AreSTG

a guy on another site i frequent foudn thsi for me, and added the seperate line at then end oto about the horsepower:

" The 4A-GZE represents Toyota's first ever attempt at designing a supercharged engine. The supercharger design is roots type which is cooled/lubricated with its own special supercharger oil. The boosted air is cooled by an Nippon Denso air-to-air intercooler mounted right underneath the engine cover's (unique to the SC) cooling vent. When the 4A-GZE was introduced, Toyota added significant strengthening to the block so that it would be able to handle the rigors of forced induction. It has extra ribs and a great deal more metal all over the block. In addition to this stronger block the 4A-GZE had 2 extra things added to it to make it different from the 87+ 4A-GE engines, that being Forged Pistons and Oil Jets to cool them. Surprisingly the camshafts from the 4A-GE are used, but they work quite well. "

there is also a later version of the 4agze with the MAP air sensor that makes 160hp - 15hp more than the previous

the 7 rib block was used in regular 4age's as well..... the other guy lives in seclusion....lol

the map sensor didn't change the power from 145 to 165 (which actually is a 20hp gain).... the japanese later versions came with a smaller 10psi pulley on the supercharger.... then they switched over to the smallport head and used the dli & map sensor, gaining another supposed 10hp (175hp)

i do have experience with these engines:

AreSTG · 03-02-2005, 11:30 PM

k,

so the only difference im seeing with the z is oil suirters, forged pistons with lower compression, and Maybe rods?

hmmm, whats the compression on a 4age compared to the z, really much different?

and i might as well ask your opinion.

is it worth it to buy a 4agze if im not using the s/c? or the same as if i use my 4age? rememebr im gunna have the engine completely! worked over.

4Aaron GE · 03-02-2005, 11:59 PM

If you get a GZE, you can sell the SC setup and grab an intake manifold from wherever. It saves you the trouble of finding comparable parts in the aftermarket (which would cost a lot more money anyway).

Largeport 4A-GEs have 9.4:1 compression
Smallport 4A-GEs have 10.3:1 compression
Largeport 4A-GZEs have 8.0:1 compression
Smallport 4A-GZEs have 8.9:1 compression

AreSTG · 03-03-2005, 02:03 AM

anyone have a picture of the intake mani? never dealth w/ a s/c'd engine and didnt knwo it was different

toyotaspeed90 · 03-03-2005, 05:17 AM

well it really is worth it to buy the gze lowerend.... the oil squirters are a big help with forced induction cars... and at the price you have to pay for aftermarket forged pistons you can pick up an entire gze which has forged pistons anyways

bigport: 9.8:1
smallport: 10.3:1

gze (us): 8.0:1
gze (jdm): 8.9:1