4AFE head swap - Toyota Nation Forum : Toyota Car and Truck Forums

1992corolla · 07-07-2005, 01:40 AM

I decided that i'm gonna go ahead and just change the head of my 4AFE with a 4AGE head and i already know about losing compression and all that but my new question is, can't i just use 4AGE pistons and the compression will be normal??? please let me know. thanks

toyotaspeed90 · 07-07-2005, 01:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1992corolla

I decided that i'm gonna go ahead and just change the head of my 4AFE with a 4AGE head and i already know about losing compression and all that but my new question is, can't i just use 4AGE pistons and the compression will be normal??? please let me know. thanks

don't waste your time.... just swap the whole thing

1992corolla · 07-07-2005, 01:44 AM

ok i don't have the money to swap the whole thing. Thats why i'm asking these questions. I actually want to know if it works perfectly not just another "just swap the whole engine" answer like i got with the other post i put

toyotaspeed90 · 07-07-2005, 01:52 AM

i speak from personal experience..... it really wasn't that much to swap the whole thing.....

i spent a whopping $400 on the motor itself....... i could have stopped there and thrown it together in the car as is and let it run on a non modifed 4afe ecu.... however, i didn't.... i modified the ecu, added a full header, high flow cat, full exhaust, MSD ignition (6al, blaster 2, & 8910) which is now out of the car..... new plugs, wires, thermostat, timing belt, serpentine belts, cap, rotor, 1 new sensor, new gts radiator, oil cooler (still not installed), adjustable fuel pressure regulator & gauge, flywheel, all oils & coolant of course...... that all was less than another $800.... and if you consider what was done, that isnt' bad at all....

even going from a 4afe to throwing a 4age head onto a 4afe block you will have all of the annoyances of a 4age swap and much less of an outcome...... you need to worry about if you want to keep the PS & how to mount the alt (they are on opposite sides of the motor and cannot be kept in their respective places very simply... this was something i looked into)..... the wiring is a little different on the 4age head..... that's where most of the wiring actually is..... you will need a 4age distributor that will work with your 4afe ecu.....

and i can go on & on & on...... like i said...... just swap the whole thing

read up:
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/219038/9

1992corolla · 07-07-2005, 01:59 AM

the pw and the altenator aren't gonna be that hard to make it work. And i got the 4AGE ecu and wirring harness so i don't have to worry about that. Thats why i'm just asking if i could use the 4AGE pistons on my 4AFE block

toyotaspeed90 · 07-07-2005, 02:07 AM

it's not quite known..... the later 4afe's used a 7 rib block... but had a 40mm rod journal (the earlier 4age 5 rib block had the same.... but the 7 rib block 4age used a 42mm journal)..... so, if the wrist pins match then i guess you could.... however, i doubt it..... pistons (new) are $200 anyways.... (i'm looking to do a rebuild... so i've been pricing stuff out), that's 1/2 the price of an entire motor.....

like i said.... PS and alt are on opposite sides of the motor.... the upper brackets come off of the head on the 4afe..... and are in different spots & angles than a 4age...... like i said... i looked into all of this (read my swap page... i go into detail about this).

Kwanza · 07-07-2005, 02:19 AM

I don't get why some people think headswaps are easier than simply buying a complete motor. AND... 4AFE's had 18mm wrist pins... so later 20mm 4AGE pistons aren't gonna work. You could use the older 9:4:1 comp pistons (relatively cheap... anything highcomp with 18mm wrists is aftermarket/custom and are $$$)... but seriously. Why do you think it's gonna be easier and cheaper to tear a motor apart and then rebuild it... rather than simply buying a complete motor? I know for sure you're not gonna buy all-new engine parts... so do you have a general idea how much it costs to rebuild an engine? Let's say you reuse the old bearings and torque something slightly off and end up with a rod knock?

1992corolla · 07-07-2005, 02:20 AM

I read your swap too, and i'm not gonna buy them new cause i already got them from a 4AGE. I got a 4AGE for free the only problem was that it ran out of oil so the crankshaft and the cylender walls are all scratched up. But the head and pistons are fine. Thats why i'm asking if it'll fit. I have a 1992 corolla and this motor came off a 1989 Corolla GTS which is the Big port TVIS 4AGE.

1992corolla · 07-07-2005, 02:26 AM

i've rebuild plenty of engines before and its not hard at all. I took off the head of my 4AFE a while back just to have it lowered .30mm over to raise the compression ratio and put it back on the same day. These motors are really easy to take apart and put back together, especially since they're ob1 they don't have that many wires as ob2 do. But i got no idea if the 4AGE pistons will fit thats why i'm just asking. I don't want to hear "its easier to just swap the whole motor" cause i don't want to spend money on just a 4AGE, i much rather just wait and put a 4AGZE instead. But for now just i'm just gonna mess around with my 4AFE as much as i can. So if anyone DOES know if the 4AGE pistons will fit in a 4AFE block please reply

***REN69*** · 07-07-2005, 06:22 AM

4AGE pistons WON'T WORK ON A 4AFE! does that answer your question? They will work on a 7AFE block but NOT ON A 4AFE! I hope this makes it clearer to you.

With that said, save your money for a GZE or 20V swap.

Flashmn · 07-07-2005, 06:54 AM

Quote:

4AGE pistons WON'T WORK ON A 4AFE!

Supposedly they will, but the compression ratio is a guessing game

1992corolla · 07-07-2005, 09:28 AM

well i measured it all out and guess what, THEY WILL WORK. I don't even know why i asked. The only one that seems to really know their shit is Flashman and that guy from Phoenix Tuning

***REN69*** · 07-07-2005, 10:32 AM

Go for it.. by the time you're done, you could've spent all that time and money on a 20V or 4AGZE or even half of that to get another 16V 4AGE.

1992corolla · 07-07-2005, 10:46 AM

If you can find me a 20V or a 4AGZE for around $100 then yeah i'll just swap it out cause thats all the money i'm gonna end up spending doing this. Head gasket was around $25, intake manifold and exhaust manifold were both together for $30, new crankshaft bearings and new piston rings were $65 plus tax for both. So what did i end up spending around $120. So no, doing this is alot cheaper

toyotaspeed90 · 07-07-2005, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1992corolla

well i measured it all out and guess what, THEY WILL WORK. I don't even know why i asked. The only one that seems to really know their shit is Flashman and that guy from Phoenix Tuning

what did you measure? the bores are the same, yes..... but wrist pins & location of the wrist pins might be different..... along with the connecting rod length might be different..... i've heard you can use an early (pre 87) 4age crank in a 4afe (in fact, i've thought about doing this for an all-out n/a motor).... but you would then need 4age rods & pistons (both pre 87).

you probably shouldn't be comparing board members when others are trying to help you..... you asked a simple question & i'm telling you FROM EXPERIENCE.... i have a 90... had a 4afe... have a 4age.... i've been there

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1992corolla

If you can find me a 20V or a 4AGZE for around $100 then yeah i'll just swap it out cause thats all the money i'm gonna end up spending doing this. Head gasket was around $25, intake manifold and exhaust manifold were both together for $30, new crankshaft bearings and new piston rings were $65 plus tax for both. So what did i end up spending around $120. So no, doing this is alot cheaper

HG must not be a toyota unit (those run around $60).... i wouldn't use a non toyota gasket (that's probably the only thing i'm gonna go toyota on for my 4ag rebuild)..... make sure you get the t-vis plate as well, otherwise you'll be even less impressed down low...... & those bearings & ring sets are exaggerated.... the only non toyota stuff i would use is Clevite or Beck/Arnley... and i actually have a PRINTOUT right in front of me from my work (since i plan to do a rebuild here soon).... for rings, crank bearings, rod bearings, & one other set of bearings are $155 before tax...... and before my discount.... (not toyota parts.... those i had priced today at over $800)

it may be cheaper.... but it may not last a month either...... i've learned the hard way on both cars to take my time & not go the cheap way...... yes, both run & run good.... but they both have HUGE issues.... and i didn't go as cheap as you did